Nah, he is a first rate swordsman, I don't know what fiction has you thinking, but moving your sword and creating a shock-wave is not proof of your swordsmanship, being able to handle the sword the way he does is proof of constant practice since birth.
You can say kenshin but he's got plot armor out the ass everywhere even though he finally struggles a bit towards the end fighting dudes.
My vote goes for Jubei or the guy that gets blinded in Baslisk.
Does /a/ even Shichika?
Hmmm, can Shiro trace him?
nigga he ain't even the best Nisio sword user.
Because if you limit yourself to the first one, you disqualify most of the powerful swordman since they are fucking shit at fighting outside of their power level.
If you limit yourself to the second one, you have to perform a great skill. Such as Fake Assassin from Fate.
You can still have shit skill, and shit power, but you do retarded things for single moves or combos.
And then you have if you are actually strong. Mihawk and Zoro are pretty bad as swordmen go, but they are really really strong.
If they was not that strong, they would not be top 1%.
Guts is pretty good, but he isn't that good. He is the third class.
Kenshin is has issues. Especially when his master is better than him, to a extreme degree.
Most of the manga artist giving their swordsman character the ability to create shock wave cut for the purpose of entertainment and powerlevel. They do not understand the true fundamental behind swordsmanship, but miura knows and handle the concept very well.
That being said, Serpico might be another good and real swordsman without his feather sword. Capable of cut with extremely precise and beating noobs noble with one hand.
Pic related for my favourite and amongst the top tier.
Objectively the GOAT is Ishikawa Goemon XIII.
He can literally cut through space with his sword.
>and wooden sword.
It's such a cliche, but I love it.
>You will never sacrifice yourself for worst girl
If we're talking pure destructive power with a sword, and not grace or finesse
>And then you have if you are actually strong. Mihawk and Zoro are pretty bad as swordmen go, but they are really really strong.
If they was not that strong, they would not be top 1%.
>That being said, Serpico might be another good and real swordsman without his feather sword. Capable of cut with extremely precise and beating noobs noble with one hand.
Serpico is a good mix of skill and intelligence required to fight cleverly. But then I guess so was Griffith back in the day.
Likes Naruto and One shitty Piece but doesn't like Bleach.
I literally don't get it. If you like Naruto, you're gonna like Bleach and vice versa. There's really no reason whatsoever to hate only one show.
It's either you like both or don't like neither.
Does Musashi ever show up in cartoons?
I know that old fisher hermit guy in Samurai Champloo claimed that he was him, but other than that there's none, right?
>It's either you like both or don't like neither.
Musashi bashed his skull in with a slab of wood
That's hardly "greatest swordsman ever" territory.
Nobody without bullshit swords could take on the greatest duelist of all time.
>Nobody without bullshit swords could take on the greatest duelist of all time
What do swords have to do with children's card games
>The Shining Trapezohedron is a sword
>Demonbane uses it
>Demonbane is the best swordsman in anime/manga
Yes, in terms of skill.
Musashi did wreck him and his laundry pole with a bokken he carved from an oar a few minutes before the battle.
Both of those niggas ain't got nothing on Musashi.
She's pretty good when she's not against Double Jesus or the washing machine
The fate version of Kojiro isn't even Kojiro though, he's a random guy who lived on the mountain and perfected god like sword skills, the grail chose him because he was the closest match for the legend of Sasaki Kojiro, he never even fought him in the fate universe. And once again, he can fight at hypersonic speeds, he has A+ agility and Eye of the Mind(Fake).
It's canon and it has the best Sabers.
It's like people have not read Vagabond.
oh, that's right. Everyone here is a pleb.
Who is the best swordsman in anime or manga that uses western swords?
>Joui War arc never
Gintoki is objectively the best and anyone who says other wise is an underaged faggot.
This is a Gintama thread now. Dump what you got.
>Hiko Seijūrō XIII
Musashi basically acts like Sonic the Hedgehog, and fights with an electric sword that only knocks people out, and dual revolvers loaded with "sleeping bullets" that only put people to sleep.
It also has quality van levels of animation.
Kondo is the true swordsman. It's not about the sword you have in your hand, but the one you keep in your heart.
Zoro... or at least he eventually will be.
Woman, Pic related , Theres no one remotely close to her
Shiki probably, then again, that's just ungodly Critical Hit...
