Okay, I've read Fate and Unlimited Blade Works and both were awesome, a great ride and a complete different experience compared to the anime (both old and new). Now I'm reading Heaven's Feel and the Shadow fucking killed my Saber.
Then Shirou gets home and this Sakura CUNT said some shit like: "I'm glad she's gone! She forced you to do such reckless things!"
I'm done with that bitch. I forced Saber to fight the Shadow, and she died trying to protect me, and then this bitch says disrespectful stuff to the one that fought with me for two routes even when I wasn't her Master (UBW)?
FUCK OFF SAKURA. I can't read anymore for today after this, it's such a fucking letdown.
Pic related, best girls.
Everybody knows that Sakura a shit.
Sakura being shit is nothing new, she is the worst part of HF.
Shinji never hinted at him raping Sakura. Also, I'm sure Sakura would have confessed to Shirou that she was fucking his "best friend". How could she hide that from him? It wasn't Shinji.
Maybe you should actually try to understand the characters, rather than "This BITCH".
Sakura thought Saber was putting him in danger because she knew what servants were, and was afraid he'd die. She met Saber maybe two days ago, she's known this guy for years, she doesn't want him to die if it can be helped. She was worried for him, that was legit. She wasn't glad Saber died, she was just glad he wasn't in danger anymore. Sakura doesn't understand the situation fully since she's not there for all of it, all she knows is he's in a war where he might die any day.
She's not trying to be a cunt, nor is she trying to be mean. People are too deadest on first reactions to see where characters are coming from these days. I mean there's so many ways I can say that this sort of reading is just half-assed.
Saber isn't even dead, she shows up a few days later.
You find out some stuff in HF; Sakura keeps all her dark shit in the closet so she can live in the light with Shirou at least a few hours a day, and have a soul again when she's around him. She doesn't want to appear dirty in front of him, because around him she can still be human.
Sold by her father when she was seven years old, raped by the man who took her in for ten years, he then convinced her brother who she initially got along with to also rape her, man who took her in put a piece of an ancient devil in her for funsies to see what would happen after the end of the fourth war when it was released briefly, it's an experiment to see how much a soul can take before it breaks down completely in a sense.
Yet, oddly enough she wouldn't break down, and after meeting Shirou she found hope again. Yet even if she knows he's the nicest guy that won't look at her differently if he hears this, she still doesn't want him knowing the truth, and seeing him in a different light while she can still be normal around him.
>Shadow killed Saber
Worst girl has to die sometimes, too.
Sounds like you're ragequitting the game pretty hard, so it doesn't seem like much of a spoiler since you're done.
Also this is /a/
Stay out of threads until you're done if you don't want that.
Our first look at Sakura chronologically is in Distortion. Sadly that information is twisted by Shinjivision. However, we can get the following fact from it.
Sakura knew that magecraft was a big deal for Shinji, and hid from him that he was being fooled. Her knowing that it was important to him is obvious from:
>A) the fact that she avoided looking him in the eyes.
>B) Her repeated apologies on the matter.
At the beginning of the Grail War, the following is true of all routes
Sakura knows that Shirou is part of the Holy Grail War. Despite this, she never talks to him about it despite the fact that it’s immediately obvious to everyone that he’s out of his depth.
So, Sakura is willing to let Shirou, someone that she loves, get into a fight to the death without proper information because she’s afraid of what he’d think of her.
In fact, Sakura takes no actions whatsoever toward the Holy Grail War unless Shirou shows a romantic interest toward her. This includes multiple cases of Rider killing Shirou throughout the routes. She could have just told Rider not to attack Shirou.
Now, in fairness, she did make Shinji promise not to kill Shirou in Heaven’s Feel. However, that doesn’t really reflect well on her as a person, because it means she only cares enough to do so if Shirou picks her over Rin and Saber.
This leads us to the next thing about Sakura common in all the routes.
She knows about Bloodfort, and ignores it; basically dooming everyone else in the school to die to avoid getting hurt herself. (And, really, she probably wouldn’t even get hurt if she didn’t let it happen considering it’s not like Shinji can bypass Rider and I doubt Zouken cares.)
Specifics of Zouken caring or not aside, I don’t think anyone can say that letting an entire school get melted when you could prevent it by all of telling Rider not to do that is the action of a good person.
