Get this disgusting abomination away from me. My real king has small breast with perky pink nipples.
Art thou feeling regret for settling for an inferior Saber?
Fuck off, Nero. You will never be a fraction of perfection as my glorious Arturia.
>Saber's gonna job like shit all through UBW
>The 16 year old high school kid is gonna come off way more competent
My angel will always be relevant even a decade later with out a dedicated anime Fate. (Fuck you Deen shit doesn't count). Your clone will collect dust on two PSP games.
>mfw this board will soon be filled with saber appreciation threads every day
I want Lancer threads everyday, because he is the best servant and a total bro.
But I'm posting best Type Moon though?
But that's not Arcueid.
I'm down for a Lancer thread
In the VN he didn't seem competent, just lucky and traced the right things at the right time. He could barely match Souichiro and his steel hard murder-fists.
Ufotable will do a good job with Shirou's fights, I hope. I really like seeing him struggle and win.
He just got the jump on her, she didn't expect him to move in such a way (martial arts magic). I think it was commented if there was a re-match, Saber would annihilate him since she's already seen his one and only trick.
Clone Wars are much worse. It's amazing how much Nero and Arturia fags hate each other.
But Rin herself was a Saberfag. She even got to do what Saberfags can only dream of.
>In the VN he didn't seem competent, just lucky and traced the right things at the right time. He could barely match Souichiro and his steel hard murder-fists
Except in Sparks Liner High
Saberfags hate nerofags for watering down saber, nerofags have chips on their shoulder the size of russia to prove that an imitation can be better than the real thing. It'll only end when fate/extra is forgotten, which it mostly is already.
I don't think Fate/Extra is forgotten. Especially when CCC translation finishes in 2020, there will be much to talk about. Also, there are lot of Nero figurines coming.
>which it mostly is already.
Shit is mentioned at least once every thread. Extra and CCC will never be forgotten, it's like if you hated Ataraxia or Tsukihime and thought "Eventually it'll be forgotten", but pieces of it will always remain in the forefront.
>Caster is still best Extra
Not when Assassin is still around
Bitches need to not be going on about how Nero a shit because "She's stealing the screen time of real Saber, she's just an inferior model".
Urobuchi says she's way more of a Gilgamesh clone in terms of personality, and Nasu says she was designed to be a response to Alexander from Zero in terms of personality. She's a fourth type of tyrant, who Nasu admits "This is what Alex would probably be like if I was writing him" as he wanted to challenge it a bit. She's not a Saber clone at all aside from appearance, she's not watered down Saber, she's an entirely different shit from the start who they just slapped a similar appearance on for some reason.
Frankly it would be odd if you thought they personalities were the same at all, or that she's just diet Saber.
>Shirou gets raped every fight
>Gets pushed to the brink of death like 20 times
>Somehow manages to win with an asspull every time
>Servants are supposedly extremely powerful and quick
>Can't even kill a highschool student
Wait, people actually like this?
Assuming that Anon meant summoning for whatever flavor of the Holy Grail War it is this week, being alive doesn't mean you can't be summoned.
Flatchested Saber was still alive when she was summoned for both the Fourth and Fifth HGW.
>>Somehow manages to win with an asspull every time
How about you read the VN. Shirou dies 90% of the time in utterly hilarious ways. Pick the cowardly choice that seems like it'll keep you alive, some servant or illya will get pissed off and kill you for being a pansy on your way back home.
This is exactly the secondary we were most afraid of. Both those questions are absolutely retarded if you had read the VN, or werent an impatient shitter who expects to be spoonfed every detail of the story immediately.
Cool story bro, but how about
you read the VN?
She was alive, barely, but alive. Was a special case because she made a deal with the Grail, hence why she couldn't go spirit form.
Isn't the Throne where heroes go to after they expire, and are removed from time and space entirely (to then serve as blueprints for the copies they create for the War)? How would one go there if he never died?
>How would one go there if he never died?
Humanity will all die at some point, the Earth will die at some point, the entire point with how the Throne works as shown in UBW is that it's outside of time itself. It doesn't fucking matter if he's not dead yet, because if he ever dies or if humanity dies, if Notes happens, it doesn't matter how it happens, but if he ever dies then he's in the Throne now.
He will indeed die at some point, he is indeed already in the Throne, unless he made it to Avalon as well. The entire point with Archer's story is that it doesn't matter if he's not dead right now, the Throne is outside of time, as long as he died at some point he is now outside of time itself with the Throne. Thus he can be summoned in a paradox while he was still alive.
SABER IS FUCKING NEO-TYPE-MOON LITTLE WESTERN PIECE OF BRITSHIT FUCK THAT UGLY DEGENERATE SCUM-WHORE AND FUCK ALL NEO-TYPE-MOON SECONDARY SHIT KIDS WHO CONTINUE TO SPAM THAT SHAMEFUL HEMORRHOID WOUND ON TYPE-MOON'S REPUTATION.
DUMB FUCKING SHITFUCKS FUCK YOU TO YOUR SECONDARY SHITHOLE.
>/jp/ was the good part of /a/
/jp/ was and will always be a different type of cancer
I've been here for years, Rin always had a decent following, but something happened a few months before the anime was announced to be UBW. I'm not sure what really caused it aside from the Rin Appreciation Threads, but these days you can't go by without "Best girl, best everything, best everything ever. other girls can't compare, absolute perfection, Rin is the best of all time" these days. The odd part though is that it wasn't even caused by the adaption being announced as UBW, but it was egged on even further because of it until now it's even more of a thing.
There was a time when Saber was the most popular, but I think that stopped some years back. Either way though, Rin types weren't ever rare at all, but they weren't as outspoken as these days. There's a danger in being too outspoken that some have probably realized at this point. Even now I have that one guy's folder from when he posted the UBW patch, that has 700 Rin pics.
