For the past several years, I've on and off been researching ancient Slavs. However, the records which I can find in English are few and far in between. Can anyone here recommend me some books in English or their native language (translated) about the Ancient Slavs, their religion, social structure, physical appearance and other facts relating to the Early Slavs pre-separation into west, east and south Slavic tribes?
Here are some things I found:
Pic is approximated appearance of ancient Slavs.
Oh, it's an extremely tough thing to do. The problem here is that there's fuckall we actually know, main reason for that being that Slavic culture was not that advanced by then, so it got very easily assimilated/incorporated into Christian tradition.
As far as, say, Eastern Slavs go, we don't even know their fucking pantheon. One of the only well-known sources, for example, is the chronicle about Prince Volodymer's pagan reform, and nobody actually knows which logic was the foundation in restructuring the gods. Some say it's just ones he liked the most.
In other words, you're left with researching indirect evidence in stuff like folklore or language history if you really want to learn the truth. If you don't, you end up with pic related and other types of historical schizophrenia.
Not the guy who posted that, but I have a whole folder of those.
Weird shit, all of it. Not much is known since we didn't have a writing system and even if we did we wrote down shit on wood that god destroyed and stuff
Source: am slav, also have a little book about slavic mythology
Okay, that latter one doesn't really look Slavic, but it's in the same style.
Belobog and Črnbog are, as far as I know, reconstructions.
Hors, on the other hand, is supposedly an Iranic influence.
AFAIK, Radegast is exclusive to the Western Slavs.
I hope anyone watching is comfy. I've got loads of pics.
The Slavic pantheon is pretty confusing. The main god is either Svarun (Svarog), Svetovid, Perun or Triglav.
Also, Triglav is a figure, similar to the Christian God - made of three parts. The only problem is, every text has different three names.
Even if no one responds, I will keep posting.
Feels good to be posting on the Slavic dominion of /his/.
These pictures is how Svarga looks like. One day lads...
>getting 77 dubs twice in the same thread
Y'all Nemci even trying?
Oh right, that's the god Jarilo. Sorry lads, not all of my pics have titles. There's probably more gods in my folder...
it is my opinion, which might not be correct, that the way in which people today try to make the slavic gods seem more ''nordic'' somehow, like we see in these images, is wrong
what little i know about the, now mostly lost, mithology of our peoples drags me into the conclusion that slavic gods, and slavic pantheons, were somehow composite, modular, and antropomorphic only as a symbolic form, not fixed
consider than many gods overlapped in their domains and atributes, like svetovid was a war god, but so was perun, he was a god of farming but there were other gods specificaly for fertility and crops and climate and so on, many surviving idols have 3, 4 or even 7 heads, many have numerous hands and limbs, holding all sorts of weapons tools and other atributes, some gods were sort of absurt compilations of meme-like symbols, like veles was a serpent-dragon with a long beard and goat horns and a sheaperds walking stick, and similarly to the egiptian system many of the same gods or 'god-clusters' were represented in different ways as if the actual form wast that important, but the information contained in the symbolism was
idk, maybe im all wrong, but it seems to me the slavic mythology was to them basicaly a language they used to explain reality to each next generation, sets of didactic representations of principles and patterns, apparent laws and regularities, not literaly as a thing to be worshipped, apparently you could even swear at the gods, and worship gods that were obvious opposites in conflict and so on, and it was all fine, as long as you didnt ''break the laws'', like lie, steal or ''use magic''
I AM THE DUBS GOD
Also, that's Čur (Chur) in the last pic.
Nice dubs. I wouldn't really say there's anything Nordic about these pictures.
It's true though, Slavic mythology is "different". In Slovene myths, we have a "god" called Pust, who's realm is drinking and just being a nuisance (like an old version of the shitposter). Also, a curse word among South Slavs is literally "I fuck your god", which is thrown around a lot in the Serbian-speaking countries.
Possibly. There is no reason to think there was a concept of duality in Slavic belief, seeing how there was a god for everything.
Okay, some of these latest pics seem to be from Russian myths that I am not familiar with.
>here is no reason to think there was a concept of duality in Slavic belief, seeing how there was a god for everything.
Thats true for most European pagan belief systems, duality mostly comes from Zoroastrianism and Judaism.