Kek, can a Saber clone beat "Plot Armor" and "Plot Sword"?
He's actually fairly good by the end of every route, though fairly good doesn't really mean shit when nearly all his opponents are statswise >>>> to even his endgame future hero self.
His body is a sword, and he uses his body to fight. How does that not qualify him as a swordsman?
I'm ignoring the joke that he's a sword-man because he is both that and a swordsman.
>Dont want to kill anymore
>Do pic related
>Shishio is still alive
Cmon man, there aint no one be this good
Saber's not even the best swordsman in the round table
Kondo heart sword has stabbed my heart
Fine you faggots! Here, mayo a beta fag. Better now?
Now stop this gay shit.
A vast impovement. Now stop posting this gay shit anon, stop being a faggot.
Why does everyone have a problem with Gintoki being a bottom. Is it that unrealistic that he might like getting his prostate milked.
Like anyone could beat him in a fight.
>Can barely take out 70 men with an ambush, despite prime physical condition and zero people with bows.
How could Guts be the best swordsman when he doesn't even use a sword?
It was too big to be called a sword. Massive, thick, heavy, and far too rough. Indeed, it was a heap of raw iron.
Kenshin during his Battousai era was arguably the best swordsman in the series, by that point the only thing Kenshin knew how to do was to kill with a sword, and he did it a lot, by the time the main series starts he's 10 years rusty.
He's not even the best swordsman in his own soul place whatever it's called.
>that bersker fighting style of white during the zanpaktou rebellion filler arc
>you will never be the greatest swordsman ever while carrying a purse.
Jesus christ how horrible.
No wonder you aren't supposed to watch the anime.
Isn't White Ichigo supposed to be strong because he uses all of his body and everything available to him in a highly unpredictable fighting style? Why is everyone moving so statically the whole time? Why is Ichigo just sitting on the ground the entire time? Why does this exist?
how the fuck is this the only mention of Goemon. He's the definition of bullshit katana fuckery.
OFFICIAL LIST OF THINGS GOEMON HAS CUT, WITHOUT DIFFICULTY:
>a train, down the middle
>a plan, down the middle
>a forest's worth of trees
>the clothes off a man's body so many times
>a lightning bolt
>a shooting star
you know it's true. Kenichi power levels got too insane for it NOT to be true.
Just reminding you all that Madao has literally sacrificed everything, lost everything and is the only one in the show that has legitimately done nothing wrong.
He is true swordsman.
>No wonder you aren't supposed to watch the anime.
It's not like the manga shows them to do actually use interesting styles or anything like that. The powers and kubo factor are what appeal to me.
>a shitty filler arc had the best combat in bleach
It's so kubo and he didn't even do it.
Not sure he quite counts, as he's more of a sword-summoning mage, but whatever.
he could be Archer class tho
>not dual wielding spears
what a pleb
They do if they are cardboard samurai.
>Dies from a spear to the chest
he may have lost to Black Star, but I don't think BS was a "better swordsman", because he used a variety of ninja tools
Yes, Lancelot was the best fighter at the round table. Though Balin was the best fighter in Arthurian Legend, but he and his brother Balan double-killed eachother due to a curse before the round table was founded.
>Nobody mentioning Trunks
Seriously, could anyone of your pleb-tier swordsmen do this?
Stranger: Mukou Hadan - Sword of the Stranger
This guy easily. No debate.
