Bored salesman at work here. Slow day and feel like killing some time waiting for clients. Willing to help some /big/antines that want tips or training on general sales. (All sales are the same in principle.)
Some background on me: college dropout, 23, white male, selling timeshare. recently promoted to in-house sales. After promotion, making around $8,000 per month gross. Should increase as my time with the company grows and people are more comfortable handing me opportunities.
Will bump with random shit from my phone and stories from the floor.
Fucking autocorrect changed /biz/ to big. Disgusting.
>Be in meeting with client last month
>Things are going well, deal is pretty much a sure thing
>Working with senior representative as well
>Me and old man client are talking about fuck all. Conversation turns to Italian food and culture as my gf is from Italy
>"You two ever try that dago red? "
>I blank stare him and say no while fighting a laugh. Guy has no clue he just used a slur
>Senior rep is a woman who is very proud of her heritage
>"Did we ever have what?"
>"Dago red. All the Italians in my neighborhood used to drink it. It came in huge gallon jugs. Stuff was cheap."
>I put my head down on the desk and am visibly shaking from stifling my laughter
>Other rep is getting livid
>Old man has no clue his story about all the Italians drinking hobo wine on the stoops is offending her
>His wife turns to ask me why rep is getting annoyed
>Politely inform her that dago is an outdated racial slur
>"Oh. I'm just an old kraut. All I know is that we're supposed to call all the shines niggers now. "
>I lose it and immediately start laughing so hard I have to leave the table. This 80 year old German woman just dropped the fucking mic
>Tell old man I'm going to get contracts and we'll go out for some dago red after
>He says that sounds great
>Other rep softens after old man gives us $15,000
If you make people think they're funny, they'll like you; even if they have no clue why you're laughing. You're much more likely to deal with someone you like.
Friend wanted to go into real estate, so I figured I'd get my license as well for shits and giggles. He found the job, applied, and bombed the interview. He told me about it, I emailed the recruiter, got an interview, nailed it, and got hired. It's sales, so they'll pretty much give anyone a shot. Keep in mind that I'm only making this much because I'm actually selling. There are people here making less than the minimum wage.
A little difficult at first. I'm reserved and logical, which lends a lot of credence and authority to my pitch, but smiling and having fun is pretty much 70% of any sale, so that aspect took some time. You HAVE to be outgoing.
The best advice I can give is to study. Sales is the easiest and worst posting job in the world, or the hardest and best paying; it's up to you which. I made this my life. I go home and pitch in the mirror or read all of our copy for any sort of edge I can give myself. You need to put the hours in. I'm only at work about 30 hours a week, but I'm thinking about work most of the time I'm awake.
I guess commitment would be the best advice I can give you. Second best would be to smile.
Green text is such a bitch on my phone. I don't want to bump with stories, but I've got done good ones I'll post once I'm home or cut.
Slow days are the worst because only the very top reps get out. I'm working my way up, but have only been in my new position about 2 months. I'm competing with people that have made $30,000 for the month already. You'll learn that in sales there's a small percentage that takes almost all the income, a dead area, and then a ton of people at the bottom. Generally if you're in the middle, you're working your way towards being one of the top dogs. Always try to learn from them, as they usually want others to succeed and will talk your ear off. Most people are willing to help you out. Don't scoff at it.
It's very cut throat, and it's just something nice to keep in your back pocket. I have mine because the state requires it to sell timeshare. And while I can't directly ask another real estate professional what their commission structure is (collusion), the prevailing rate in my area is about 6%.
>getting insurance license this weekend
>already have 14 companies for auto and home from a mentor/friend who already runs a independent company
Can't wait to shill the fuck out of my family, friends, the local politicians that i volunteered for over the years and the local car guys. Good portion already know and made comments to call them when i'm finally greenlit
Careful that you actually set them up correctly. You really don't want to shaft family and friends. As a rule, you should really never sell them anything directly. They will blame you at the drop of a hat and expect you to fix any issues.
Can't help you as far as finding or generating leads, as mine are given to me. But I'm assuming B2B sales. As far as cold calling, you have less than a minute to hook someone, so know your biggest hook going into it.
>Assume they want to talk to you
Why wouldn't they? You've got a great product. Asking someone to listen to you is the quickest way to a "no" there is.
>Never pitch your product. Pitch what it can do/ what its benefits are
Nobody wants to be sold, but everyone wants to find a great opportunity and take advantage of it. If you tell me you're selling software that utilizes blah blah blah, I'm not going to give a shit. If you tell me you have a way to increase my efficiency 15% with only a small initial outlay and no significant changes, I'll listen. I may even ask to buy.
>Never ask a yes or no question
Your initial questions can't have one word answers. They should be open ended. Get them talking.
>Use their name incessantly
The most important word you can say is their name. It makes people feel important. The most important question you can ask is "Why?".
There are statistically 5 noes before a yes. Something like 90% of sales people give up on the fourth no. They should be hanging up on you, not asking for the call to end. You will be told no. Don't give a damn about it. I have spreadsheets from when I started literally full of what I did wrong. Learn from your mistakes.
I'm on my phone, so sorry for the word vomit. I'll add more, but this is popping into my head first, so up on the board it goes.
>What were you going to college for?
English and general business.
>How much does the top guy make where you work?
Our VP is salaried around $400k. Director of sales gets something like $200k with performance incentives. Top rep made $480k after taxes his best year and regularly clears $30k a month. He'll make around $40 this month, though. CEO makes $4.2mm.
>How do you spend your money?
Hookers and blow. Pretty much just hitting the bars once or twice a week is my only deviance. I save mostly. I will splurge on suiting, though, as I view that like an investment in myself. Currently saving up for the down payment on a car and a nice cushion before renting a new place. I would buy a house, but advancement in the company goes hand in hand with relocation, so I'd rather not tie myself down.
the company has a huge selection of products, its B2B sales for small-medium sized companies.
They sell anything IT related - hardware (from printers to huge data centres) and software (office products / licenses etc.)
you basically start off with a small account and you have to bring in new business.