I like Rin, but I can't understand how people can gloss over he faults. Her flaws are a large part of what make her interesting as a character. Same with Arturia and Sakura. They all have their dark sides, their secrets. That's what make them so interesting. If the Characters in Fate weren't half as interesting as they are I doubt it would be this popular.
Not sure this one was ever scanned
You realize that not every famous person goes to the throne of heroes right?
And there are plenty of places that you could be trapped in order to get cut off from the throne, right?
Is there a pc version that retains all the blood and violence but has no sex scenes?
I thought they were kind of retarded and just wanted to skip it, like the tentacle rape in muv luv
Kuzuki appreciation thread than
Don't worry bro. Taiga has the best following. There's not a shit-lot of conflict within the group and it doesn't generally interfere with the main heroines discussion
People can like Sakura just fine, though I really enjoyed it more when mentioning her didn't cause a shitstorm or constant wormslut comments that makes normal discussion impossible.
Yes, such a time existed. She was just another Fate girl at one point without all the bullshit we've attached over the years. The most I can aim for is a more neutral outlook on all of this so that we can talk again normally, or just stop taking part in it entirely.
I'm not aiming for a place where everyone loves her, no one would want such a thing to begin with. The only thing to aim for is a world where we can just talk normally at times, and we understand the characters.
>Can I summon Jackie Chan as a servant and his noble phantasm would be a ladder factory reality marble in which he's holding a baby and wants no trouble?
Sure just give it a cool name and a chant to activate it.
I like purple hair and I feel bad for her.
And I respect her for having borne all the horrible things they did to her superbly.
That's Saberfags I can't understand. At least based on zero.
We know she's got a nice ass.
She wanted it.
I've never seen a person actually make that facial expression before.
How does puffing your cheeks out tell the onlooker that you're mildly annoyed at how bashful they're making you feel?
Maybe the Japanese learned it from various blowfish.
If that's true, then that face doesn't convey the above at all when it's clear the Japanese have confused an obvious trait of self-defense as a shy expression.
Maybe in warm waters, the blowfish turn red, thus fooling onlookers into thinking they're blushing.
Or maybe they really ARE blushing, in which case the Japanese are actually right.
I don't dislike Sakura, but I know what she is. She has all the symptoms of a histrionic and emotionally abusive woman. I've had to deal with their deceit first-hand. By the end of HF you do see that, in fact, Sakura is only half-heartedly pretending to be a victim, like many abusive women. They're all born with knowledge of emotional manipulation. They wallow in the muds of self-pity, and slowly their own drama makes them lose compassion for others, to the point that they will hurt others without feeling any guilt. That's Sakura, and abusive women in a nutshell. In fact HF is a very apt analogy for real life. Abusive women wreck stuff because drama in their head. Men may get destroyed for white-knighting.
Really, just say no to deceit, no matter the circumstances. Beware of pity, or you will be the next villain in her story that she needs rescued from. Supporting the downtrodden is very different from actually dating them. Saber is our idealistic childhood fantasy. Rin is the light and candidate for a healthy, uplifting relationship. Sakura is the mud of self-pity and misery that characterizes all torrid, toxic relationships.
That's just rude.
I'd argue yes. I don't think FSN Rin would ever lower herself to become Luvia's maid. However I'm not 100% confident I can argue this point successfully so I am pre-emptively conceding defeat on this point
Reminder that mana dolphins did nothing wrong
I can't say I agree, most people who critique FSn Sakura usually parrot half-assed out of context insults about her character, and really prove that they either are hiding the fact they didn't read the VN, or they are one of those people who blindly hate a character and offer rather hypocritical comments. They'll accept behavior from one character, but not from other characters. It makes character analysis pretty useless.
There are rare people who do have intelligent counterpoints, but those are few and far between. I found Sakura just as fun as either BB or Blossom, and Nasu himself said that BB was primarily based off his version of a mischevious subset of the kouhai archetype, which Sakura showed in both FSN and Hollow, but "mischeviousness" wasn't her primary attribute. That made her a complex character.
Which is why I don't argue personal opinion, and only go for factual errors and hyprocritical statements. For instance, the primary thing is that she is boring, and only cares about cooking and senpai, but she is the only character who actively takes part in a sports club regularly even when her senpai never comes back to it, and even leads it at the end of the original game and the fandisk. Further, her cooking was something shared between her and Shirou, not just something she does to be close to him, the teacher/student dynamic they have is amusing, and she actively tries to better herself in it outside of hanging with Shirou.
Now, it is unfortunate that Nasu didn't show more of her training in magecraft, that is a fair argument in discussion, since there are lots of interesting subplots to explore there: her making friends with a bishop of the Church and her learning witchcraft from Rider both in FSN and Hollow, and how she made/obtained that mystic code she wears in Hollow.
I think Sakura was fucked by the fact that she's only a beast when she's at her worst and that rubs people the wrong way.
"There's no reason to like someone who's terrible at magic in a show about magic."
Nasu also fucked her by getting her Imaginary Numbers turned into a generic Water affinity. She would have been cool as fuck if she could use that.
I'm a Sakura fan and I know that isn't Sakura. You got to stop your generalizations there.
Though I always found it amusing that some try to use that to propel their soapbox about how bad Sakura is, when it's artwork from one of her biggest fans in the TM staff, Koyama. Most don't know that TM has quite a few Sakura fans on staff - OKSG, Koyama, BLACK, and now Aotsuki. It's mentioned in her entry in the dictionary, an excerpt from a 2004 material book.
>implying I have an issue I'm trying to propel
>Not just pointing out the awkwardly consistent regularity to which that picture gets used in defense of FSN Sakura when its not her.