Onward to Heaven's Feel.
Sakura doesn’t acknowledge the Shadow’s actions as her own until Nightmare, awakening, so until that point they can’t be used to judge her character.
Let’s thus move on to Matou Sakura (IV). That scene gives us two more facts.
Sakura, while willing to let Shirou kill her, still manipulates his emotions to stop him from doing so. That is to say, Sakura herself doesn’t think she should die; her guilt in that scene comes from manipulating Shirou. She only accepted that, if Shirou wanted to kill her, it was probably correct.
On to Last Piece, in which she murders Shinji. Now, Shinji was pretty nuts by that point so let’s not pass judgment on the act of killing itself.
Sakura, after killing him, feels no guilt and only thinks that she should have done so earlier.
She realizes fully at that point that she killed all those people as the Shadow, and her reaction is to find it funny and think that she should keep going. The scene even makes it a point to note that this is her own will.
>The girl’s consciousness ends here.
>No, to be more accurate, it changes.
>It’s merely that her subconscious has risen to the surface.
Those are thus definitely Sakura’s actions and thoughts, and by consequence the events of Sacrilege – Sisters (VI) are as well. To her credit, she does hesitate just short of killing Rin so I guess that sequence of events just has Sakura enjoying torturing someone weaker than herself while on a power trip and then trying to kill both Shirou and Rin.
People don't bitch when Medea dies in Fate route after one scene, people don't bitch when Rider dies after one scene, yet when it's Saber suddenly its an issue.
Route system is sort of set up where you're bound to be a bit more shafted in some route, and a bit more favored in another route. That's how character development is split up.
Death of a Saint doesn’t add anything of note, aside from once more affirming that yes, this is definitely Sakura and not someone controlling her.
After Rin opts not to kill her in Sister (VII), things change again.
Sakura feels guilty for having killed (or not, but she thinks so) Rin, someone who was just nice to her and proved that she loved her. Now Sakura is willing to kill herself, and Angra Mainyu starts taking action.
We reach the first end, Cherry Blossoms Dream.
Sakura certainly does feel guilty to the point that she basically goes into nutty denial mode, but only at Shirou’s death.Notably, not once in the VN does Sakura seem to actually feel guilt for anyone’s death except Shirou and Rin...and even then, only if Shirou and Rin were being nice to her at the time they died. (She sure feels no remorse for torturing Rin in Femme Fatale.)
So yeah, all evidence seems to point to Sakura only caring about people’s lives if they’re people she both knows personally and that are nice to her all the time.
The closest thing we get is her vaguely mentioning guilt in HF’s True End, but that’s all; no sign that she felt motivated to do anything by that ‘guilt’.
So in summary: Stops herself from feeling anything at the death of people she knows, makes no effort to save Shirou unless he reciprocates her love, lets Shinji gello the school they go to, feels no guilt for killing tons of people, enjoys torturing people she doesn't like, and only shows regret if she kills someone who shows that they loved her at the moment she kills them.
Yeah, I think a case can be made that Sakura is a pretty awful person.
>>She knows about Bloodfort, and ignores it;
Nasu confirmed recently, no she doesn't. Nasu in fact confirms that if she knew she would have stopped it, which is why Rider kept it a secret. Also confirmed that she had no idea it was a thing when she herself was trapped in it when it was activated at the school.
>Rider invoked Blood Fort Andromeda despite Sakura being in the school. If the barrier was sustained, would Rider have went to save Sakura even if it meant disobeying Wakame [Seaweed, Shinji's nickname]? <Teacher Blossom>
>Takeuchi: I'm actually wondering about that too.
>Nasu: I hate to be mean, but Sakura has enough magical energy such that she would only be in a coma. To Rider that's not a problem, which is why it was done in secret from Sakura. Had she talked to Sakura instead, it would have become much more chaotic like "stop her brother → her brother becomes more of a Wakame."
It's old pasta, I was there when someone posted it for the first time. It's still very informative though. It's a good sign when someone can be argued against so passionately.
Heaven's Feel was always best route but Sakura has never been best girl.
Sakura isn't the protagonist there, she is the plot device that keeps the story moving. The real protagonist in terms of having a satisfying character arc is Ilya, who comes to see that her father didn't abandon her, and that she has a brother who actually cares for her, and in the end she gives her life to save him. She's the real hero there.
