apple, of course. they don't make money off collection and sale of users' information.
apple's customers are the people they sell their products to. google's customers are gov agencies and advertisers.
once Apple sells you a device, that's it. they've made their money and they continue improving the software and continue protecting your privacy.
once someone sells you something with Google on it, the monetization of YOU has just started. google spends years learning about you and then they exploit your psychological weaknesses by targeting you with useless shit that you'll buy. and that's how they make their money.
it's usually poor people who get fucked by Google since they can't afford Apple's devices and Google's users are usually less educated people who are easier to exploit.
>>46873813 >only giving in after Steve Job's death.
They gave in after his death, so why would you continue trusting them? Now that he's gone, there's nothing holding them back. Don't trust them more just because they USE to be good. Google use to be good too.
>>46873955 But Apple held out longer because of Steve. Google went full fucking jew and started feeding the government info the second they requested it. Apple wants its customers to believe that their privacy is important to the company when in reality they are doing almost exactly what google does except they actually make good hardware. :)
/g/'s obsession with google is everything that is wrong with this thread in a nutshell. G claims to be about privacy and against the botnet, and yet their favorite company are the ones who exist solely for the purpose to exploit and sell your personal information.
To Apple you are the customer. To Google you are the product.
>>46873980 >But Apple held out longer because of Steve. Again, why does that argument sway you in the now? They held out until Steve died. Now there's nothing holding them to doing that again. Once he died, they started to change. Their past actions aren't their actions today.
>>46874015 I know that they are still both providers to the government, but what I'm saying is that they are the lesser of the two evils in my opinion. >>46874037 >implying I'm a shill lel stay mad faggot. I just like Apple
1000x this! This is completely true and this is exactly how Google makes money. Since no one makes money off Android devices and Google doesn't get a cut at all, they have to make money somehow so after you purchase an Android device, that's when Google begins making money off you.
Exactly. Which is why Gmail is free, which is why Blogger is free, which is why Android is free, which is why Google wants to give you free internet, which is why they want to give you free wireless, which is why Google Maps is free, etc.
>“Apple has a very straightforward business model," he said. “We make money if you buy one of these [pointing at an iPhone]. That’s our product. You [the consumer] are not our product. We design our products such that we keep a very minimal level of information on our customers.”
>“We don’t make money selling your information to somebody else. We don’t think you want that. We don’t want to do that. It’s not in our values system to do that. Could we make a lot of money doing that? Of course. But life isn’t about money, life is about doing the right thing. This has been a core value of our company for a long time.”
>“Some companies are not transparent that the connection of these data points produces five other things that you didn’t know that you gave up. It becomes a gigantic trove of data.”
>“We are not a treasure trove of data. It is a cop-out to say: choose between privacy or security. There is no reason why customers should have to select one. There is no reason not to have both.”
>“If they are really honest, they know that withholding encryption will penalise good people, not put a barrier up for bad people. There is no trade-off. It fundamentally doesn’t work. There has to be other solutions.”
>Our view is that when we design a new service we try not to collect data. So we're not reading your email. We're not reading your iMessage. If the government laid a subpoena on us to get your iMessages, we can't provide it. It's encrypted and we don't have a key.
>Our business is based on selling [products]. Our business is not based on having information about you. You are not our product.
>>46873813 >Who do you trust more, Google or Apple? Well... Google has just tried to take 101 generic TLDs internal for its own use. Things like .dev, .blog etc. They wanted .dev for their own devs and are not about to let anyone outside Google use it. But, with the .blog gTLD they want to use it exclusively for their Blogger platform. So outsiders will be able to use it, but only if they are on Google's Blogger platform. Don't think even apple/Microsoft have tried anything as blatent as this. The kicker? The Google moves are being opposed by the Government of Australia.
>>46874085 The funny thing is that 1/4 of Android phones (mostly in China) are sold without any Google services attached. It is why they are so obsessed right now with Android One and trying to push it in India where the next billion smartphone users will be, because they already lost it in China.
Ironically, Apple's services and software, unlike Google's, aren't banned in China because 3rd party audits revealed that they weren't data mining their customers like Google.
>>46874165 >why do people call the government customers on this board all the time? they don't pay for shit Not true at all. Google gets $100s of millions from gov contracts. It's on their quarterly results. You can look it up.