She isn't terrible at magic that is a myth, her magecraft and natural affinity was messed up, there is a difference. There are plenty of scenes she does things Shirou would cross his eyes at, like using remote viewing through Rider to watch over him in the forest, or evading Rin's monitoring familiar and sneaking out of the house to face Zouken. or even stitching her limbs back together not due to AM but her own powers.
See, people get the wrong idea when critiquing her when she was in captivity, whereas in Hollow(where she actually jumped into a sea of Avenger corpses to back up Rider and fought for an hour at the Broad Bridge battle), when she is free or any time she is free, she goes back to relearning magecraft. She even does so in HF Normal, where she takes a student. That's dedication to strive so hard when honestly, you'd be better off going back to a normal life after a lifetime of enslavement.
>Are you just willfully ignorant of how badass your father was or did he keep you out of the loop?
Unless he was batman he was a pretty normal nerdy teacher
My mother would be a pretty good berserker though
Unfortunately, the ToH tries as hard as possible to retain causality, so when lacking a reverse future catalyst, you won't be able to summon something from the future.
Saber wasn't summoned under normal means: she took a contract to do time travel on a system that happens to be the same system the ToH uses. Merlin didn't, and has no reason ti.
Oh well, guess those people are just too sensitive.
Besides, there was already a good looking pic by Koyama of the actual her, it should be posted more. I'd post it, but don't have it on me.
Your father was actually an assassin. He could take on servants with his snake style and win. No-one expected much from him but those in the know spread his legend to the point it grew within the community.
Kuzuki is based on your father
I argued with a friend that Saber would beat Erza from Farty Trail no problem.
More experience and that whole Excalibur thing to heal her, it would be a war of attrition that Saber would win.
It has to be someone rooted in reality.
The Assassin she summoned never existed as the legend goes, so instead, she summoned a nameless guy who just happened to be the closest thing that resembled Kojirou's 'legend'.
But she actually have both.
In terms of natural skill and affinity, she's equal or surpassing Rin in some fields, but she loses out in actual experience or knowledge.
She molded her entire magic into something two times over in the scope of four days by just feeling shit out, she is a genius in some fields and is a natural. However since she's still a Lv1 in terms of knowledge, Rin notes that what she molded her magecraft into was all pretty basic stuff without greater complexity, but simple isn't always terrible in this case. It just means it's easy to avoid for Rin who can see through it, although the scope of it was too huge to play that card due to her mana being at the level of a counter guardian. Also as she lacks experience, Rin can still see through her and out-talk her most of the time.
Sakura had just as much potential and possible inborn genius as Rin, but since 80% of it went underutilized she has some flaws to exploit even with infinite power, despite being good enough to mold it. As of Ataraxia she's training from the ground up in experience and knowledge from Rider and someone from the Church. She's showing some fast growth, but Rin might always be more than one step ahead at that rate as they now challenge each other forward on the path.
>you won't be able to summon something from the future.
Merlin is from the past, but died in the future. It's like if a wizard in the 1600's invented time-travel, moved forward four-hundred years through time, and then was hit by a car the moment he materialized. That's what Merlin is, and you're trying to make the argument "No, he's from the future now, doesn't count that most of his catalysts would be from the past".
He'll die in the future, but without a doubt he's from the past.
>See, people get the wrong idea when critiquing her when she was in captivity, whereas in Hollow(where she actually jumped into a sea of Avenger corpses to back up Rider and fought for an hour at the Broad Bridge battle),
WHAT?! When was this? who's Avenger?
>Sakura had just as much potential and possible inborn genius as Rin
She doesnt. Her element is as rare as Rins element but it does not have the sheer functionality and wide application Rin's has.
Rins element is something most mages would kill for. Sakura's is a very interesting but ultimately not very useful one.
>her subjects fucking hated her
No they didnt. A small part of them were duped into rebellion by Morgan and Mordred because they "couldnt understand her".
Essentially, she was too good a king. Her subjects demanded a king that was the embodiment of chivalry and who would separate themselves from everyone else. They got just that and some became uncomfortable with it.
You know, mages have really gotta start doing something about going into battle in their normal clothes I can't imagine a dress is very combat helpful the same goes for Rin's short skirt and Saber's ballroom dress.
>Her element is as rare as Rins element but it does not have the sheer functionality and wide application Rin's has.
People really underestimate "That which is possible but not within reality" based on nothing. The train of thought basically just amounts to "That's one thing, and this is five things, it's clearly better to have more", despite how the missing elements can do shit that the standard elements could never dream of if shit lines up right. Imaginary Numbers alone can create entire dimensions, dimensions with infinite time and infinite space. It goes even further than that depending on the user, but the idea that "It's only effective against spirits" seems to be something the wiki just made up at present.
>People really underestimate "That which is possible but not within reality" based on nothing
Its not that people underestimate it. Its that for something like Imaginary Numbers to be useful, the person needs to have a stupidly high amount of prana and even then it is only something that really affects familiars.
In the context of the grail war, this is pretty good. However, if we are talking about wider magecraft it is something that wouldnt be considered all that useful. Mages jizz themselves if they have control over two elements. Kayneth has control over water and wind and that is considered fucking awesome. Rin having control over all fucking 5 is like winning the magecraft lottery. So much so that she is said to become in the top 50 mages the Clocktower has ever had when she is a bit older.
>Imaginary Numbers alone can create entire dimensions, dimensions with infinite time and infinite space
What is this fanfiction shit?
Even if it could, you'd need more mana that Zelretch has access to to be able to accomplish any of that
Basically if you have at average magic circuit(20x1?), its fucking shit because you don't have enough mana to get anything done with it.
Everything is shit at 20x1.
While the wiki is filled with tons of tons of tons and fanfiction, and taking interviews litterally.
I have to ask because it's been annoying me lately, before the anime aired there was only Rin and Sakura fags around but barely any Saber fags. With that in mind is the majority of Saberfags seasonal fags and if so you guys are fucking disgusting and should be ashamed.
