>>118273963 Currently it's borderline impossible to do so. Most anime never gets subbed and if it is we get it much later than we do with fansubbers. Fansubs tend to have better translations as well. Older series are mostly only found online on illegal sites. The cost to buy a physical copy in the US is much higher than what most consumers are willing to pay. Funimation is trying their damnedest to make it work and has hired fansubbers before, everyone else tends to flip us the bird
I always though it was some kind of dubious gray area. Copy right law gets a bit weird when you're talking internationally and the only material being distributed is stuff that shown on TV for free with subs slapped on there which as a fan effort the company has no claim too
you see, since some time ago i decided to watch things for free on the internet first and if there is a show/movie/manga i genuinely enjoy i will pay for it. Unfortunately the amount of shows/movie/manga i would pay money for are like...once every other year.
Now i WOULD watch them on TV if they were airing almost at the same time as the ones in japan and at a decent timeslot. However most don't get over here, those that do are delayed and usually the dub is horrible. The same applies to manga, i would read them in manga magazines, however in my country the magazine that was something like shonen jump eventually got discontinued due to low sales as well.
In other words, unless japan finally decides to stop bothering with quantity over quality i won't pay a single cent, even if the government somehow magically makes it impossible to watch something illegally.
>>118274470 I believe it's still illegal, although as a consumer it's kind of what you are supposed to do in this case because they are giving you a low quality product so that they see the drop in sales and change.
>>118274511 I guess the proper response would to just not watch until they shape up, which is ridiculous. They'll never change as long as the bulk of their customer base are the uninformed who don't care about banding, typesetting, or balanced translations. They'll eat up just anything, and CR or Funi will never have to change.
see my understanding was there simply wasn't any law one way or the other.
It's not really legal but it's not ILLegal either because the Japanese rights holders are in Japan and don't care because the cost of going after international copyright claims just isn't worth the effort
We've been through this through numerous studies conducted by independent parties; pirates spend more than those who don't pirate. Period. End of story. Wish people got off their moral high ground. I pirate all my shit and yet still have a bookshelf filled with manga/light novels in Japanese and English, figures and plushies raping my oxygen in my house, and I still get tickets when I can to see stuff like Madoka movies and Expelled from Paradise (seeing later) when I can. In other words, I get to enjoy all the fucking shit I want AND support whenever I can at the same time. Would I have given something like Madoka a chance if I had to pay $40 for 3 episodes? Probably not. Even if I did, I wouldn't have enjoyed the initial viewing as much if it wasn't for the /a/ threads while it was airing. Same with shit like Code Geass, which had some fun times with the WHOLE BOARD essentially being /Geass/ during its live airings.
>>118274731 In theory it subsidizes their salaries by making their work more profitable for the industry, basically in the same way that purchasing fish at your local grocer supports, say, the mechanic that fixes a company's fishing boats.
Crunchyroll on the other hand is a whole other can of worms.
>Be an adult >Work all fucking day >Spend money on food >Get home and cook halfway exhausted from work >Get raped by taxes every paycheck >Get raped by student loans because MURRIKA >Get raped by health insurance that you sometimes feel like just opting out of since you don't really care about whether you die or not anyway >Pay for internet at Comca$t rates because MURRIKA >Pay rent >Left with scraps of a paycheck >Have to decide what I wanna spend it on
Guess what I'm NOT spending it on? Things I can get for free effortlessly. Even if I need to jump through loopholes of shitty DRM cracking, I don't mind.
>>118274850 Google little to hard for you to use? Main reason we don't link articles is because of how many there are and how a quick google search will give you tons of results http://www.geek.com/apps/piracy-research-once-again-shows-biggest-downloaders-spend-the-most-1554798/ https://torrentfreak.com/0-more-on-content-than-honest-consumers-130510/ http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/may/06/piracy-film-music-study-pay-illegal-download-damage
Mamare saying that western popularity of Log Horizon having part in season 2 being green-lit so fast convinced me that it was worth watching stuff on CR. So if series I like is being simulcast reasonably fast, I watch it there.