And I'm not talking about Edo Tensei Uchiha Madara. I'm not talking about Gedou Rinne Tensei Uchiha Madara either. Hell, I'm not even talking about Juubi Jinchuuriki Gedou Rinne Tensei Uchiha Madara with the Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan and Rinnegan doujutsus (with the rikodou abilities and being capable of both Amateratsu and Tsukuyomi genjutsu), equipped with his Gunbai, a perfect Susano'o, control of the juubi and Gedou Mazou, with Hashirama Senju's DNA implanted in him so he has mokuton kekkei genkai and can perform yin yang release ninjutsu while being an expert in kenjutsu and taijutsu. I'm NOT Talking about sagemode sage of the six paths Juubi Jinchuuriki Gedou Rinne Tensei Super Saiyan 4 Uchiha Madara with the Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan, Rinnegan, Mystic Eyes of Death Perception, and Geass doujutsus, equipped with Shining Trapezohedron while casting Super Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann as his Susanoo, controlling the Gold Experience Requiem stand, having become the original vampire after Alucard, wearing the Kamen Rider Black RX suit and Gedou Mazou, with Hashirama Senju's DNA implanted in him so he has mokuton kekkei genkai and can perform yin yang release ninjutsu while being an expert in kenjutsu and taijutsu. I'm talking about sagemode sage of the six paths Juubi Jinchuuriki Gedou Rinne Tensei Legendary Super Saiyan 4 Uchiha Madara with the Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan, Rinnegan, Mystic Eyes of Death Perception, and Geass doujutsus, equipped with his Shining Trapezohedron while casting Super Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann as his Susanoo, controlling the Gold Experience Requiem stand, having become the original vampire after having absorbed Alucard as well as a God Hand, able to tap into the speedforce, wearing the Kamen Rider Black RX suit, with Kryptonian DNA implanted in him and having eaten Popeye's spinach while possessing quantum powers like Dr. Manhattan and having mastered Hokuto Shinken.
There's a reason he gets called "Idiot Apprentice". In order to use the Hiten Mitsurugi-Ryu to the fullest you have to be as /fit/ as Hiko. Hell, if Hiko had use Amakakeru Ryo no Hirameki on Kenshin, using the reverse-blade sword, he would have killed him due to his sheer physical strength.
Kenshin "fails" as an apprentice because he chooses to use his sword style to protect the people. Hiko's wishes, as Kenshin's teacher, are for Kenshin to surpass him and kill him. He doesn't give a shit about Japan, he just wants his style to live on, through people greater than what he ever was.
Oh man I can't contain my hype.
How will Mushashi written by Itagaki fare?
Seijuro can stop earthquakes with his punches, so I expect Mushashi to cut the higgs particles or some other amazing bullshit that Baki will counter with EVEN greater bullshit.
The only thing that counters Mushashi is modern culture.
He will forget all of that when he starts fighting.
Hanayama cells are intimidated in this chapter, and I don't think Yujiro meant it as an exageration.
I think we will get some fighter from the future at some point down the road in Baki.
It kind of depends on how realistic of sword play you're considering. If you are considering full fantasy sword play, where people move faster than the eye can see, send out cuts over distances and other cliches like that, then I don't know.
If you are considering medium fantasy swordplay, where the swordfighting follows most of the rules of physics but there's a couple fantastical elements, then the title would probably go to Guts (the Dragonslayer is too large for me to not consider it fantasy).
Considering complete realism swordplay, where no fantasy elements are considered, then the title would probably go to Musashi.
Unless fucking Black Jack himself is prepped to help before it happened, that ought to be fatal.
The direct blood loss from the brain and the potential for infection alone should each be enough to do it.
Did you pay even the slightest bit of attention to Hiko Seijuro as a character or the things that he said? The reason that Hiko was so harsh on Kenshin is because he left and affiliated himself with a political movement.
The Hiten style is meant to be used as an independent party, roaming around helping people without swearing oaths or any such nonsense. He even points out that Kenshin learned this the hard way and internalized Hiten Mitsurugi-Ryu's teachings entirely on his own.
Hiko did care about Japan, and his entire grievance with Kenshin was that he was going about things the wrong way. On a personal level, yes, he was tired and ready to be done, but holy shit. Way to miss basically everything about Hiko Seijuro, Kenshin, and their relationship.
The entire point of Kenshin going to be re-trained by his master was so he could fight at his full strength without reverting to his battosai persona. Even so, he was barely ever able to lay a hand on Hiko, and we know for a fact that Hiko is categorically superior based both on observation and author statements.
Furthermore, even as Battosai we know for a fact that Kenshin was never significantly better than Saito Hajime, as their fights ended in repeated draws. By definition, at best, he is only "one of the best", not the best.
Additionally, Shishio Makoto was a better fighter and swordsman, losing out primarily due to long-term damage to his body rather.
Kenshin's pretty badass, but there are dudes better than him even within his own internal context.
Not every swordsman can create his own swords, let alone teleport using them.
>Hiko Seijūrō XIII
>Implying that magical samurai shockwaves is the same as skill
Keep telling yourself that. Whatever helps you sleep at night.
as far as pure swordsmanship without any 'superhuman' strength or durability; dis guy
what are you, a passerby of one of Guts' fights
do you even know what you're saying right now?