>I have to ask because it's been annoying me lately, before the anime aired there was only Rin and Sakura fags around but barely any Saber fags
Hello newfriend. First month on /a/?
>even then it is only something that really affects familiars.
hahaha. Remember Kayneths mercury blob? Thats a familiar.
Mystic Codes are technically familiars as well.
Do you use magic? Sorry, that too is affected.
And it goes the other way too. You can summon better familiars than others.
IN is not even stated to be shit in any of the FSN routes.
Sakura created a small dimension of infinite shadows to trap Gilgamesh in Heaven's Feel route for starters. Time and space don't so much apply in those dimensions created, not normally at least. We see some more applications in Ataraxia, CCC, Prism, etc. Like how in Prism all the servant worlds that are separated from normal space are imaginary number zones. Ataraxia she shows off her dimensions again in one or two jokes scenes. This is an ability which is slowly expanded upon more and talked about in different series.
Think of it as a pocket world that goes on forever, even the AUO could not escape from this imaginary numbers pit.
Its a blob formed out of his control with water and wind, bro.
It isnt a prana construction. He fucking pours the mercury on the ground before animating it. Familiars = prana construct. Or if you are Nrvnsqr they are animals you have eaten.
Yeah, most mages probably suck in general, although Sakura is on par with Rin with 1000 units of prana at a time. Supposedly equal circuits. So both sisters exhibit what normally cannot be done.
What is it with both Average One users to date, all they ever do is use it to send out magic grenades for the most part?
Although it was noted that Gilgamesh did almost escape a few times.
>Q: In Sakura’s Route, what happened to the devoured Gilgamesh? Sabre was blackened and enslaved, but was Gilgamesh’s will too strong to be dominated? Or was he completely digested?
>A: He simply cannot be controlled. In fact Gilgamesh cannot be blackened. After being devoured by the Grail, Sakura converted Gilgamesh into mana in haste because she was afraid that Gilgamesh might tear her up from the inside if she does not digest him. However, His Majesty was very hard to digest, so “Angra Mainyu” must have been plagued by belly-ache (laughs).
>supposedly equal circuits
I dont think we are ever told what Sakura's circuits are like.
>What is it with both Average One users to date, all they ever do is use it to send out magic grenades for the most part?
And, y'know, do Kaleidoscope magic. Rin being an inheritor and student of Zelretch's should tell you how OP her magecraft and element are.
And those "magic grenades" are all A ranked magic that can be invocked without incantation. That is some incredibly dangerous shit.
When will TM make a gag series about Saber and her son?
>Rin being an inheritor and student of Zelretch's should tell you how OP her magecraft and element are.
The crystal blade is just a glorified Azoth Dagger, except it has absurb capacity and draws magic from other dimensions.
That has nothing to do with Rins affinity, magic circuits, or element.
Which is sorta the point: She only figured out how to use it too late. If she had figured out earlier, she would have used it for actual magic.
You say bullshit, but this is something we've seen more than a few times in canon so far. In HF she captures Gilgamesh in an imaginary numbers pit, she calls Saber and Berserker from them as well since they now have physical bodies and cannot go spirit form as noted, also she captures Rin inside of a pit like that in one ending. Also here's a quote from the wiki, but I'm skeptical on about half of what's said here.
> Imaginary Numbers is Sakura Matou’s unique Elemental Affinity and Sorcery Trait. A power highly effective against spiritual beings, but not so potent against those whose body is not made out of Ether. When the Matou clan restraining spells are used along with this, it is possible to imprison and skewer the target into a separate dimension composed entirely of shadows. Furthermore, when Angra Mainyu power is imbued on Sakura she is able to use this ability even against normal humans.
Frankly I'm looking into this thing about how it's only effective against spirits, and nowhere in the citation does it actually say that from what I can tell. What it does say is...
>Like Hollow, the alignment of an imaginary element. In magery, defined as that "which is not possible, but materializes". Has a different meaning that the "nothing" of physics and math.
I'm not even saying it's surely wrong, but I'm not really seeing anything like that at present.
Can Rin's ass kill Servants?
>The crystal blade is just a glorified Azoth Dagger
Jesus fucking christ you are hot on this fanfiction shit today, arnt you?
It was a near perfect recreation of the 2nd magic, so much so that it dealt with Sakura and her near infinite grail spam just fine. Zelretch himself compliments Rin for her control over it.
I wonder if there's ever been a type moon thread that's never gone into some kind of war over the lore. Nasu is a bastard and a fiend yet Fate is very very popular because of the controversial lifestyle,habits and the morals that each character exhibits. Kinda reminds me of the sonic franchise and the zelda franchise where everyone has an opinion on everything and everyone wants theirs to be acknowledged as the correct one.
What this guy said for the most part, she didn't become Zel's student at all because "Her ability is so OP, yo", but because she was able to barely grasp how to make his sword. Which is the assignment he left to the Tohsaka family 500 years back. Upon completing it he came back to congratulate them, and make whoever his student.
I have long been of the opinion that it was the "worst route" overall, however its 2nd half was for me far more entertaining than most of HF. It had a simplicity and pureness to it that HF lost in a convoluted mess.
And Last Episode was lovely.
Lets start out the correction:
>It was a near perfect recreation of the 2nd magic
>What it is: It is 2nd magic, a implemented solution where you have a magic wand draining other dimensions for MP
>Contrast: Space Time box in HA
> Zelretch himself compliments Rin for her control over it.
>What really happened: Zelretch complimented Tohsaka for figuring out how to recreate it, and how to operate a device that has no instruction manual nor obvious mechanics
Yeah, Blackened servants cannot return to spirit form, they are now physical.