Old pasta even, it's that one guy that usually posts it. Usually posts those strange worm edits.
Not as old as that one pasta though about Shinji, or the counter pasta to it. HF has a lot of pasta.
>true assassin lived in the desert
>this means he has innate wind resistance
10/10, not an asspull at all, Nasu.
Well that's certainly your opinion, there are a few things probably wrong with it but you're allowed to have it.
People say she's not a character at all a lot; what they usually mean is they don't like her character or aren't into it, but clearly she is a character. Seems passive but can have a real stubborn streak, sly, secretive, jealous prone, tends to put her all into hobbies once she takes them on, chastises herself when she messes up than simply looking to fix why she messed up at times which Saber says she's similar in, the person who puts herself down the most at times yet has a sometimes sadistic streak.
It's not all good, its not all bad, but she is a character and a protagonist. The fact that you don't have to agree with all of it is kind of proof its there. That's one of the more foolish complaints I see there at times. Ilya wasn't the real protagonist, that was still Shirou. Just because she has a dynamic going on there, you could say the same about Kotomine, Rin, Sakura, Zouken, or Shirou in the same breath.
All of them have a dynamic going on and a character arc that converges heavily there.
You go through the desert all the times with searing winds, tell me if you don't try to make precautions against the elements to shield yourself.
It's not even innate, it's a skill that's similar to a charm he wears.
>i have water resistance, because it rains sometimes
>i have fire resistance, because it's hot sometimes
>i have ice resistance because sometimes it's winter
>i have earth resistance because it's what i live on
>ironically not liking Saber
You can't fool me anon I know you love her
While I don't think Sakura is on the level of Saber and Rin, she's still not the horrible person everyone makes her out to be.
Saber grew up to be a king, was raised as a knight, had strong counsel, a real and actual support system.
Rin meanwhile has financial independence but has to care for her mother. She is left with her father's workshop, guidance, and still has connections to the rest of her extended family.
Neither of their upbringings are particularly sorrowful and neither of them received poor guidance.
Sakura grows up in a house where she is continuously abused, goes through training akin to torture, and the people who should support her instead exploit her, hurt her, and desire her sexually. She does not even have a refuge or any sort of safe place for most of her life-- Shinji isn't just there at her home, he is at her school and he also joins the archery club and basically forces Shirou out of it, so you can assume her whole life he's been stifling her nearly everywhere.
So, Sakura finally finds one small bit of happiness in her life when she is able to visit Shirou's house. This is the only place where people are not actively abusing her or passively threatening her that she has had in the 15 to 16 years of her life. She finally gets a very small glimpse of something normal, safe, and not violent or scary.
If either Rin or Saber win Shirou, Sakura loses the only happiness in her life and what she sees as the only possibility to escape her situation. Neither Rin or Saber have that much downside to not winning Shirou. They have other paths in their lives/afterlives that are not horrible.
Saber and Rin are capable of being as great as they are because they were provided with the platforms to do so. Sakura has maybe a few hours of actual normality/happiness to work with. So I think people are just being mean and blaming a victim.
It's not "Oh I'm immune to water because it rains", stop being stupid.
It's "Oh the elements are always battering down on us, so we make precautions against them using simple charms and talismans, or by invoking the name of our god. It's always harmful to us so we seek some remedy, and we have found it, and it has manifested to us in the form of a skill upon being summoned".
It's not "I'm Heracles so I grew immune to...", fuck that's stupid to think that. It's "In the desert in order to survive, we needed to find some protection against the winds. We sought a charm created or imbuned from the elemental Jinn to protect us, in basically the same way Saber also has protection against wins, but in reverse".
They flat out say its not innate, rather its a charm that any one of his horde knew to carve and remember to protect them in that harsh environment.
Because the Sakura defense force loves to make paragraphs and vice versa the only way you can fight their paragraphs is through paragraphs. They think everyone misunderstands her character when in reality they do they just don't like her.
Kariya never told her he was going to help, he didn't want to get her hopes up too much in case he failed.
As far as she knew he was just the Uncle who was nice to her before, then looked really sickly, then died in front of her randomly. Ironically his death only put the shackles on her tighter, as she thought his death was a message from Zouken about what happens to those that try to seek help or run.
If he had survived a few minutes later, maybe.