Position is around 35-40k salary and commission is based on Gross Profit from sales
I'd say learn your product front to back like a religion. With experience, you'll be able to learn what to pitch to each costumer. I can't give you much more without industry knowledge or more info about your particular products. Pick the brains of the senior staff without trying to come off like you want to steal their business.
You have a salary, so sales shouldn't be that difficult to get. Good luck, anon.
As they're doing their other transaction, make small talk. They will invariably ask you how your day is going. I'm sure there's some copy near your desk showing the card and its benefits.
>It's okay. Just sort of swamped processing all the apps for our new card. When did you get yours?
They'll either say when, or say they don't have it. You need to stop what you're doing and feign genuine befuddlement as to that response. Ask them why as you get an app. Mention nothing but the benefits as you hand them the app to fill out. Assume the sale. People have a hard time putting on the brakes once the ball is in motion like that. The key is acting like you just fell into that conversation. You should be able to bring any subject into mention of the card.
Day off and I'm on the laptop. Can fuck around, answer questions, and do some greentext.
Charlie was one of our reps for a brief time period. He used to be a partner at a Wall St. firm. I called BS on that immediately after meeting him, but he had the money, connections and knowledge to back it up. He was doing this for some side income after his ex raped him in a divorce. Charlie wasn't used to the kind of clientele that one gets in frontline timeshare sales.
>Sits down with elderly woman
>Hi how are you... etc.
>"Let me stop you right there, slick. I've gotta tell you about... Is that a Rolex?"
>"Don't worry about what it is. You were saying?"
>"Well now just hold on. If you've got one of them Rolexes, I think they're paying you too much money."
>Charlie realizes this probably isn't going to be a tour that goes anywhere, so he doesn't care about smoothing over that objection particularly well
>"Nah. They pay me in gum. The watch is a fake and I spend money like a jackass. What was it you needed to tell me?"
>"Well that's good to hear. And I can't eat the breakfast you guys are offering because it'll give me the runs."
>This woman is about 65, wearing a kitten sweater in July, sweats, and is about 100lbs overweight
>I'm in the cubicle next to him and immediately start listening more intently
>"Sorry to hear that. We have some muffins and-"
>"No. No. I ain't having none of it until you put me in a room with a better shitter."
>"Yesterday, I was on the john squirting it out, and you got the damn TP too far away. I go to lean off the bowl and I fall. Well you put the damn john in some stupid cubby hole, and I got wedged between the bowl and the wall."
>I look over the wall. Charlie is nodding politely and assuring her that these are very valid complaints as the tries to avoid calling this woman trash
>"So now I'm stuck on the floor, pants off, shit on my ass, and I still have to go because I got the squirts."
>"I laid there for hours just crapping all over myself because your housekeeping can't be bothered to check on the guests frequently enough."
>"Well that's just unacceptable. I'll go talk to my manager right now and get a complaint form for you to fill out."
>"You're the first person to talk any sense around here."
>Charlie gets up and I follow to our manager's desk to hear the exchange
>"Where the fuck are we getting these tours?"
>"What's wrong Charlie?"
>"Nothing. I'm just sitting across the table from human garbage. Anon is next to me; he hears this shit. I don't want to talk to some gutter person about her shitting all over the walls. I'm getting rid of her."
>He looks at me
>"You can only hear her. I've gotta smell the broad."
>Manager- "Get her to fill out a credit inquiry. If it comes back bad, you can spin her out."
>Of course she has decent credit, so he has to actually attempt to sell her.
>Gets through the whole thing, then at the end is told that while it all seems great, she's suspicious that Charlie has Jew in him, and "I don't deal with no Jews."
>Feel bad for Charlie. He went from clients with millions to people that can't swing $10,000
He quit a few months after that to manage a Mercedes dealership. Still emails me asking if I have $60,000 to take a 25% stake in a new brokerage with him. I occasionally go on the bid and offer of a penny stock him and his old partners manipulate to fuck with him. That usually prompts angry phone calls.
> I occasionally go on the bid and offer of a penny stock him and his old partners manipulate to fuck with him.
I'm sorry, I don't understand. He and his partners are manipulating a penny stock, and you did what?
I manipulate it as well just to fuck with him. They basically only do it when they need a few hundred bucks for a night out. He taught me how to do it, and it's incredibly transparent when it's the insiders dicking around. They literally email each other to set it up. The thing has such low volume that you pretty much know who is doing it. Around $2,000 can make it pop 50%.
Can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not.
If you're that anon, I could flesh out that pitch a bit for you and go into the principles behind it and why it should work. People are pretty much robots. I was told this when I first started selling, but now I completely understand. There are basically autonomic (Wrong word, I know. Don't be a pedant.) responses to certain questions, and once you know how to set it up, you can make a person say and think most things you want them to.
Well, if I was the one trying to get app sign ups, I'd say that while getting the app the guy lucked out. The shifts are about to change, and I'll toss him on top of the pile as a favor. People generally identify with irreverence for workplace protocols. People also love to deal with those that they think are similar to them. It's a numbers game; that ploy doesn't work with everyone.
The reason you'd say that you're stuck processing these apps is that it implies a large number of people have filled one out. There's a principle called social proof that helps most people make their decisions whether they realize it or not.
>Social proof, also known as informational social influence, is a psychological phenomenon where people assume the actions of others in an attempt to reflect correct behavior for a given situation. This effect is prominent in ambiguous social situations where people are unable to determine the appropriate mode of behavior, and is driven by the assumption that surrounding people possess more knowledge about the situation.
People are most vulnerable to it when they don't know which course of action to take or are otherwise confused. That's why you feign confusion. People generally mimic those whom they speak to (I can talk about how to play that to your advantage as well) and take cues from there. If I'm confused, you will be as well. Reiterating that everyone pretty much did it already and I'm surprised you've yet to just reaffirms that the correct course of action would be to get the card.
I get the application because I simply assume it's what you want. Why wouldn't you? This is pretty much standard procedure even if only 10% of people get it in reality. Once the app is in front of you, I say to fill it out and I'll try and toss you on top of the pile. You want to fill it out, but you know fuck all about the card. That's why you squash this trepidation by mentioning all the benefits as they're staring down the card app.
At this point, they'll use those benefits to rationalize a decision they've already made.