>Blackening of Servants
>The black mud in the Holy Grail contaminates the souls of those who touch it. It goes without saying for mere humans, and supernatural beings like Servants are no exception to this either. The contaminated person's personality reverses toward the orientation of evil. This is madness caused by touching Angra Mainyu. This is called "blackening". There are those who can use the black mud as part of their own power thanks to the properties of its contamination and those whose powerful egos have stayed back its mental pollution.
>An example of the former is Matou Sakura and the latter is Gilgamesh. The blackened Servant is incarnated by the power of the Grail so the more concrete ties to the physical plane turns them into powerful beings.
>Their physical interference power increases but at the same time they lose the ability to return to spirit form.
>Also, as they no longer bother to restrain their magic energy consumption, their fighting ability jumps significantly. This momentum can be compared to a runaway train.
You are right, how can anyone stop loving Seibah.
It was actually planned from the start.
However, nobody knows if Nasu took it out and then felt pressure to put it back in or if it was his intention all along to release something new with the game when RN was released.
Rin's jewels are part of her magic. She has lots of output, but her capacity isn't as high, so she can bleed it off into the right sort of gem. Stockpile enough, and you've got one hell of a weapon.
>I dont think we are ever told what Sakura's circuits are like.
We weren't. We know that because she's a grail she has a lot of storage capacity, but we don't know anything about her circuits (she was a "rare potential like a miracle", yes, but that was because of her affinity).
Rin only becomes strong in HF, and not in her own route. Fucking stupid.
Casual summer dress Saber is a miracle of the universe.
The main point of that was, you supposedly have the most versatile ability in the game, but all you do with it is make magic bombs to throw at people. There's no greater action at place, no mystic codes created like with Kayneth to work in different ways(despite all his shit being blown up aside from Mercury), she's just Magical Bomber Girl Rin.
They may be powerful bombs against most people, but she's nothing but a bomb type in the end. She either throws magic bullets that explode, or shoots a magic bullet from her finger that makes someone have a fever.
In terms of thought into it, it's almost entirely "Simple is best", without complexity or alternatives. Although you see some flaws with this line of thought during UBW when she and Shirou try to fight together against Lancer briefly, and she mentions she has no way of fighting with someone else since all her shit does is explode.
Rin is already ridiculously strong for a magus her age, she becomes strong in every route, HF is the only one that shows it directly is all. Out of all the human Magi in the series, Rin has the highest potential for growth.
>you supposedly have the most versatile ability in the game, but all you do with it is make magic bombs to throw at people.
And that fucking awesome and far more effective than any "mage" in the 4th or 5th wars had at their disposal except Kerry and his hax bullets.
She's always a miracle of the universe
So i've been Watching Fate/Zero, since i never bothered when it aired (I thought it was another DEEN series so i never gave it a second glance). Gotta say, i was not expecting to like Iskander nearly as much as i do. And i can't help but smile every time i think about how buttmad Tokiomi would be if he found out a low class magus like Shirou deflowers and impregnates Rin.
>>And that fucking awesome and far more effective than any "mage" in the 4th or 5th wars had at their disposal
You're really overestimating this as a tactic, just because you see them as powerful bombs.
It works as a single action spell, but this is a very stunted idea to begin with in a way, rather than "awesome".
To clarify a point or two, a mage is perfectly capable of using a spell that involves an affinity they aren't proficient in. However, just because they can do it doesn't mean they'll be any good at it. That's what the affinity is for, and is part of why Average One is so amazing, because it gives you all five elemental alignments at once, meaning you're good at everything you do. If you only have one element, then you'll be bad at stuff that treads on the territory of other alignments because your affinity is not those other alignments. It doesn't necessarily mean you couldn't make the attempt, but it's going to be inherently shitty because that's not really what the element does.
Like trying to use Fire for absorption and redirection and manipulation (all of which are Water-affinity traits). You might be able to do it, but it'll be weird and badwrong and not very effective.
Second, Sakura's Hollow element is great at doing anything involving "that which is possible but is not in the physical plane" (she has Hollow, not Nothingness; the latter is involved in some way with First Magic - you've quoted the wrong one). Outside of that it loses potency, just like any other element would when taken outside its box. It's still rare as all get out, though, so you can do some things with it that people would not be expecting at all unless they knew your affinity, because most would go into a "fight" expecting an elemental alignment, so you can come from way out of left field.
She needed Ilya and Shirou to grasp it this time alone. Not just Shirou, but Shirou with beyond Shirou abilities at the time, and Ilya will be dead in other routes before she can help. You say "Nothing says she won't magically figure it out in other routes, despite how she needed to see and examine the real thing to figure it out this time", but there are reasons listed here why she's unlikely to figure it out in others.
No. I am not.
Its instant use Class A magic without the need to an Incantation. She trumps even Caster with this.
Its a simple but incredibly powerful tactic. She even uses it to take a life off fucking Berserker. Not many humans can claim to have been able to kill a servant.
It's not that he's overestimating the tactic, it's that it's actually a tactic, and the vast majority of the Masters in the series are fucking retarded.
For example, Tokiomi canonically has Kaleido Stick Ruby as of his summoning Gil, but he doesn't give it to his goddamn wife despite it generating LITERALLY INFINITE MANA.
>She trumps even Caster with this.
Now that really didn't happen, in battle Caster was far quicker with the incantations and spells even with a single verse. You really think Rin was anywhere near being able to match Caster in magic even in terms of quickness or instant usage? That's a fools assertion, she was using her inferiority to lure in her opponent to the real trap just like Archer was outside at the time.
we just live in the shadows, but we are there
Like her dad. Make Azoth daggers. Make wands.
Do rituals, and force them into wands, and then don't make it a one time deal, but rather a spell gun.
You can have a entire fucking house filled with the shit, and the good part of her family bloodline will replenish and maintain it all.
She blocks Caster's attack and then ORAORAORA's her with martial arts and strengthening magic.