Pretty sure the hate paragraphs always came first. Lot of the ones you're thinking about probably aren't copypasta in the sense that they aren't posted and reposted, but the one posted earlier that goes on for three or four posts, that's legit copypasta that's pretty old.
The ones you're thinking of aren't copypasta, those are just stupidly long winded posts.
Copypasta is when someone posts something, and it gets reposted, and reposted, and reposted until it becomes a thing; there's nothing like that which defends Sakura as character.
Try to find one
Yes because no one wants to copy the defense paragraphs of Sakura and repost them. I have seen quite a bit of some good Sakura defense paragraphs that could be copied and pasted over and over but no one does it. Pasta is born through a community.
Saber did come back, it was an entire thing, she was one of the last two servants to die in the route thus living up to Rin's proclamation at the beginning of the game "Saber in every war always makes it to the last round".
She even got a special ending in the route; other servants in the game died after one scene and never showed up again, no one said it was bullying in that case, Saber even when she died she came back for the rest of the route until the end, yet in this case Saber gets very special treatment and its still not good enough. You'll hate Sakura forever because Saber died in this route at the same time she died in Fate route?
She even got an extra special ending after the route, and people think she was shafted at all?
Controversial subject; some will forever hate and will throw shit at any chance, others will defend with long lines of text, and people get caught in the middle.
moot said it best during his eight hour thing, 4chan is all about "Stop liking what I don't like". Except in the case of Fate its an endless loop.
I hate how saber died as an alter saber, when she's corrupted. I mean until shirou killed her i hoped saber regain her former self as she dying and say farewell or whatever.. But she just died like that..
Illya truly is best girl in HF. So many moments where I just wanted to hug her. She really does act like a big sister to Shirou quite a bit in that route (noted by her saying it at the end).
>implying you aren't going to cry when this gets animated
>Route system is sort of set up where you're bound to be a bit more shafted in some route, and a bit more favored in another route
Except for Rin.
You know who I like? Shinji.
Why do I love Shinji so much? It's pretty simple when I think about it. Shinji isn't just the best character in the series, he might just be the greatest character of all time. Just imaging him walking through Fuyuki, all the ladies swoon at his very scent. They know how he smells, the essence of his smell is sold under the the name of "Matou Orgasm." The very nature of Shinji is mystery. could he be playing a deeper game than even his creator realizes? The answer is yes, he has transcended such boundaries as the written world, and has free will to do whatever he sees fit. However, Shinji is filled with such guile, such arcane craft that he does not even use these powers. Why, you might ask? You will never know, for the mind of the Shinji is not one that is easily penetrated. Shinji is such a force of nature in his realm that nothing can truly touch him, the only thing keeping him bound to the page at all is his will to exist within the preordained boundaries of his world. Shinji is not only beyond the comprehension of us, he exists within a plane of true focus and beauty. Observe his playful smile, his gourgeous and rippling biceps, his gallant nose, and most importantly, his eyes. His eyes, like pools of sapphire, provide the only glimpse into the true machinations of Shinji. Do not stare into them. Many good men have gone mad in the attempt. Shinji is not just a character, a formless collection of words and images, he is himself is the binding that holds the saga together. Without Shinji, the entire Fate series as we know them crumbles.
These are just of a few of the reasons why I like Shinji so much.
>People don't bitch when Medea dies in Fate route after one scene
You mean the witch i just met and have absolutely no affinity for?
>people don't bitch when Rider dies after one scene
You mean the mass murderer that enjoys torturing people for sexual reasons?
>yet when it's Saber suddenly its an issue.
You mean the side character that has been defending the MC with all her might during the first 2 routes even when she has no obligation to do it?
I'm not even a Saber fag but comparing secondary antagonists death with a main heroine's death is pretty dumb.
Every other girl steps out of the plot for at least one route. Doesn't happen with Rin. You even play as her in the prologue.
Sakura is not the heroine of Heaven's Feel. She is simply a plot device/villain made to keep the story moving forward. She does not do anything worth calling her a heroine. Yes, she does in fact have sex with Shirou, not because she is the heroine, but because she is the love interest, two different things. This is also something that sets HF apart from Fate and UBW, the heroine and love interest are not the same person, like Saber or Rin.