Too bad northern Europe gets fucked with licenses every season.
>>118274812 Crunchyroll doesn't actually support the industry much, but it does make things more accessible to people I guess. I don't use it because I'd rather have high quality and because I watch without subs anyway. Never used Hulu, so no comment on it aside from liking how it's getting the jews in the cable industry to dance on quicksand as they try to keep their dead cash cow artificially alive.
>>118274871 >25% of just pirates bought something legally >9% of the rest of the entire muiti-billion population of Earth bought something legally Nice graph manipulation. I guess the pretty colors distracted you from actually thinking about what you were being told.
>>118274970 So how does crunchyroll dodge supporting the industry? Haven't liked hulu much myself because of how hard they push the premium accounts by delaying popular content for 2 weeks and still give you ads
>>118275070 >So how does crunchyroll dodge supporting the industry? From what I've heard, it's actually opposite. Much of their revenue goes back to Japan, and if you're paying member, your money just goes to shows that you watch. http://otakujournalist.com/where-your-crunchyroll-dollars-really-go-an-interview-with-the-ceo/
>>118274864 >Pay for internet at Comca$t rates because MURRIKA Suck a dick, come back when you have to spend $100 a month for home phone + 100gb cap at 8mbs (bit not byte) speeds just because you don't live directly in the city.
Does streaming through official channels even make an impact on the studios? I always figured that any money there is to be made from a streamer goes to the licensing companies while the studios have to rely on physical sales.
I'd honestly pay like $15-20 a month for a very high quality service.
Highest quality releases translated well and as quickly as possible available for DOWNLOAD. Fansubs usually release the same day or a day after. I wouldn't accept anything slower.
Those same releases available in BD quality upon their respective releases.
All categorized well and no bullshit blackouts/etc. All downloads unlimited and always available in DDL or torrent.
And I would really pay the same amount a month or more for manga scans/translations considering how many things I've read end up dropped, often for good. For every hour I spend watching animu I probably spend 4-5 on manga.
I'd also expect a good chunk of the profits to go to the actual creators.
Shame nothing would ever be this good and would be plagued with licensing/blackout/etc bullshit. I'll just keep pirating and buying figs I guess.
>>118275154 Those are articles with studies about the subject on hand.
You can go ahead and individually discuss all of them, or you can go ahead and post OTHER articles detailing the same subject in a different light, or you could just passive aggresively ignore what they say and pretend that your opinion holds more value.
I pirate because it's simply a better service. I already have a good job and can easily afford a shitty subscription, but why should I if I can get a BETTER QUALITY SERVICE through torrenting?
Until Crunchyroll fixes their obvious bitrate starving banding issues and awful "professional" translations with zero typesetting, I won't pay a single cent into their coffers. Fansubs provide a much more professional service than these "professional" hacks at CR, until Daiz kills fansubbing for good next year.
streaming is shit and I BDs are hella overpriced here
also not illegal since not licensed here even if it was, piracy is not punished here as long as it's for personal use. Not worth their time to do a good job (or any) so where's the expectation that they should get some of my money like that. Of course I do buy figs and such so it's not like I'm against spending money. It's just, like video entertainment in general these days, it doesn't quite hold much of a value like it used to now that people can do it for free.
The idea of supporting the industry sounds novel at first but really licensing issues and stream quality being simply inferior were the nail in the coffin for me. There are other ways of supporting the creators that don't involve paying for bad service.
>>118275334 It would honestly have to be something other than CR. They're too plagued with issues to ever advance to the sort of service I would actually pay money for. That and I would never be able to trust them as a company, either.
>>118275278 >All downloads unlimited and always available in DDL or torrent gross xdcc master race also on a semi related note, after using subscriptions I can't not handle my anime automatically downloading, manual downloading is for plebs
What if instead of paying for the anime/manga via shitty subscriptions you sent a direct donation to the creators? I'm sure it'd be awkward with legalities but I'm sure a lot of people would be willing to do it.