Caster was shocked that a modern magus had anything that even came close to matching her ancient magic.
Listen to what Nasu said in Kagetsu Tohya. Arc is invincible.
No, go fucking reread the scene. Caster was going easy on Rin time and became too complacent which opens her up for the melee assault that Caster have no skill for fighting against.
And Caster has a Class A with 1 word. Which she can use again and again, because Rin destroys her gems to do magic.
Rin is pretty bad, because Kotomine Suffering Kirei trained her.
Rin is even worse
>Disregard and disown it because it has a will
Especially when you compared it to Prism Ilya, where the only difference is that she is forced to use it, so she gets over the fact it has a will.
She still manages to block ancient magic with her own, and catches Caster off guard with it.
You can parrot
>b-b-but Caster was g-going easy on her!!1
all you want, however it does not change the fact that a modern mage was able to meet an ancient mage buffed by servant hax head to head with magic and still come out unscathed and even use it as a platform to beat her up.
>Best Saber hasn't been posted.
You nameless cowards have proved yourselves to have no taste again.
That's actually closer to what happened, but what you said at first "Its instant use Class A magic without the need to an Incantation. She trumps even Caster with this." is not correct.
Rin is far inferior in all fields in a magic battle, so she let her opponent get good and arrogant before rushing in with something that any typical magus would call "bullshit". However even then Kuzuki chastises her at being a failure as a killer for needing more than one strike to end it.
Even Saber who was raised of a certain age of magic agrees, "Mages don't do that shit, it's inelegant" which is why it worked.
All old age magus would say "What is this bullshit?" if they saw such a thing. It's such a non-tactic for any magus, that it would catch anyone with that old style of thinking off-guard. It's like getting into a sword fight with someone with honor and shit on the line, and then he pulls out a gun.
>She still manages to block ancient magic with her own,
No, she was blocking Caster's casual magic,
>and catches Caster off guard with it.
That never happened.
What caught Caster off guard was the sudden melee assault she have no experience in fighting against.
Gawain, are you implying that Arturia is not the best Saber?
No, Rin disowns it because the first time she touches it she ends up putting on a terrible, terrible concert for all her school friends and as a result no longer has any school friends. AND it talks back.
It has a personality and will, you'd have to be able to convince it in order to work for you, and Rin is the type who blows everything up or does something stupid when she gets hot-headed from having to deal with anyone. Like when she listened to Archer talk for ten seconds in prologue, and went into a tsundere rage and used a command seal.
She's the type who gets fed up quickly and loses herself entirely. So expecting her to communicate with that rod is unlikely at best.
That wasn't her getting serious, Rin had unleashed the same attack that could kill Berserker, but Caster easily absorbed it in her robe. Caster was just commending Rin for making her taking one step above.
No, she was buffed to be heroic spirit or counter guardian like in order to fulfill the conditions of her contract. But she still wasn't her full potential because she doesn't have her other NP like the sheathe and caliburn which she would have gotten if she was a proper heroic spirit.
I can't stop thinking about futa Saber, that shit fucked up my mind
>she was buffed to be heroic spirit or counter guardian like in order to fulfill the conditions of her contract
Bullshit. 100% bullshit. Complete fucking bullshit. Cite ANYTHING that indicates anything like that.
Artoria is weakened compared to herself from Camlann because she has to rely on the magical energy of magi.
we all want that Anon, don´t be silly
she knows how to please a man
Yes. There is canon futa in the Nasuverse.
Which brings up an interesting point. Is Saber still a virgin, after that?
Got my preorder proxy in for this bonus
The fact is that she figured it out on her own from seeing it in action.
Not because she had guidance from someone else. Given time, she should be able to decipher the blueprints just as well.
Won't happen unless someone figures out how to extract Vita games, and the only way that's going to happen is if the Vita gets a native hack, which will be quite a while before that happens and that will need to turned into custom firmware.
>What's "one step above" playing? Hint: it's no longer playing.
It is no longer playing, but it is nowhere close to serious, since she was still being casual.
learn the definition of compete, it doesn't mean to have to go all out.
Azoth daggers and Tokiomi's staff and pendant were just as one-off as the gemstones. In fact the Azoth dagger was even worse, it's both a one-off and it's inferior to the gems in quality.
All the Tohsaka magecraft can do is create batteries. Rin just prefers to spend all the battery in one shot, because her capacity is tremendous.
>Her true identity was King Arthur.
>She disguised herself as male and ruled as the king, but had the misfortune of dying in the subsequent civil war after establishing peace in her empire.
>The King Arthur in the story of Fate was an amalgamation of historical facts and legends. Saber's name before becoming king was Altria.
>It must be tough to live in a palace while disguising her gender.
>The greatest problem was probably producing an heir, but that was solved by Merlin through magecraft.
>In the story, the line "I know how to please a man" was from experience.
>Saber's aging process was halted the moment she pulled out the Sword of Selection. The age of her body was probably a year younger than Shirou.
>By the way, King Arthur was the Crimson Dragon that guarded Britannia.
>Saber's father Uther Pendragon produced an heir with the Dragon Factor according to Merlin's plan. As a result, Altria was born human but carried the magical power of Dragons.
>Magic Circuits were unnecessary, Altria generated mana just by breathing in harmony with the coursing of her blood. It could be called a "Magical Furnace" that was worlds beyond what mages had to offer.
>>In the story, the line "I know how to please a man" was from experience.
Sure sounds like nothing happened. Oh wait, no, it's the opposite.
Because there are tons of examples servants being stronger than in life, see Drake/Queen Elizabeth, Shakespeare, Anderson. If they were using their real life ability, they would be useless.
Heroics are buffed by legends, but Servants rely on the summoning grail location.