Now, one of two things will happen at this point. They'll either get the card smooth as silk, or they'll voice an objection. Objections can always be overcome. The most common I get to applying for cards (My position has one too, although my pitch there is substantially different to the point of being almost inapplicable here.) is:
> "I don't need another credit card."
>I understand completely. Look, nobody wants to have a ton of cards; that's why I'm not asking you to do that. I'm offering you the opportunity to get one that should really replace all your other cards. That's what everyone else has been doing with it because (pitch benefits here). You think I'd really try to just foist a card on you? C'mon man, I wouldn't do that to a fellow (whatthefuckever fan, Christian, Jew, hometown, out of stater. You should've found one of these earlier.)!
You won't get everyone. Not anywhere close. But something along those lines should net between twenty and thirty percent of people.
If there's anything in the copy that could allow me to legally state a take-away, that number would jump substantially.
>When you worked selling these card apps and what not, how much were you making, generally? Were there commissions?
You misunderstand. My current job offers a credit card. It helps with the down payment when people purchase. It's just hard to pitch a card with 18% interest when its express purpose is usually to carry thousands of dollars from a down payment. I make absolutely nothing on top of regular commission if they get the card. It just generally helps with the down payment. If I can get 30% of the total purchase price as a down, I get a larger commission, though.
And no worries about helping out. It's common that mot salesmen want to. It's stroking our egos a bit, but it also helps you to stay fresh and on top of things. You'll usually dig up a principle that you'd forgotten when teaching. It's why when some of the good reps go into a slump they'll offer to start teaching more frequently.
Protip: All this shit works on girls as well
>so when did you give your last BJ?
>what You Never did it? ( unbelieving voice)
>but everyone is giving blowjobs its totally in!
>nah im not Kidding you, i would Never do this to a waifu like you!
At Step 2 begin to pull your pants down and whip your dick around.
Close. Think more along the lines of some of the general stuff I've posted like never asking a yes or no question early on.
>Mind if I buy you a drink?
Weak. You're not asking from a position of strength.
>Hey there. My name's Anon. I'm going to buy you a drink, and while you enjoy it, I feel like you should talk to me for a bit.
A lot stronger. There's really no option as I assume she wants the drink. It also can't be answered with a yes or no. It either gets a drink order or a "why?".
The proper response to why is always "Y-you too."
Proper response to why: I just feel like talking
You've subtly made yourself the deciding factor
I wanted to get into car sales a while ago. Watched Glengarry twice, considered buying books
This is getting me interested again
Eh, my response to a why is always "why not?" Then you cut her off as she's about to give the negatives.
>The way I see it, in the worst case scenario, we have a stilted conversation over a cocktail for a few minutes. Turns out there's nothing here, and despite me being absolutely amazing, we don't click. (There should be some emphasis here to make it funny.) Best case? We get along great, I make you smile all night, and we leave here with each others' numbers. Now if the worst case scenario is a free drink with a handsome guy, I don't really see any reason not to just go for it.
Or just let her speak. I really only do it for fun at this point.
From what I hear, Glengary isn't that applicable. ABC is about it, but it's much more subtle than that.
I'll also say that sales is addictive. It's my day off and I'm lurking 4chan talking about selling and reviewing my pitch. I really wish I didn't have to take days off. I'd work seven days a week if I could.
Watched more (boiler room, wolf, wallstreet etc) but that was just my favorite
It may not be directly applicable but Al Pacino's and Ed Harris' characters are the ones to take notes off of
I like them, but there's generally too much grandstanding. I prefer to read psych books and journals. Mostly pop stuff, but it's more fun to base pitches off that than things people more than likely have heard. Nobody likes to be sold. Sounding like a salesman is the quickest way to be a bad one.
I just got a job at a used car lot that guarantees loan approval, the position is hourly, but if I pull in sales I get a commission. Any tips on working with people that feel they can't make the payments? Also my own observation, don't try to strait tell a lead that their concerns are wrong, focus on the positive aspects of what you are selling, don't try to change their mind on an opinion they have already formed.
>Any tips on working with people that feel they can't make the payments?
Tons. Just give me a little while to articulate it.
>Also my own observation, don't try to strait tell a lead that their concerns are wrong, focus on the positive aspects of what you are selling, don't try to change their mind on an opinion they have already formed.
If their concerns are hindering the sale, you can't let them continue to believe they're valid. You always start with "Great question" or "I understand completely, and that's a valid concern." You then smooth them over.
A common one you'll get will almost certainly be, "I love this car, but I don't think I can afford it." They might be right, but fuck 'em. What they're telling you is that they want to keep the money in their pocket more than they want the car.
>I understand completely, but you need a car, you told me yourself; I don't want you to settle. You're saying that you think this may be a little out of your range, so help me make it affordable for you."
At this point, you should do something we call a money line.
>Let's talk down payment. You may qualify for $0 down, but I'm a worst case scenario kind of guy. Our average client puts down anywhere from $3,000-$5,000. Now where in that range would you be comfortable?
Most people will say nowhere near there. Don't give them an out.
>Okay, so you can probably do it (nobody wants to feel broke), but it'd stretch you a bit more than you'd like. So is somewhere closer to $2,000 better for you?
Just walk them down until they're where they agree they can do it. Do the same thing with the monthly payment. These are huge buying questions, so make sure that you've built the value of this car really high and made sure they want it.
>So you'd be comfortable with $1,500 down and $250 a month?
>Okay, so if I can get my manager to agree to let this car go for that much, you're driving it off the lot, right? I need to know because I'm asking for a huge discount here. I want this for you, but don't make me go to bat for nothing.
Have some levity when saying that last part to ease off the pressure. These are pretty high pressure questions.
They'll either say they're in, or back off. Once you've busted out numbers, it's very hard to go back and build value again; that's why I've said make sure you've built the value of that car high as shit. I can explain how to do that later if you want.
If they say they're in, take it away from them.
>Alright. Good. Now keep in mind that I'm not promising anything here. This is a huge price cut, and I have no idea if we'll get it. But I want to make sure this is affordable, so if I can't get it where you need it to be, I'll be the first to tell you to walk. If I do, though, hey, you've got a new car.