>>118275412 I'd honestly just prefer to download everything directly if the speeds weren't shit. And I prefer to check and download manually for a few reasons but to each their own.
>>118275417 Yes which is part of the issue about offering a decent service outside of nipland. The elevens worry that their own consumers would turn to the foreign services instead of paying their ridiculous prices.
Though at the same time, those ridiculous BD prices are sort of what is keeping the industry afloat considering the consumer base is so numerically small.
>>118275506 dunno where you're downloading from but xdcc speeds max out my connection. Even then, as soon as the connection opens and it starts sending the file you can start playing it. No need to wait for full DL, assuming your DL speed is reasonable enough to stay ahead.
>>118275499 >if they charged a reasonable amount sales could easily go way.
Someone didn't take Economics 101.
Anime BDs (and other anime merchandise in general) are an extremely inelastic market, because it's very niche. Reducing the price by a lot will not benefit the industry as much as you think it would. The market price is set because that's where the equilibrium is, after all these years. Refer to pic related.
>>118275493 Sort of already happens. Just look at what went down with LWA2. Trigger raked in some serious cash from non-japanese consumers. It's a shame more don't follow a similar example. Though a medium other than kickshitter would be preferable.
>>118275546 I've never really messed with xdcc but with a DDL that isn't throttled my speed is faster than I can even really use.
>>118275575 nonsense, the market is just like that mainly due to the entry cost. I'm not saying make them $20 and call it a day but surely they can find a lower price but make up for it in sales numbers. Indie games found it with humble bundles. Not saying that's a perfect or ideal method. The problem about the high cost is because they're just using up a shrinking market share. Without having prices at a suitable level for impulse (or close to impulse) buys, you're just taking them to the cleaners time and time again, and eventually, the cash is gonna stop flowing.
Last DVD I buyfagged was the El Hazard collection, long awaited (at the time) and much hyped. The first 30 seconds of sub invalidated any claims about quality control.
Last manga I buyfagged was the first 14 volumes of Zetsubou Sensei. It's been stalled there for a few years, without any word as to whether it's been dropped, or delayed for some obscure legal reason, or whatever.
So yeah, fuck shelling out money to companies that pick up the official licenses.
>>118275797 Yeah volume releases suddenly stopping is why I never got into much manga buyfaggotry. What's the fucking point in owning a quarter of a series? Or releases that come out years after they are ever relevant?
>>118274183 >spends loads of times watching shitty cartoons >makes retarded excuses why not pay for it Why are you watching shit? >>118274212 >This is one of many retarded opinions in this thread. FTFY
>the encodes, although praised by the fansubbing community for finally getting their shit together after all these years, are still deemed as garbage encodes with shit tier bitrates and banding out the ass. You are PAYING for a poor quality streaming service.
>the translations are rushed and there is always a mistake or two in there. There is literally NO typesetting (or at least typesetting that would get a pass in QC).You are PAYING for typos, mis-translations, and horribly placed text.
>If money was actually going to the "Creators" based on the shows you watch, you'd constantly be getting multiple seasons of your favorite shows (aside from the big 3 which are inherently shit anyway) year after year. Bumoney doesn't go directly to the studios that actually made the product. First it get's split up into payroll for CR. Whatever is left goes to the publishers. That is to say, the TV stations which licensed the simulcast with CR to begin with. It gets split up and most of it goes to the TV station's payroll, and whatever crumbs are left get divided amongst the various anime studios that happen to have their work allowed to be shown on CR. Just like with music artists with big record labels in the states today, a majority goes to the publishers while the artists themselves get crumbs (hence everyone releasing their album online now). Don't get me wrong, the revenue in that industry is still huge, but when you compare licensing chinese cartoons to it; which is already a small enough niche market as it is, it's a drop in the bucket. you are PAYING for TV station employees in Japan. Not the actual creators directly.