You probably already guessed who the heroin of HF is, but before that you might be wondering, "Why did Nasu choose make the heroine and love interest in HF different but not in the other routes? He certainly had choices between rider, Caster, Ayako, Taiga, and so on." This is because, as we all probably know, there were originally mean to be four routes, not three. He was forced to merge the Illya and Sakura route for reasons. He always meant for Saber, Rin, Sakura, and Illya to have the same about of significance in the complete Fate/stay night story, but out of no where he had to axe either Sakura or Illya. He clearly did not want to do that so he found a way to bypass it, make one the love interest and the other the heroine, something he never considered for the other routes because he did not need to merge anything back then. And why is Illya the heroine? If you read HF you should already know, or just use google-
>A hero or heroine is a person or character who, in the face of danger and adversity or from a position of weakness, displays courage or self-sacrifice-that is, heroism-for some greater good.
I'm just trying to clear up a common misconception. Don't let disillusion Sakurafags fool you.
She exists to throw exposition at Shirou's face. half of the VN's pacing problems are because she doesn't shut up It's why she doesn't have a route.
Rin is actually a pretty fleshed out character though. She's like Shirou in that her development and characterization is spread throughout the whole story.
>implying Jack would even mention the names of others heroines in his post
You're giving him too much credit.
Why are the Realta Nua Openings so great?
>Sakura thought Saber was putting him in danger because she knew what servants were, and was afraid he'd die.
You'll understand how shitty this excuse is, once Wormslut tries to kill Shirou few chapters later.
You have to realize nobody has given a fuck about her other than Shirou and tsunRin.
She has no reason to give a fuck about any "others" in her life. The "others" are the ones who fucked her over. The people who had influence in her life other than Shirou were beyond horrible to her.
Sakura is a fucked up person but it's not like she lets Angra in until Shinji tries to rape her, something that was bound to push her over the edge. It's really sad to see people just dislike a character for the sake of it and ignore her situation and the circumstances that made it.
No, Illya has a route it's Sakura who is a stealing cunt.
>responding to copypasta
It's like you want to lose your time.
So does Lancer, Kirei, Archer, Illya and Saber(to a lesser extent in UBW)
She gets side lined in whats supposed to be her own route. When not showing Shirou her vaginal dolphins all she does is spout exposition.
That's bull and you know it. Her role is ridiculously more extensive than almost all of those characters, and marginally more than Saber.
She does stuff in every route and is always involved in the plot. I mean last week's episode had her going one on one against Caster. That's not exposition dumping.
That's the best couple shittaste-kun.
Yes: two delusional fuck ups paired together. What a great couple.
Better than a overdependent slut and a puppet.
wow good job she can deal with caster well done. Unfortunately at this point we have already seen Caster get treated like worthless trash in Fate and beaten rather effortlessly by Archer earlier in UBW and spared then later in HF she gets defeated by Zouken/Assassin so why should we take her as a legitimate threat?
She doesn't even defeat caster she gets a hit in and then gets manhandled by Kuzuki. Her "kill" then gets stolen by the real heroine of the route. Even if Rin had not hit Caster Archer only needed her as a distraction.
Rin accomplishes almost nothing on her own in UBW, her time to shine at the end to save Shinji has Archer shoot arrows to save her.
Wow didn't take me long before i could post this. Because this is a well known fact that Sakura is a Cunt. Always has been, always will be.
>wow good job she can deal with caster well done. Unfortunately at this point we have already seen Caster get treated like worthless trash in Fate and beaten rather effortlessly by Archer earlier in UBW and spared then later in HF she gets defeated by Zouken/Assassin so why should we take her as a legitimate threat?
What kind of argument is this? You can use that on just about every battle after Fate. Shirou takes on Archer? Wow, big deal, Berserker did it in Fate. Shirou takes on Gil? So? Saber already did. NLBW, the scene everyone hypes up as a big badass moment in HF, where Shirou takes on Berserker? Why is it interesting? Berserker's gotten his ass kicked repeatedly at this point. Hell, the last route, he got taken out by Gil, and Shirou took out Gil, so why is Shirou now taking out Berserker impressive?
It's a human taking on a servant, and she only didn't win because Shirou couldn't hold Kuzuki back.
Rin does plenty in UBW and gets developed fairly well along the way; she also gets developed throughout the entire rest of the VN. She's the deuteragonist.
Of someone she liked? Okay.