Google also provides software for NSA's Bluffdale, UT facility that will store everything that NSA collects from the internet.
>>46873886 >once Apple sells you a device, that's it. they've made their money and they continue improving the software and continue protecting your privacy. >it's usually poor people who get fucked by Google since they can't afford Apple's devices and Google's users are usually less educated people who are easier to exploit.
>Smarter people use iPhones - study http://money.cnn.com/2015/01/22/technology/mobile/iphone-smart-study/
> IBM has released their user stats for Cyber Monday shopping. Unlike black Friday, the disparity between Android and iOS wasn’t even close, with iOS users outpacing Android owner purchases 4:1. Online sales were up 8.5% over 2013, too, with mobile traffic accounting for nearly half of all online browsing.
This is the app store for Xiaomi phones. EVERY Xiaomi phone sold in china (+150million so far) comes preinstalled with this appstore and a few select apps and services. There is absolutely no mention or use of Google at all. This is the standard in China.
Unlike Apple, their products come with the complete package of hardware and software that is identical to their American counterparts.
It is a well known fact that Google search and many Google services were banned after security audits by the Chinese government ~2010 I believe. Typing google.com will result in a DNS error, same with gmail, gmaps, etc.
Most of the information online by western publications labels them as being 'heroes,' but the reality is that they were shoved out because the Chinese didn't want an American company datamining profiling their citizens in such a way.
>>46874323 if I wanted an iphone I would get one I'm pretty sure you have to do some major modification to get -USB OTG -USB SDR -direct filesystem access -custom ROMs -sd card -flac/opus support and probably a few other things I use regularly but can't remember
>>46874077 Not disagreeing with you, but a lot of those people run cyanogenmod or similar FOSS ROMs without Gapps (so minus botnet).
You can usually tell who the tossers are because they'll post a screenshot showing Touchwiz or the default Nexus ROM (with the Gapps) and then complain about "macfags" or whatever. Those people are the true cancer.
If I had the money I'd honestly get an iPhone, but my job is entry level so I'm happy with my Nexus 4 running ParanoidAndroid.
>>46874378 yeah yeah yeah... I'm sure all these customizations mean a lot to you because you have a lot of free time to fuck around fixing shit that should have come out properly of the factory. most people don't wanna waste their life on babysitting phones and dressing them up like Barbie dolls. most people want shit that works that gets job done... and shit they can take to a store and get fixed if something goes wrong with them.
once you start fucking with your devices like that, you've voided warrantee and you're fucked if something goes wrong (and it will go wrong).
when apple's device gets fucked, you take it to the store and you walk out with a fixed devices or a brand new one, free of charge.
>>46874439 Of course it is. Everything is being mined by the NSA at this point. >>46874433 Isn't cynaogenmod a really bad thing to use now? >>46874447 This is why I stick by an iPhone. >>46874364 Point taken, didn't know that. Thanks anon
>>46874463 >Isn't cynaogenmod a really bad thing to use now? Why? Because MS started funding them? Nothing changed, they're still free and open. I don't keep up with news though, so perhaps there's something I'm not aware of.
Personally I've never liked the ROM itself (just not my cup of tea), but I don't think there's anything wrong with it.
>>46874439 Nope. It recently came out that the NSA had a gag order and could demand information from any tech company.
The funny thing is that the information is end to end encrypted, so they can't really do shit. Only iCloud and certain chat and cloud services even bother though. Even from his grave, Jobs is fucking over NSA.
Also their entire data mining and surveillance was engineered by Google themselves. They don't like talking about it, but they have massive NSA contracts to train and help them build analytics software and datacenters as well as personally collect and sell data to them.
Out of all the companies out there. Google cares the least about your privacy and is most in bed with the NSA. This is pretty much indisputable
>>46874624 >USB and SD card stuff is never happening. Its a hardware thing. Similar to Nexus devices and sd cards. most of the time when I see a phone has a radio receiver it's always crap and/or requires the use of headphones the SDR I have gets stupid clear reception nearly anywhere with a large enough ground plane only problem is it's most likely ignoring usb power spec
>>46874590 Pretending that they are equal though is silly.