>>118274598 But since you wouldn't remember watching it in the first place, you would likely watch it again and waste even more of your time. And then you want to forget watching it again so you pay even more money and the cycle continues
>>118276368 Thanks for the concession, idiot. At least stop spouting hypocritical bullshit when you spend all your waking hours watching 'shit'. >>118276435 >goyim-kun It's 'goy'. Goyim is plural, retard. If you want to play jew on teh interwebs at least do it properly.
>>118276512 By remembering finicky as fuck fansubbers who would drop shows for god knows what reason and no longer having to pray that a certain anime you wanna watch would get subbed since CR basically subs everything airing.
>>118276481 >fansubbing revives the anime Fansubs help introduce media to an audience that would not have seen it otherwise. Some of that audience then purchase BDs/ect. bringing in profit that would otherwise not have occurred.
>>118276448 The problem with voting with your wallet is it doesn't really work in an area with a large number of people. Take vidya for example, want to boycott the next bordermemes? They don't give a fuck, there are 500,000 other people begging to throw their money at the game. Normals are content with shit.
>watch roosterteeth stuff (mainly podcasts) >they openly talk about crunchyroll/naruto/korra/fairy tail last one's partially because one of their VA's is working on the dub >even the weebs of the company do It hurts, they're such god damn normalfags.
>In Japan, you can watch anime live on tv for free and never buy any merchandise or BDs or anything >With modern digital boxes, you can record your favorite episodes and never delete them, so they're on demand 24/7 >Somehow exposing global audiences to your product with fansubbing isn't similar to giving it away for free on Japanese TV
"Legally" watching anime nowadays means either upt up with CR/Funi streams (which are shit, can't download, the selection isn't the same worldwide and you have to pay for it), watching dubs (terrible 99% of times, plus coming years after the actual anime airing and only a minuscle amount of shows gets dubbed, usually the most popular and likely shit ones) or importing BDs (which means adapting to otaku absurd pricing, plus shipping fees, and most of the time aren't subbed).
The only one i'd consider would be the last one, but that would mean paying 70-90 euros (depeding on release and shipping location) for 2-4 episodes, likely not subbed.
The best thing would be have "foreign" BD releases market with our price standards and incorporated subs, but that's not happening. For a lot of reasons, from >>118276124 to the usual "Who cares about anything outside glorious Nippon" attitude.
Personally i expect the bubble to pop sooner or later though. Having the industry being supported by the small dedicated otaku fanbase willing to spend thousands of bucks (in yen, i mean) for a couple of shows isn't sustainable in the long-term to me.
>>118277321 >>118277329 TV ads don't matter. Their methods are different from the western ones, so ads do shit for anime. And they are really just ads airing during another ad is airing (the anime itself). Even if it is original what you are watching on the TV is still nothing but an ad for the BDs and merchandise.
>>118277760 Does the average citizen really have more to fear from an assault rifle than a handgun anyway? Either one will make you dead as shit, and the handgun is much easier to conceal anyway, usually more obvious if a guy is carrying a rifle.
>>118277711 Thanks, anon. Everything there is mine, yeah.
I usually buy them at Kinokuniya (overpriced as fuck) whem I'm in the US, or bulk buy while in Japan. They're especially cheap as fuck at places like book-off. I once got the first four volumes of watamote (pristine condition) for less than 4 bucks.
>>118276124 And this is why their industry is dying and not making money.
A simple illustration, if a series cost a studio £1mil to make, and they sell 5k BDs to the domestic nip market, then they would need to be priced at $200 each to break even.
If they sold the same series to everyone in the world, they could potentially get 50k copies sold, then to break even they just need to sell at $20 each, a much more reasonable price. Yes that price would include their domestic customers so there would be no "back-importing".
If you look at the wider industry, catering for a larger market ALWAYS beats serving a niche.