Fate/complete material III: World material - FAQ with Nasu: Servants, p.132
>Q: If the Holy Grail War were set in Europe, would Cu chulainn (Lancer), King Arthur (Saber), and Heracles (Berserker) be roughly equal in power?
>A: ...Well, if we’re talking western Europe in general I’d say the first two would be powered up to an equal degree... though England and Ireland, the odds would be sharply in the respective hero’s favor. Heracles would display excellent power in all of western Europe.
Fate/complete material III: World material - Record of Heavens Feel - Servant System: Difference between Heroic Spirits and Servants, p.012
Difference between Heroic Spirits and Servants
Heroic Spirits were Heroes who have left behind great feats in legends after death and become subjects of belief.
Normally, a Heroic Spirit is summoned by the world as power that protects humans.
The ones summoned by humans are Servants. However, Heroic Spirits cannot be controlled by humans, and to summon them, the Holy Grail or something with power of that sort must be used.
The Servant system of Fuyuki summons Heroic Spirits with the power of the Greater Grail. Heroic Spirits summoned as Servants are like "emanations", copies created using the information of the main body of the Heroic Servant.
She did have some sexual experience with the temporary D though, considering it's how she "learned how to please a man". Whether it was Morgan or Guenevere or just the maids of camelot.
The etymology of "Secondaries" comes from the superior ability of these individuals to delay gratification, and thus receive two marshmallows. This ability highly correlates with success, education, health and weight control. In this context, it refers to their ability to wait for a superior release in a superior medium (anime).
>In these studies, a child was offered a choice between one small reward provided immediately or two small rewards if they waited for a short period: approximately 15 minutes, during which the tester leave the room and then return. (The reward was sometimes a marshmallow, but often a cookie or a pretzel.) In follow-up studies, the researchers found that children who were able to wait longer for the preferred rewards tended to have better life outcomes, as measured by SAT scores, educational attainment, body mass index (BMI), and other life measures.
It is not surprising at all that bitter "primaries" who are often unintelligent, overweight, and unsuccessful at life, would attempt to turn it into a pejorative, following in the model of "normalfag"
•Birth of Heroic Spirits
It's been explained that Heroic Spirits are beings that heroes whom belief has been gathered upon become after death, but heroes of myths and legends can be born by the gathering of belief even if they didn't exist. Also, there are those who those who make a contract of some sort with the world when they were alive and as compensation become Heroic Spirits after death. In the Fifth War, Hasan Sabaha was a hero that actually existed, and Herakles and Medusa are ones of legends. Also, Emiya and Altria are beings that became (or will become) Heroic Spirits after their contract with the world. Those who have become Heroic Sｐirits are freed from the constraints of time and are moved to the Throne of Heroes, existing to the outside of the World.
•Heroic Spirit summoning
Heroic Spirits are beings cut off from the time axis and can be summoned in any era, regardless of past and future. However, the only one that can summon the main body of the Heroic Spirits is the "world", and alas, humans can't summon the main body and can only summon their emanations, the Servants. Speaking of which, the information (souls) making up the Servants return to the main body at the same time as the death of the Servant, and the main body can know, as records, about the actions of the Servants as if reading a book.
>Because there are tons of examples servants being stronger than in life, see Drake/Queen Elizabeth, Shakespeare, Anderson. If they were using their real life ability, they would be useless.
Not how it works. Drake was actually that amazing of a fighter, Shakespeare and Andersen ARE as useless as they were in life (all they can do is create a story).
You forget that people in the old days were literally stronger than people in the current era. Even as far back as the start of enlightenment, they were physically more powerful and talented because things only get worse as they get older.
It has begun
The fujoshi pandering is beginning.
Not that I mind since this means higher sales
>forcing this meme
No, "secondary" comes from the Touhou fanbase as someone who partakes in the non-primary material, as the Touhou fanbase is a tremendous phenomenon and the primary material is perceived as only a small cut of it.
>Speaking of which, the information (souls) making up the Servants return to the main body at the same time as the death of the Servant, and the main body can know, as records, about the actions of the Servants as if reading a book
Does this mean that EMIYA gets stronger every time he gets summoned, assuming he sees new Noble Phantasms each time
I am completely okay with this.png
No, NPs are the defining trait of Servants and their power, and they ARE buffed by legends.
>You forget that people in the old days were literally stronger than people in the current era. Even as far back as the start of enlightenment, they were physically more powerful and talented because things only get worse as they get older.
That's not the case, the regression to the age of the gods only refers to magic/mysteries and the weight of their souls. They are overall more capable, but not definitely not heroic spirit or servant tier.
>those added scenes are secret gay scenes with Lancer and Archer.
Technically yes. Practically no.
He only really uses the ones we assume he trained with in life; Kanshou & Bakuya, Caladbolg II, Rho Aias, Hrunting...
This is of course, if you choose to interpret UBW as a linear thing, rather than an outside realm that always has had literally every blade inside it and Archer is merely discovering them when seeing them outside.
Heroic Spirit [Concept]
Source: Fate/side material (2004-1-30), p.056
Heroes who achieved great things in life, and became objects of worship after death.
As a "power that protects humanity", they are high ranking existences, categorically closer to elementals than wraiths.
However, whereas elementals are "power" given form using the container called human imagination, Heroic Spirits are woven from people's ideals on the inside, too.
Among the Heroic Spirits, there are those from legends, those that really existed, and those that were never observed at all. The ones who aren't worshipped much fall under the broad classification of "Counter Guardian", and are used as a mindless "Counter Force".
Of all the Heroic Spirits that appeared in the story, the only one functioning as a "Counter Guardian" was Archer.
Because the other Heroic Spirits had high divinity, and were existences closer to the planet than humanity, they were able to avoid being drafted as Counter Guardians.
>As a "power that protects humanity", they are high ranking existences, categorically closer to elementals than wraiths.