One actually HELPS the NSA with their spying and data centers, and has personal contracts with them. Their algorithms to sell you ads and follow you on the internet and profile you are the same ones used by the NSA, because Google literally gave it to them They are doing this willingly and for money. They actively are trying to remove personal privacy and are in bed with the NSA in the most literal sense. They are, quite frankly, an evil company with no real morals behind them.
The other is legally forced to comply with the government demands to hand over fully encrypted messages when they ask them too. Oh and they also sell you high margin, overpriced, and shiny brand name products. And that is all they aspire to do as a company.
>We also use personal information to help us create, develop, operate, deliver, and improve our products, services, content and advertising, and for loss prevention and anti-fraud purposes. >We may collect information such as occupation, language, zip code, area code, unique device identifier, referrer URL, location, and the time zone where an Apple product is used so that we can better understand customer behavior and improve our products, services, and advertising.
>We also use personal information to help us create, develop, operate, deliver . . . advertising >We may collect information such as occupation, language, zip code, area code, unique device identifier, referrer URL, location, and the time zone . . . so that we can . . . improve our . . . advertising.
>>46874642 >But you do have time to waste compiling research to help you win internet arguments about your favorite phone company. dude, what research? I just searched for few stories that I remembered coming across in the past. I usually read slashdot and that's where I saw them. you're really overthinking my passion and/or time investment into internet fighting. I'm actually getting ready for bed and went on /g/ to waste some time & fall asleep.
You are not required to provide the personal information that we have requested
Sometime down later:
The personal information we collect allows us to keep you posted on Apple’s latest product announcements, software updates, and upcoming events. If you don’t want to be on our mailing list, YOU CAN OPT OUT ANYTIME BY UPDATING YOUR PREFERENCES.
It clearly states that personal, identifying information is completely, and totally optional. Unlike with Google. Funny how you left that out.
This is legally binding by the way. So when they say that you can opt out entirely, they legally, mean it and have to do it.
>>46874889 They are a publicy traded company. They CANNOT lie on their financials that clearly shows they don't make any real money selling ads and absolutely none for selling personal infromation. Its all from devices. +91% of it, the rest is service subscriptions and the final amount is iTunes apps and music sales. Where are they making money from profiling and datamining? Follow the money, it's not that hard. They actually come out clean unlike Google and others.
>>46874885 >http://www.zdnet.com/article/apple-google-microsoft-where-does-the-money-come-from/ <--- stunning chart! amazing how profitable iphone is. it's also clear that they don't sell your private info they collect.
>>46874885 >You are not required to provide the personal information that we have requested >but, if you chose not to do so, in many cases we will not be able to provide you with our products or services or respond to any queries you may have. >You don't have to give us your information >if you don't use our services
> If you don’t want to be on our mailing list, YOU CAN OPT OUT ANYTIME BY UPDATING YOUR PREFERENCES. >If you don’t want to be on our mailing list You really should take the time to reread before posting.
>Unlike with Google. Funny how you left that out. That's because I'm not shilling for Google. I don't trust them any more than I do Apple, but I don't like it when something that smells like PR bullshit gets posted on /g/, and is factually wrong. Interesting projection though.
>>46874960 So they are completely lying on their financials, is that what you are saying?
They are secretly making hundreds of billions of dollars of undisclosed money from selling personal information and datamining like Google, which they don't and aren't reporting because you don't like them? Can you confirm that this is the full extent of your stupidity? Please I need a good laugh.
I can use an Android device without Google services. I do, actually: I have a nexus 5 without gapps and I only use google's maps. I do believe Apple's business lies in selling hardware and that makes them less likely to mine data, but they gave in to PRISM and nothing stops them from mining and handing data to the USA government. The fact that you have so little control over your own device makes it even worse. The second Apple wants to get their info, you can do nothing about it because they've got total control over the device you bought.
You're just butthurt because you've been indoctrinated by the nonsense you slurp up on here and when the truth comes out, you experience cognitive dissonance and need to call anyone who opposes your view a "shill".
>>46875129 Actually legally they would need to change their policies first. Their current policy prevents them from just grabbing anyone's data.
Once Linux on desktop takes off I am hoping people will start to become more and more concerned about dangers of personal data collection, and what it is that private companies and the government are doing to our freedoms.
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