Verbiage isn't exactly like this as I've had a few and typing is less fluid than speaking for me at this point, but it's close enough. I work with a few ex car dealers and the similarities are abundant. I think I've really got to go into the process of building value to truly help you, as that's where the sale is made.
> I think I've really got to go into the process of building value to truly help you, as that's where the sale is made.
Please do. So far this is a lot of things I have noticed our head of sales saying.
I'm looking at helping my friend get his coffee on shelves at local/small gourmet and organic food stores. I haven't sold a thing in my life, but I'm passionate about good coffee. Can you offer some advice on selling to a small grocer?
I would also like to say that I didn't mean that their concerns should be ignored, just for instance when someone says that they don't believe the cars are properly maintained, it would be wrong to just say "Well they are ,nigger."
Sure. Verbiage is huge in sales. Something called affective words are your best friend. This is where you learn why every salesman uses a few of the same words over and over.
You never tell somebody something. You always share it.
>If I could share one thing with you, do you mind if I do that Mr. Smith, it'd be this...
You don't think something. Nobody gives a dam what you think. You feel it.
>I feel like this car suits you more than anything else we have on the lot.
The car doesn't cost $10,000; it's worth $10,000
>Now this car is worth $10,000; but I feel like we could work on that.
Some other phrases and words:
>The benefit to you is...
>Literally any emotional word
That's how you're going to speak from now on. When talking about the car, put them in the picture, and ask questions that make them take ownership.
>Can't you see yourself cruising down the road in this?
>Don't you deserve a beautiful ride like this?
Make them take ownership
>When you get the keys, where do you think the first place you're going to drive it is?
Notice I said "when," not "if." This kind of speaking and verbiage keeps them in an emotional state of mind; it helps shut out logic and makes the sale much easier.
If there are any cons to the car you're showing, present them early and then immediately follow with a huge positive to negate that objection.
>Sure it's got a few miles on it, but you know how German/Asian/Domestic cars are known for being reliable. Just look at how great you thought the ride was. Plus we have a warranty so you don't have to worry about any of that.
You're asking questions and squashing objections throughout the whole process so that when numbers come out, there's no way to say no. Also notice that every question I've asked has a yes answer? It's hard to say yes to a person for hours and then turn around and hit them with a no.
I know what you meant; don't worry, anon.
Speaking of niggers, be sure to mimic your customers. I don't mean parrot or mock them, but match the cadence of their speaking or subtly match the tone of their voice. If you find them using certain words a lot, use them too. They will subconsciously like you more.
See a cross on their neck? Pepper in a God bless somewhere or offer to pray for someone when they inevitably tell you a story about a friend or relative going through a rough spot.
Sports shirt? That's your favorite team or a a rival. Play it to your advantage.
First couple minutes of talking should just be you desperately digging for common ground like a lunatic. Just don't make it obvious. These people need to think you're like them.
Always offer them something, too. Coffee, donuts, water, soda. Look up the reciprocity principle.
I just realized I'm kind of working backward through the steps of the sale here. Gonna post a few tidbits as I think of them, but that's a pretty brief rundown of some common techniques and principles.
Lead off by showing them one of the higher priced cars on the lot, by the way. It builds the value of your business. They think they're dealing with a reputable and high end business. It also makes it much easier to stomach a price that's more than they wanted come closing time.
>I haven't sold a thing in my life, but I'm passionate about good coffee. Can you offer some advice on selling to a small grocer?
Let the passion bleed through into your pitch. That's great. Confidence is key. If you walk in there and ask them to carry your coffee, you'll probably get a polite no. If you instead walk in, give them a sample, and then ask why they should carry your coffee; you will literally watch them sell themselves.
If you act like every single grocer you've gone to is buying your coffee, well it's not a far leap to assume they are. Even if I know nothing about coffee, I'm assuming somebody else does, and I don't want to miss the boat.
And dress like a professional. That should go without saying, but I see some of the people we interview and fuck me ate they idiots.
"Influence. The Psychology of Persuasion" is a good starting point.
One of my favorite bits from there was a section on how POW's were made to be communist sympathizers by Chinese interrogators during the Korean war. Getting somebody to identify with a statement makes them more likely to act in that capacity later on.
If you can get them to just say, "I deserve this car" while sitting in it, your sales will go up. Even just fucking around and having fun with getting them to say it will make them act like they do; and like they want it.
paint the picture.
What makes now the time to purchase a new car? What did you like about your last car, what are you looking to do with your new car?
ask the right questions so when they find a car they like, you show how it fits all their wants/needs/goals
>When we go over the paperwork...
>When we get you approved...
>When you own this vehicle...
>paint the picture.
This is the part I always hated. Found it to be corny and stupid. I was decent, but my logic was fucking bulletproof.
That's why my promotion to in-house has allowed me to sell like a coked-out 80's broker. Nothing but logic and authority.
Exactly. Assuming the sale is great. One thing I'd nitpick: I hate the word approved. Qualify, approve, run credit, finances. All ugly words that scare people. Whenever we run credit, I pitch it as a benefit.
>I'm asking for a big discount here, I'm gonna need some leverage. Fill this out, and my manager is more likely to deal with me.
>Were you always naturally outgoing and comfortable with public speaking or was it a skill you practiced over time?
Not so much outgoing; usually needed a few drinks to limber me up to the point where I was smooth and outgoing. Never had trouble with public speaking, but the intimacy of sales was new to me. That took a little bit of getting used to. Fun as fuck, and I'm so that I took the job. I don't give a damn about talking to anyone now.
How difficult is it to get a car sales job? Do they even take you on without sales experience?
I'm currently working retail as a key holder. Currently my job is focusing getting people to sign up for retail credit cards, and buy gift cards. Well really managing and coaching my team on getting people to sign up. Before being promoted I was the top person when it came to these two by a large margin, and I see I use many of the same tricks you do, though to a far lesser extent.
>How difficult is it to get a car sales job? Do they even take you on without sales experience?
I wouldn't know. I've never worked in car sales. I've always done timeshare and sales skills are very laterally transferable. I have a ton of friends at work who've done car sales, though. They say the hours suck and the commissions are smaller, but the sales are easier.