>Because the other Heroic Spirits had high divinity, and were existences closer to the planet than humanity,
>the line "I know how to please a man" was from experience.
People put too much retarded emphasis on this.
It isnt exactly fucking rocketscience, and she was the head of probably the most oversexed group of knights in the country who probably talked about it non stop.
That's an interesting idea. Gilgamesh accesses the Gate of Babylon using a Sword that is also the key. If EMIYA traced that, I wonder if he could get into Gil's vault.
>No, NPs are the defining trait of Servants and their power, and they ARE buffed by legends.
And that doesn't apply to Saber, who is just using the abilities she had on her from Camlann. She was not buffed at all in this regard.
>That's not the case, the regression to the age of the gods only refers to magic/mysteries and the weight of their souls. They are overall more capable, but not definitely not heroic spirit or servant tier.
At the very least, the people of Gilgamesh's era was. Ionioi Hetairoi confirms that Alexander's elite cavalry were.
Reminder that HF is shit because Lancer and Archer die so early on.
Informed knowledge is not "experience", Anonymous. It is in fact the definition of "not experience".
No, the key only links to "everything you own". Wouldn't lead to shit for the man whose hands will never hold anything.
>the people of Gilgamesh's era was
Nowhere state any of them were servant tier, it is the soul that is weighted and more in tune with the mysteries.
> Ionioi Hetairoi confirms that Alexander's elite cavalry were.
They were basically heroic spirits
also see: >>115041679
Would still probably be something Archer used in life.
>brb, need to smuggle my gear, guns and ammo into a country
>trace Key of the King's Law, Bab-ilu
>thanks, Gil, you're the best!
>Informed knowledge is not "experience", Anonymous. It is in fact the definition of "not experience".
What he said
You can't say "She just heard about it" when the line directly says it's from experience.
Kerry was the MC we have always wanted. Calm, collected, effective, not emotionless (Eggs), is strongly driven with a goal in mind, no qualms about killing, and doesn't fall for other people's bullshits.
According to this chart, you can only summon once for each instance.
>•Heroic Spirit summoning
Heroic Spirits are beings cut off from the time axis and can be summoned in any era, regardless of past and future. However, the only one that can summon the main body of the Heroic Spirits is the "world", and alas, humans can't summon the main body and can only summon their emanations, the Servants. Speaking of which, the information (souls) making up the Servants return to the main body at the same time as the death of the Servant, and the main body can know, as records, about the actions of the Servants as if reading a book.
>They were basically heroic spirits
They WERE Heroic spirits. Every person in his NP was a Heroic Spirit of some form, with their own Noble Phantasms and special abilities. That's why everybody was shitting themselves when they saw it. Iskander had potentially the most powerful NP in the franchise barring Ea.
>And that doesn't apply to Saber, who is just using the abilities she had on her from Camlann. She was not buffed at all in this regard.
No, she was buffed, the weapons on her was translated into NP.
Because those are they are typically wraith:
Wraith 亡霊 - Bourei
Human spirits. In the context of the game, the spirits that serves as the cores (candidates) of those heroic spirits that never existed as individuals; basically the "I'm not really this hero, I just look like him" sort of Servant. Generally, their name as a heroic spirit isn't their true name, which has been lost. According to the "actor" playing the "role" of Kojirou, just a ghost that hadn't made his own name known.
If a hero in a legend doesn't actually exist, then a wraith with similar abilities or one that shares the same general idea/concept/title is used as the basis for the heroic spirit or one of the many candidates for that heroic spirit. In Fate,
Hassan Sabbah is one of these. Hassan is actually a name taken on by the leaders of an organization of assassins. Each individual Hassan's own background before becoming a Hassan is lost historically and thus, there are no memories before they became Hassan. The core personality of Sasaki Kojirou is also an example; there are a number of other nameless swordsmen that bear enough similarities to the legendary Kojirou.
The word bourei more or less connotes a ghost that's still remaining in the material plane because of regret, grudges, and what not; the type that tends to haunts houses, lands, and people, like say... the ghosts in Juon. It also carries the same sort of meaning that the word "spector" would have in English; something of the past that has long since stopped existing.
Stanrobe, an Ancestor whose physical body was destroyed, is referred to as being the 1st wraith.
Shirou agreed with it, but didn't think of how to get use of it.
Shirou can use it, by summoning himself as a female version. The staff should be perfectly capable of that.
Rin is stupid anon. She has persuasive ability of a 8 year old, most likely from Kotomine training her.
They are entities that tries to fullfil the rumors and legends, see Sasaki.
You know the Gilles of 4th grail war? he was actually a wraith.
>As for Gilles' relation to sorcery, he turned to alchemy in an attempt to relieve his financial difficulties, and eventually strayed down a dark path that led him to try summoning a demon. But while it's certainly true that he participated in the ceremony, the actual magus was his friend François Prelati – Gilles himself was nothing more than a patron. As such, he is not a Heroic Spirit that qualifies for the Caster class. Or rather, he is not even a proper Heroic Spirit at all. The fact that Ryuunosuke's bogus ritual ended up actually completing a summoning sorcery was, honestly, more or less a total fluke. In that sense, the "Caster" Gilles de Rais is just as much of an irregular Servant as the "Assassin" Sasaki Kojirou.
>trying to use a mad trickster mystic code with powers over alternate realities
It's like you want EVERYTHING that could possibly go wrong, to go wrong in the absolutely worst possible way.
Its the exact same tool in Prisma Ilya.
Where they summon some Uber Magus edition of themselves as a mantle.
And nothing really goes wrong, because while the Kaleidosticks are witty, they are not evil.
And wraiths aren't affected by belief or the worship of mortals. They only happen to circumstantially fit the mold. And yet they are on the level of heroes.
Thus, the idea that heroes are buffed is bullshit.