That last guy is Perun's messenger, for anyone's information.
That sounds similar to some of the thinking around the celtic mythology and oral tradition. They're like mnemonics tied to the geography.
I don't know so much about elsewhere, but the southern slavs have an unusual relationship even with Christian God. I wonder if that reflects their pagan religions on some level. Marina Abramovich did some pieces reenacting medieval Serbian pagan rituals where women would punish God by showing their vaginas.
So slavs basically worshiped Chaos.
> Marina Abramovich did some pieces reenacting medieval Serbian pagan rituals where women would punish God by showing their vaginas.
Marina Abramovich is a new age hippy feminist c*nt, i would take that with a whole ocean of salt.
Great bantz, friend. You are obviously an expert.
No, that's just Perun, the god of lightning.
it would almost seem the gods werent exactly 'holy' in the jeudo-christian sense, kind of how phisical laws arent taught as 'holy laws' even tho we believe they govern reality
and there are strange ambiguities in the gods themselves, like perun was -the one that strikes- literaly his name, and he was obviously the thinder god, the sky father etc, but he wasnt 'good' just like his enemy veles, the god of the underworld and death but at the same time of water and of everithing that grows and is reborn, wasnt 'evil', and their conflict was simply a necesity, it could not not happen, and if it did stop at any point everithing would stop and our reality would just rot away in entropy
that means there is no eschatological point to it, it just happens and if it didnt happen wed all dissapear, but then it cannot not happen, ant ther is no end to it, ever
its diffrent from abrahamic logic, even from other pagan logic, its not just the lack of information about it that confuses us today, but it might just be that even the word 'god' didnt realy mean the same thing as it does to us
I guess the artist wanted something that looked like lightning. The artist seems to be someone with the surname Korolikov.
Woah woah woah, hope Hirohito doesn't see the "parts" on that one.
peruns simbol is a hexagram with different variations of internal decoration, kind of like saturns, called thunder mark, that is gromoviti znak, or a 7 sided kolovrat, but today people are retcooning all sorts of shit like axes and svastikas and whatever
Isn't kolovrat a form of a swastika, though? Not trying to meme here.
Yeah, I'm familiar with that, too.
You ain't seen nothing yet, friend. I've got at least twenty more.
Early Slav studies are difficult and ideologically loaded. Gimbutas is a possible starting point but she's notably nutty.
Go pick up Riasanovsky's History of Russia and read the short intro chapter on the origins of the Slavs. He gives a decent quick overview of how difficult it is to say anything and how people bicker over it.
Title under the last pic says Werewolf.
>I know these sort of pictures are totally historically irrelevant
only decoration and coloration, but wooden structures itself quite plausible
look what exclusively wood buildings russians built before they started petrine westernization
i suspect those slavic fuckers are more ancient culture than we think, but they have a tradition to go total bolshevik and destroy themselves every few centuries
Those will be some of my last dubs here as I have posted almost all of my pics from the folder.
Okay lads, that's all she wrote. My whole folder is here for you to see and save.
Hope you enjoy.
Possibly. As I've said, the texts are not united on Triglav's three god-elements.
Svetovid actually has his own stories, too. In some creation myths, he is the first god who created the world from his tears.
Paтники y Кoлoдca
Ratnik at Kolodsa? No idea what that means.
Hoчь нa ивaнa кyпaлy
Ivan Kupola's night
Heчнcтики - some weird ghost things, they don't feel attached to material things, they don't feel rage and shit.
Sky Kingdom Irium; or Irium's Sky Kingdom
Lel - defender of singing birds
Talk with god
Cry for home?
Father of the sea and mother of land?
Fuck, they had the constellations nailed back then? amazing
Morana's face is scary.
Golden grandma? huuh?
Igorius - wolf herder
An awesome wallpaper
I'll continue later
there is also the variation on the heads being blinfolded or not, both with apparently different meanings, also iv read somewhere that sometimes the heads were animal, often goats heads, but idk how good online source are, either way these things are the easiest to check out since they are based on material remains, even if we dont know how to decifre them
im trying to get my hands on a copy of vitomir belajs 'hod kroz godinu / walk trough the year', apparently its the confirmed authority on south slavic lore, but its realy hard to find
many of the older etnographers that much of the info comes from were either romaticist imbecils(not that the two arent synonims) or ideologicaly burdened in al sorts of ways so you cant realy tell if what they write down isnt just pouring out of their ass
nego fakat, jel ko ima belaja u nekom pdf-u pa da metne na rapišare ili torent
Some of the cyrillic variations are simply gorgeous - the one in the pics above especially.