You have sales experience, so play that up. And it never hurts to ask. It's a sales job, so just walking in, selling yourself, and asking for a position is pretty much your best bet. Seeing as my job is 100% commission, we take almost anyone.
I actually just got a bunch of samples today for just that purpose. Literally everyone who has tried this stuff has loved it, and I come from a very coffee-centric town. You basically reaffirmed my plan of action; thanks for the confidence boost.
No problem, friend.
>Do you do cold calling?
No. Not my department.
>Do the majority of your sales come from walk-ins, or from potential leads (friends of friends, recommendations from previous customers, etc)?
When I was frontline sales, I had a healthy mix of people we pulled off the street with gift certificates and people staying at the resort on a promotional package. Now that I'm on in-house, I just deal with people that already own and get them to upgrade.
That's the part I like about my job; I don't have to generate leads or tour flow. It's done for me. I just have to meet with clients.
I'm copy/pasting all of this to a word doc. Thanks so much man!
I still didn't have to generate. We have a marketing team that did it for us. I would literally get a sheet from my manager with some basic info about the person and pick them up in the lobby to have breakfast and start the presentation. Between our in-site marketing and corporate, we got a decent amount of people put before us.
Don't stress over it. From talking to other people in marketing, casting a wide net is your biggest friend.
Sure thing, anon. It's fun for me and keeps me sharp.
I'm back, bitches. I'm also bored and willing to field questions or talk.
Have an ass
Man I love your thread so far, you really are dropping some great sales knowledge, and
I find a great number of similarities among the advice you are giving and the one that Tom Hopkins gives. If you have time, check that guy out on Youtube, and while maybe you´ll find him "basic", perhaps other guys can learn a little from him.
I´ll keep monitoring your thread, is great so far.
I've watched a few minutes of his videos. I've also watched a few other guys that I can't recall. The "class" after me was heavy into watching the YouTube tutorials from those gurus. They're great for picking up some closing techniques or a new way to state things. I'd usually go over and ask what they learned and then pitch back and forth with them just to get some cool stuff, but never sat down and watched hours of the stuff. The reason everything sounds so good when these legends are saying it is that they're salesmen. It's not that the ideas are particularly novel (I'm nowhere near their level, nor do I profess to be, but it's true.); they just have a skill for making people think they're right.
That cadence, intonation, and emphasis when they speak is far more important than anything else they teach, and they don't even teach it. It's the reason why I read psych journals instead of watching sales videos. I wanted to know why these guys were good; not just mimic them. That conviction and authority they keep in their pitch is better than anything else they do. The rest comes with time and product knowledge.
When I found out one of the top 10 reps in our entire company (it's huge) worked at our site, I eavesdropped on him constantly. I tried to steal his time whenever I could. He said the same thing I'm saying in this thread. Practice. Just fucking practice and practice until your vocabulary changes. It's not natural to say to somebody, "Let me share why I feel like this would benefit you." but after months of replacing your verbs and adjectives, it becomes second nature. You'll develop the confidence needed to say it with conviction, and then you can start to play around with all the fancy bullshit like novel closes and tricks. 90% of what you communicate has fuck all to do with what you're saying.
Cool tip, though. If you're around my age (twenties) and selling to a vet, always refer to them as sir and their significant other as ma'am.
I feel like this came off a bit dickish. If Tom Hopkins or the like helps you become a better salesperson, keep watching. Please do. It just never appealed to me. And if anyone else feels the same way, I hope they can glean some insight off of what I just said.
Not dickish at all, I really appreciate it, and I agree with you about the cadence and voice tonal pattern being of utmost importance rather than the actual words, I just found that both of you seem to substitute some heavy motionally charged words for other that are "lighter", can you share some more stories or tips about your sals eperience?
Great thread op, I've always wanted to get into sales and I'm very business oriented as well as very young and I thought that sales would be a great skill for me to learn. I'm not very outgoing though and quiet so I feel like sales would be really hard for me and I don't wanna suck at it and be making less then minimum wage. Is there anyway to learn to be more outgoing? Or should I just stick to something where I don't have to be smooth as fuck 24/7
>I just found that both of you seem to substitute some heavy motionally charged words for other that are "lighter"
They're called affective words. Certain words sound better to people than others. For instance, you don't sell somebody something, you offer them an opportunity.
As far as stories go, here's another one from my frontine days.
>Looks great on sheet
>Soft credit check gives A rating, married, 40's, own a house
>Look at gifts they're to receive for speaking with me
>Airline tickets (garbage), $100 Dining dough (Pretty shitty), $100
>Nobody who gets airline tickets also gets $100
>This nigger put up a fight
>Go out into lobby and call out name on sheet
>Already knew it was going to be this guy
>Immediately can tell he does construction
>Shake his hand. Comment on grip. Joke around a bit
>We sit at my desk
>I make some small talk
>He then just sort of breaks the conversation and cuts me off
>"Anon, you seem like a nice guy. And you're young. This is my 45th timeshare presentation, so how about you just get rid of me and get a better opportunity, eh?"
>He's wearing a shit eating grin and staring through me
>"Yeah, but this is your first time with me, John. Isn't that right?"
>"So it'd be fair to say that you've never heard what I'm going to say, right?"
>"No; I've heard it."
>"Well you said you've only been married to Jane for 2 years. Jane, how many of these have you been on?"
>"Oh, I don't normally go"
>I begin to work his wife for a bit before he realizes I'm driving a wedge between them and selling her
>"Don't even bother. She ain't got no money."
>I know I'm not going to sell this guy. At a certain point it's just sound and fury
>"That's fine. So which company has had the most enticing offer so far?"
>"What? I've never heard this one. This is new."
>"It's not a pitch, John. I don't give two fucks about selling you anything. I'd just like to know what an impartial observer thinks is the best company out there."
>"Well, you guys. But you're expensive and I don't vacation."
>The guy seriously couldn't vacation. I knew the industry he was in and his union was dick. It's why I wasn't really trying to sell him
>"Hey, that's great to know."
>"Seriously, Anon, don't you want to get rid of me and get a better shot? That lobby was full."