>>118277971 Maybe if they didn't price them so high they would sell more copies though. The problem is that they've effectively priced everyone but the most hardcore fans out of the medium. And yeah, if they lowered their prices the sales wouldn't increase proportionally overnight, because people are still used to not buying that stuff, but over time I think it would. Studios just aren't willing to take the temporary loss in sales for a long-term more sustainable business model.
>>118277971 The transition isn't as easy as you might think, and even if we're talking about "the whole fucking world fanbase" vs "domestic dedicated otaku supporters" there's no clue about how much interest there actually would be for physical releases of subbed-only anime. Nips hate taking risks.
>>118278007 >Maybe if they didn't price them so high they would sell more copies though. I think that some shows tried to lower the BD prices and didn't observe any noticeable change in sales. Sure, there's a lot more into it that price alone (actual show quality, extras like tickets/artbooks, etc) but as long as for them "It works" they won't change the system.
Spot on, although I don't think it will take too long for the market to adapt to new lower prices. For example if they released BD sets for some of my favourite series tomorrow locally for $20 I'd snatch them up instantly. And many here would do the same.
Why they don't take that risk and potentially win big is beyond me...
>>118278064 I'm fairly certain there are more than 50k people in the world willing to shell out $20 for a BD boxset. 50k people out of the entire population is practically nothing, and anime isn't as an obsecure hobby as you think. It will involve a potentially fairly risky first launch to get an idea of customer numbers (risk reduced by careful market analysis), but you can't win big if you don't take risks.
Also the reason it didn't work is because they didn't cut prices enough. A $200 boxset marked down to $150 isn't likely to attract much more sales. They need to be much more aggressive in pricing tactics.
>>118278145 >makes people more aware of its existence >1000 new people become aware >996 of those still continue to pirate because why the fuck not? >4 start buying shit >EPIC WIN I don't care for content producers and I pirate 95% of my shit but I find these kinds of excuses ridiculous. >we're not pirating were doing free advertising for everyone
>>118278064 >I think that some shows tried to lower the BD prices and didn't observe any noticeable change in sales.
Well obviously it's not going to change overnight. The people who aren't buying BDs right now aren't just going to one and all start buying them the instant prices drop, it's simply not how things work.
However once the market has had time to adapt I think they will find a lot more interest if the price were lower, with eventually more money for everyone. It's just difficult to get there since no one wants to be the one losing money while they're waiting for it to happen.
Music artists get most of their income from concerts, the ones spouting shit about piracy are the archaic, worthless jew record companies.
Movies get most of their income from theatrical releases, the profit from dvds is absolutely marginal. If a movie flops financially, it's because nobody went to see it in theatre, not because nobody bought the dvds.
Software companies get money from publishers, so they lose no money because of piracy. The reason why software piracy exists is because it is extremely overpriced and often has a fucktarded DRM model. https://www.adobe.com/products/catalog/software._sl_id-contentfilter_sl_catalog_sl_software_sl_mostpopular.html Paying jewdobe every month to use their program? u wot m8?
This. I have 2 of those letters sitting on my counter right now. Been torrenting for years and nothing has ever happened. I'm just waiting for the FBI to come crashing into my house with a swat team in the middle of the night.
>>118278380 It boils down to wether or not the market is elastic. I'm not an economist but I'm sure with a little help from a professional the owners of these studios can determine the market elasticity and determine a price accordingly.
Also the nip market may be saturated, but I'm sure as hell the international market isn't. Also they have like zero competition which helps aggresive growth.
>>118278145 Videogames I know, but >Dragon Age Inquisition uses an uncracked DRM >Mysteriously on track to sell the least out of any of the titles Look at all those lost sales they're now making money from!
>>118278695 Oh I know that the game is just as shit as it's always been, but it's nice to see that they can't use 'muh lost sales/piracy' as an excuse for things selling horribly any more, and it's a pretty surefire sign that no, piracy doesn't magically ruin your sales.
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