Well, I'm not serbian and I wouldn't know.
I know some slavic languages, so I'm trying to help y'all a bit to understand them more.
The titles would probably be a google search away, but I'm gonna try my best.
only, those letters were invented to christianize the slavic populations, as the story goes one of the basic problems faced by chiril and method, and other would be baptizers of slavic peoples, was that the language was so different the existing alphabets themselves were next to useles, so they had to invent a writing system to bring them to the scripture, since their whole religious culture was ritual and oral and absurdly robust at that, and the evangelizing based on the christian scriptures just didnt work
God of time.
I have some trouble reading this one. Is it Vargag? Varbog?
Brodnitsa - a man or a woman who keeps the rest of the men safe and performs magic
Shore god? Shore woman?
Belovode; white-water, clear water
I might be misleading you guys; my knowledge isn't near as good as a real slav.
You are correct, but as far as I know, Ciril and Metod (sorry, don't know the English names) were Slavic Macedonians and they made Glagolitic for Slavs, so this is pretty much the first recorded Slavic writing system. Any earlier alphabets were lost in time (although they're probably still present in some cave or on some piece of pottery somewhere).
Language and culture are pretty much the only things. Haplogroups show that we are much more related than previously thought. And it's only logical, considering the evolution of the Indo-European languages.
thats funny in croatian theres a difference betveen ratnik, vojnik and borac, ratnik meaning warior, as in just, warior, like paramilitary, vojnik means soldier, official military, and borac just means fighter, then theres also bojovnik which pretty much covers the lot but is rarely used
I think rat is only present in Serbo-Croatian languages, and Old Church Slavonic. Russian has the word too (paть), but it's obviously a loan from Old Church Slavonic as it has West/South Slavic liquid metathesis instead of the East Slavic one (it should be οpοть, like the pair grad/гopoд)
I have no idea where it comes from though.
Germans wrote the history.
How are you supposed to find any Slavic history?
Lugii > Rugii > Rani
Certain "German tribes" were for sure Slavs.
We have to find some other ways of knowing Slavs, because history is written.
This thread seems to be done. Still, let me post some more.
Arbitrary differences in culture and demeanor. Slavs have some Iranic influence but are otherwise the same as Germanics. Celts are more mercantile than Germanics and Slavs. Germanics were obsessed with cultural purity. It's mostly trivial in the big picture.
They've had a form of written language which they've used before they've adapted themselves to the Greek based Slavic alphabet of Old Church Slavonic.
"Before, the Slavs did not have their own books, but read and divined by means of strokes and incisions, being pagan. Having become Christian, they had to make do with the use of Roman and Greek letters without order , but how can one write Slavic well with Greek letters... and thus it was for many years."
a bit short for Ancient Slavs.
"main reason for that being that Slavic culture was not that advanced by then, so it got very easily assimilated/incorporated into Christian tradition"-They've had a similar level of development as Germanic counterparts and they weren't assimilated,but converted which is a completely different thing.
this thread is fucking gold OP, you're doing Belobog's work
fuck it feels good to be slav
>They've had a similar level of development as Germanic counterparts
Hoe do you know? For instance in Slovenia and Austria, not a single Slavic votive object or religious structure was found until the discovery of the syncretic 'Triglav' statue in Carinthia in the early 21st century. Even so, it was just a reworked post-Roman bust based on a Constantinian-era likeness of a woman, perhaps a goddess or a member of the royal family.
I believe the map is still very conservative. Going by haplogroup maps and by analyzing geographic names as well as linguistics in general, it should be expanded to South Germany and Hungary - although in the case of the former, it wasn't a settlement on the same level as in the lands still inhabited by Slavs today.
But yes, at one point, there were Slavic tribes inhabiting Greece as well (just like there were a lot more Albanians down there), but they mostly assimilated into the local population.