>"I'm going to tell you how my job works, John. There's something called a wheel. It lists all the reps in order of sales volume. Everyone has to get one tour before anyone gets a second. Everyone needs 2 before anyone gets a third. And so forth. Our close percentage is calculated as well, so every guest I sit with that doesn't become an owner hurts me. I won't get another opportunity today, as you're my second tour."
>"That sucks. Don't you want an early day, though?"
>"Not really. I get a small base salary. (Not true), so I make money just sitting here and all my friends are at work."
>"Well how long is this gonna take?"
>"I'm not gonna sell you or try and pit your wife against you, so it's gonna drag on, but you agreed to 2 hours, so how bout them Yankees?"
>"Are you fucking kidding me?"
>"What? Mets fan?"
>"Are you really going to sit here and bullshit with me for 2 hours?"
>"Don't see why not. They pay me to sell and talk. If I can't sell, might as well talk."
>"You're a prick. How can you waste my time like this?"
>"I'm going to politely remind you that you're the one who came to my job and fucked with my money. You're wasting both our time. Want to do some math?"
>"Why would I want to do math?"
>"C'mon, it'll be fun."
>I get out a blank piece of computer paper and pull a pen from my jacket
>"Just follow along with me, John."
>I always write numbers down, so imagine that he's seeing all this happen in front of him
>I write down "Airline tickets, Dining Cash, $100."
>"You've been on these before. You know that the tickets are free, but you have to pay for the hotel rooms. It's a shit deal; let's cross that out."
>"You might not have gotten the dining cash before, but trust me; it's shit. I'll go ahead and give you the benefit of assuming it's worth $50 instead. The cash is cash."
>"So I'm getting $150 for my time. I think that's a pretty good deal."
>"Me too. Here's where we can do some math. On my little sheet here, I've got your address. This is a bit of a hike and you only drove up for the day."
>I pull out my phone and punch in the address
>"You drove for about 90 minutes to get here. You'll drive 90 back. That's three hours of driving. You also drove a work truck. I'm guessing you'll spend $40 in gas total for today. We're at $110 for today as a profit."
>"Right. I get $110 for two hours of time. That's $55 an hour. That's double what I make at work."
>"Good deal then. Except I'm taking up 5 hours of your time. 3 in the car and 2 at my desk. You're getting about $20 an hour. I'm also guessing you'll be splitting this with the wife, so that's $10 an hour. Remember how you said you can never go on vacation? I'm betting you work a lot of overtime."
>"So $28/hr at overtime rate is $47. Working One hour of overtime would have given you almost as much money as this whole day, wouldn't it have?"
>He gets visibly pissed off as he realizes what he's doing on his day off.
>"So, tell me, John, how do you want to spend your day off with me? Sports, politics, timeshare...?"
>He's getting angrier and angrier
>"Tell you what, I'll do you a favor and give you the first raise you've gotten in a while. I'll cut this thing short if you agree never to waste mine or your time again. Fair enough?"
>He begrudgingly shakes my hand as his wife tries not to laugh
Go home at 1pm that day.
>I'm not very outgoing though and quiet so I feel like sales would be really hard for me and I don't wanna suck at it and be making less then minimum wage.
It might suck at first, but plenty of people like you come into sales. It actually forces you to be more outgoing. As far as learning to be more outgoing, just remember that you'll never see these fucking morons again. It makes it much easier.
Just realized I forgot my name this evening.
Got another one. I'll type it up later. One of my favorites.
>doesn't this warp your personality somewhat?
Absolutely. My first manager used to ask me, "Who are you when you're with a client?" I didn't know the answer until she told me my second week. "Whoever they need me to be." Old person? I could act like their grandson. I could be the respectable youth that they miss. I used to love black tables. We'd do nothing but talk about rap and how you can't trust lightskin hoes. Shit is fun.
>what happens to "you" and the things you think and believe in?
As soon as they leave, I go right back to being me. It's all an act. It doesn't affect me any more than it would an actor. You just become very malleable at work. I'm almost a quiet person outside of work.
Really enjoyed this thread, thanks OP.
Short question from me, you mentioned you liked to read pop psych books. Are there any in particular you could recommend?
I'm sure you've probably read Cialdini's 'Influence', but there's a similar book called 'I is for influence' which I felt is a more modern retelling and has some stuff not in the first book.
>Short question from me, you mentioned you liked to read pop psych books. Are there any in particular you could recommend?
Influence is pretty much the only honest to God book that I've read. Mostly I just skim Google Scholar for psych and psychology articles when I feel like looking for some new crap.
I'll check out your recommendation, though. Thanks.
I've just got to say thank you anon, this thread has been thoroughly very enjoyable for me and actually damn enlightening. I work at a telecom call center as billing support, so I'm the punching bag that cleans up after a coldcalling telemarketer fucks up and a customer's bills have become a clusterfuck because they've "been misinformed", "cheated", "lied to" and want to change plans again(which they can't) or have their old plan back(which is impossible).
Before reading this thread, I've always carried with me a sort of bitterness to our sales team because my job isn't to sell as I don't get commission, but to simply calm the customer down and suck their dick enough till they leave. Now I've found a new sense of respect for you guys because it really is all fair game if the sale was clean and done as good as you've made it sound OP, and that as we've suspected, it is and will always just be the customer's fault for having fallen into it in the first place.
I might actually apply for sales myself now and read up more on pitch-building. There's definitely a lot of similarities between support and sales techniques, but mine are more focused on just pleasing the customer. Instead of commission to worry about, our customers here at support get a survey at the end of the call that asks how happy or pleased they are with the call and if their "issue" was resolved.
Sweet dreams m8, gr8 thread.
I'm not tall (manlet tier at 5'8''). I think I might be able to do sales, but I'm concerned (not insecure) about perceptions about my height. How many short guys do you work with? Any other thoughts?
I'm 5'10" or 5'9" not entirely sure. You know Tim Allen's assistant from Home Improvement? I can't remember his name. Either way, we have a representative who looks just like him. He's only about 5'6" or 7". He regularly brings home $25k-30k a month. It's all about you. Being intimidating doesn't always help much. Just be somebody that people like. That's all you need. You can always get shoe lifts like the one guy I work with. If the sales floor finds out, they will make fun of you, though. There's a ton of ribbing and ripping on each other. Sales is still very much a boys' club.
I'm very new to /biz/, but I was wondering if anyone knows of any high paying sales jobs to work at nights? I don't have any assets and I need my day job to survive, but I'd like to get a sales job as well. any possible opportunities?
I really appreciate all your advice.
I'm not indebted, it's just that I live paycheck to paycheck. And I could use some extra money to fix my vehicle/save/invest.
Thank you, I'll try to see if I can get my current schedule changed so I can work sales during the day.
any advice you can give me >>558768 OP?
also have done some thinking about our store bonus system, we are currently only giving bonus when overall sales reaching certain level and i am thinking to change it to straight out Percentage-Based Sales Commission. any opinion?
You sound a little too controlling, but that's not enough to be there reason everyone quit. As far as commission, just make it a small percentage of total sales volume in my opinion. It encourages your staff to upsell and make you money. Just be sure not to bake commission into your retail price.
This is more detailed than what I do. You need to go over your books and business plan with someone who has experience.
I regret not doing the business side sometimes. I also regret not dropping out sooner sometimes. I make more money now than most people I know and have the ability to make way more at my current position than I'd know what to do with. I'd like to move through the ranks of the company, though. Vertical movement doesn't seem to be that difficult if you're ambitious.
I've never been good at traditional education, so it's probably for the best that I'm done with it now. I dropped out twice. The second time was literally the day after I found out a competitor moved into the niche of a business I had at the time and got bought out for $2mm. I had put mine on hold at the behest of my mother to go back to school one more time. I don't hold a grudge, but I do wish I had more resolve when I was younger. There's a serenity that comes with maturity, and my mistakes are mine alone. You're much happier once you realize that.
The one guy who talked like a salesman, an old has been, never gets a sale
More like this
>meets a random at a bar and talks to him about life (al Pacino bar monologue is worth youtubing), sex, etc. Always referring to things that feel good, and basically doing what you want. He then switches into selling him real estate
>second best and generally bitter. Wants to get another salesman to steal the glengarry leads, does this buy saying "someone should___, someone should _____" then, when the guy starts to agree, he switches it to "you should"
OP I know you mentioned something about not really being into lessons on sales stuff, but what do you think of Jordan belfort's Straightline Persuasion? I actually listened and studied his techniques and applied them a little in real life (not as a sale, but interpersonal stuff). Sometimes works, sometimes doesn't and honestly can't tell if I'm making an impact or not to the other person. Like, if my techniques are actually working.
Never read it. Never watched anything. As far as knowing if you're having an impact on people, well what are your goals? That's almost the only way to know. Experience is the thing that will let you pick up on more nuanced aspects. I can tell when someone wants my product and legitimately can't afford it vs. when they're saying they can't as a cop out. I'd need to know more about what you're trying to do to help you out.
As for the people asking about how to get better at talking to people and being outgoing, I thought of something the other day.
Go shopping at any big box retailer. The staff and cashiers are literally paid to be nice. Try and pull them into your world for a bit. They can't be dicks to you, and you'll probably never see them again. I had a 5 minute conversation with a cashier at Walmart just because I was bored and realized it was never something I would've done prior to being a salesman. Give it a shot.
Ah I see, I thought so. I just wanted to see if what I learned was bullshit or legitimate.
So OP few questions if you don't mind:
1. Did you ever try your salesman techniques on women?
2. How long do you plan on pursuing your career? Any plans for the future?
3. Have you ever seen or heard conversations, sales pitches, flirting done wrong? What are some mistakes that you see and how would you correct them?
Sorry about asking like a million questions. But that's what we're here for right?
>1. Did you ever try your salesman techniques on women?
All the time. Works pretty well. The real boon has been learning how to pick up on body language well. But as far as initial flirting and talking for a bit, that's gotten easy as hell. I talk about it a bit upthread. Get them talking about themselves; people love to talk about themselves. My "salesmanning" is a little different when flirting. I actually call people out after a few minutes of talking. Here's an example from a few weeks ago. I was talking to some girl in a bar.
>"So do you like what you do?"
>"Yeah. sales is fun"
>Oh nothing. Just thinking.
>That's the dumbest cop out and all girls use it. It's supposed to get me thinking that you're aloof. You're not.
>I'm really thinking, though!
>Okay. What about?
>I'm not telling, and I haven't decided if it's a yes or no yet.
>Well, I know a few things now. It's a binary decision, and it involves me.
>How do you know that?
>Because you said it's a yes or no, and you won't tell me what about. The only reason to hide that would be because it involves me. I know it's not whether you like me or not because your pupils dilate whenever I make eye contact with you. And I know I'm right because you're tilting your head in. You're deciding if you're going to sleep with me tonight.
>No I'm not!
>Your poker face sucks. Don't worry; we're not going to fuck. I literally don't have time (take away)
I got a blowjob in the parking lot.
>2. How long do you plan on pursuing your career? Any plans for the future?
I'll make this a career if I can. I work for a multi-billion dollar corporation. Our CEO was a sales rep 30 years ago. You can move up easily if you're driven. I also have a side startup that I won't go into, but with enough capital from this job, I can put more effort into it. Friend knows a venture capital group, too.
>3. Have you ever seen or heard conversations, sales pitches, flirting done wrong? What are some mistakes that you see and how would you correct them?
All the time. At work, it's deviating from the pitch or not squashing an objection correctly. Conversations can't be done wrong. There's no goal. And flirting is very subjective. Depends on the goal.
>Sorry about asking like a million questions. But that's what we're here for right?
Sure thing. Like I said the other day, this is fun for me to talk about. It's a little ego-stroking, and I can help some people out. Plus I don't have to talk to the gf.
Cool cool. Good stuff man. I always use something like a cornering/boxing technique when I flirt with girls. Sometimes it works like magic, sometimes they get the "I'm not fucking you" look LOL.
Can you elaborate on how you plan your conversations? Something like
I know, I know most of the time it's spontaneous, but you had to have some kind of plan before right?
For me it's like:
1. joke/funny comment about something visible
2. alil chit chat
4. "oh what are you here for?"
5. get some info on her/ "qualify my prospect" lol
6. ask if shes staying to play, or leaving (not literally)
7. convo at this point is pretty boring so I'll probably drop a few jokes and laughs somehow.
8. and here i lead her on that I'm leaving/busy,
9. number or fuck
Somewhere in between the lines I pull some old tricks like: mimicing (like you said before), hand gestures, and some other psych stuff on her. At this point they're natural and I don't really know what I do anymore.
cont. Sorry for the long ass shit I'm pulling here. I rarely see people who are actually worth their weight.
How long did it take to get your certification? Was it formal or focused (like was it a college degree or a cert that you can get in a few months)? I had a marketing buddy recommend me get a license for retailing, just because I had much time on my hands. Now I'm actually considering it, just to learn the "salesman pitch" part of the job (I already have income and am happy lol).
>Can you elaborate on how you plan your conversations? Something like
I really don't, so I'm afraid I can't help there. Confidence is about it. When the sales staff goes out together we pretty much make a game of how crazy our opening line can be. I've literally started with "Wanna get laid tonight?" before. Didn't hook up, but I didn't try for a number either, but it's all about you and how you present yourself.
>I know, I know most of the time it's spontaneous, but you had to have some kind of plan before right? For me it's like:
Don't plan like that. It's autistic at best; creepy at worst. As much as people are similar, they are each different. With something as variable as flirting, you can't really plan ahead. It's also kind of douchey to assume all women are the same. Girls can tell when you're treating them like marks, and they don't like it. I generally start talking due to a genuine interest or out of boredom. That helps a lot. Going in and hoping for sex is a great way to never get laid.
When you do it in sales, it's called commission breath.
>How long did it take to get your certification? Was it formal or focused (like was it a college degree or a cert that you can get in a few months)? I had a marketing buddy recommend me get a license for retailing, just because I had much time on my hands.
I had to get a real estate license to sell for the job. It took two weeks. But that was just state law. On the job training consisted of some basic sales training, then shadowing people on the floor for a few weeks, then you're thrown to the wolves.
That was about it, man.
LOL at your comment man. Harsh. But, yeah I know dude. To me it's a numbers game. I stack winning convos and play the dice. It's hard to be legitimately interested in people.
So 2 weeks is all it took? What the fuck? I'll go out and look for a class tomorrow. Thanks for the heads up. By the way, what do you think retail companies look for in salesmen that they hire? Would they hate a guy that had classes before on pitching/marketing/selling? So that, you know, he's not a blank plate to teach.
>So 2 weeks is all it took? What the fuck? I'll go out and look for a class tomorrow. Thanks for the heads up. By the way, what do you think retail companies look for in salesmen that they hire? Would they hate a guy that had classes before on pitching/marketing/selling? So that, you know, he's not a blank plate to teach.
That was just real estate. No tutelage on how to sell there. As far as what companies want? Sales experience is always good. The skills are transferable; you're just selling widgets. Timeshare is unique in that it's universally recognized as the Superbowl of sales. It's a product nobody wants and one that people agree beforehand not to buy. Plus you generally have 90 minutes to convince someone to make the second or third largest purchase of their life.
Most sales jobs will hire you, though. There's generally no downside to bringing on a new hire. If it's 100% commission, they don't put up any money. By the way, 100% commission jobs are the ones that have the highest earning potential as a general rule of thumb.
Ok. I heard of timeshares before, but never got into them. I was recommended to get into real estate so (I think I said retail before, I have no idea why) here's another question: what was the original position that you got when you applied? And how was your was your first sale like?
>what was the original position that you got when you applied? And how was your was your first sale like?
Frontline sales rep. My first sale came as a total surprise. Looking back, it was obvious I'd get it, but I was new and had no clue. Older black couple; got them to laugh the whole time. Guy said he'd been on 5 of these before. After showing numbers and asking the final purchase question, he sat back and literally said, "Hmmm. I'm gonna have to say... yes. That made a lot of sense, anon." He then proceeded to hand his credit card to a stupefied me. His wife/girlfriend/whatthefuckever made me laugh by asking me if I ever thought my first sale would be to some "black folk."
And these are still timeshares or something else? Do you think the job training was helpful at all in landing the sale? What are some of the lessons that you've learned since then til now?
If I'm asking too much you can chat about other stuff too lol.
>And these are still timeshares or something else?
Timeshare. It's always been timeshare.
>Do you think the job training was helpful at all in landing the sale?
It was absolutely invaluable. I'm still good friends with my trainer, as we work in the same building. He's actually helping me get ready to move to a corporate position. Te guy earnestly wants everyone he teaches to succeed.
>What are some of the lessons that you've learned since then til now?
Leave your shit at the door.
Be whoever they need you to be in order to get the sale.
Nobody gives a shit about the product; they're buying you.
There's no such thing as a good client. They all suck. It's your job to make them good.
Easterners will always have trouble making a today decision.
Anyone can be sold.
Nobody likes to be sold.
You'll never be the smartest person in the room. Don't assume you are.
Nobody gives a shit what you did yesterday. What have you done for me lately?
Don't care about what you're saying. Nobody else does.
Care about how you say it. It's all people notice.
Do you ever use anything to enhance your performance at work? Vyvanse, energy drinks,etc. I think you said earlier you did coke. Would you agree your methods/philosophy on sales would be applicable in collections?
I take a B12 supplement every day and try to maintain a clean diet. I do coke once in a blue moon and never at work or prior. Drugs and jobs don't mix.
As far as using sales techniques in collections, probably to some extent. This is actually an interesting question that I'd like to answer well. I'm in bed right now and tired as fuck, so I'll get you a good answer sometime tomorrow. If you're in collections, I'll help you craft a pitch.
Collections as in outstanding receivables. I do work collections. I also get collections for a percentage of the amount collected. This saves my company from having to pay third-parties for collecting for us.
So are the current pitches using strong arm tactics, or what? Because I thought about an angle as I was lying in bed last night that I feel would compliment that sort of environment very well.
What are your people usually in arrears for, what at you able to take as far as pennies on the dollar, and how large is the average outstanding debt?