Yeah, so /pol/ isn't even bothering to be subtle about the fact they're starting and organizing the petition just because they want to promote /lgbt/ infighting.
That probably meets Change.org's definition of fraudulent if it's mostly guys who aren't gay pushing it just to cause trouble for gays and trannies.
That means if people do report the petition for fraud and show the links supporting that it was set up to cause infighting, they'll probably take action and suspend it's organizers.
Report to your heart's content /lgbt/.
I know it's possible to use the report tab and give links to documentation proving this, but is it possible to use some sort of email that will get a reasonably quick reply?
Faking stuff and starting a petition for the sake of making people fight each other looks to be a pretty big deal according to their policies.
Please tell me why doctors GLAAD and HRC all have to drop everything they're doing and service your feels?
People don't exist to cater to your pathetic whims and tantrums.
no one has to service my feels.
likewise, no one should service tranny feels because condoning that bullshit is destructive.
all trans should be in camps. they can share needles shooting up hormones and then die
Why the hell are you mad when they admit to organizing the stuff?
Maybe they should have been less honest if that offends you.
>no one should service
Why do you want to dictate what science and the medical comunity can or can't do?
Why do empirically derived therapies have to take a backseat to your infantile desires?
Go to North Korea if you want to live in a system where medicine and science are banned if it offends your manchild sensibilities.
It's still up.
The reports on the admissions of falsification came in just an hour ago so it might take a bit for them to see it. More reports mean it's more likely the admins would see it quicker.
Pretty sure change would be interested to know the authors admitted to writing it and pretending to be gay men just for the sake of causing fighting between both.
What you're advocating is far more destructive than how the trans community says we should treat trannies. I'd say you have zero credibility, but that would be an insult to the number zero.
What you describe as "feed[ing] into [their] delusions" is objectively the best way of treating severe gender dysphoria. Why should we reject medical science in favor of your feels?
Nah M8, most of us just happen to trust the doctors and science. You on the other hand feel like a doctor and keep tying to practice medicine despite a total lack of higher education.
Now if transdoctor isn't the most dangerous delusion out there, then I don't know what is.
Ya need to be committed before you hurt someone, bud.
I would just like to point out that based on the screenshot provided, there is no evidence that /pol/ is organizing the change.org petition. All the post indicates is that someone saw an already existing petition and decided that it would be a good idea to support it.
While I suspect the majority of the LGBT community would not want to "drop the T". It is being willfully naive, to suggest that there are not those within in the community that do legitimately want to disassociate themselves from the Transgender community. Not everything is some right wing false flag operation created by /pol/.
not him but you do realize that there are plenty of doctors who unethically make money off unnecessary treatments, right? I can guarantee you there is someone profiting off this new mainstream discussion about transgenderism.
beyond that, how many transitioneers do you honestly think ACTUALLY have these intersex traits or whatever abnormality that science claims supposedly causes transgenderism? now I know for a FACT that every case of transgenderism isn't getting an actual brain scan or examination of their biology... very few do and for the most part they rely on what's essentially a questionnaire.
> Milo has shared a new petition to DROP THE T FROM LGBT and if we can spread this it cause a vast amount of asspain to all the right people.
Pardon, they pretty much admit to starting the thing and the thread is full of posters who admit to hating both gays and trans signing that stuff.
By their own admission, it's organized and composed almost exclusively as a false flag from them.
At any rate, Change deserves to know who's starting that and why.
>not him but you do realize that there are plenty of doctors who unethically make money off unnecessary treatments, right? I can guarantee you there is someone profiting off this new mainstream discussion about transgenderism.
It seems absurd to call it an "unnecessary treatment" when it treats an actual medical condition. And the number of trans people is too small for it to be a major moneymaker for doctors.
>someone profiting off this new mainstream discussion
How again? Hormone sales are far smaller than the total amount of cis women who take them
Dermatology and other cosmetic surgeries some of them just as heavy duty as any ffs procedure (see the V-line Korean women and men get) people buy without obtrusive government regulations are also far more profitable.
It's cute you're trying to rationalize urban legends but they don't make a lick of sense when you remember individualistic cosmetic surgeries, contraceptives and other shit are orders of magnitude larger than anything trans could offer.
Think it through, it's a little embarrassing.
They can't do an excision of every transgender person before they start hormones. Because, well, it's an excision. It requires them to be dead. In cases where excision has been performed, the trend has had 100% consistency.
Transgenderism is not really that big of a cash cow. All the major pharmaceutical aspects were developed for, and still used for, treating other ailments (spironolactone for blood pressure, estradiol to tame the effects of menopause), and they're very cheap to produce to boot. I don't even have a copay on any of mine.
The biggest expense of SRS isn't actually the surgery, it's the extensive hospital stay afterwards. $24,000 is a pretty standard total cost; in the US, on average, a night in a hospital costs a little over $2,100. And it's performed by a very small number of surgeons.
It really seems like if a doctor was going to make money off of a false treatment method, they'd go with something like homeopathy, which can be sold at much higher profit margins to a much broader market.
It's a change.org. It's sad they think those make any difference. Or that if the T is dropped somehow civil war will erupt. I think a lot of those people haven't talked to anyone outside the internet for more than 10 seconds in years. Just let them play in their puddle. A lot of them would be mass shooters without it.
>FACT that every case of transgenderism isn't getting an actual brain scan or examination of their biology
Hey, you pay me to do that and I'll get one in no time.
>ACTUALLY have examination of their biology
Well, you're probably gonna complain I'm being cheap but going by biomarkers like 2d:4d and standardizing them with familly, yeah, I can be pretty sure something biologically/hormonally was up.
I mean, ratios above 1.05 would be in the Z-+4 range for males in undervirilization and that's pretty significant, right? There's been plenty of threads here saying that isn't rare either.
If you want me to get something more expensive than biomarkers, then just pay for my tests and I'll do it.
Again, all it says is "Milo has shared" a new petition not that Milo has started a new petition. And in Milo's tweet, he says he supports the campaign wholeheartedly. This is language of a person who agrees with something that already existed, not someone who created it on their own.
I have no doubt that people from /pol/ will support the petition for reasons listed in that post including, "causing butthurt" among the left. And if change.org thinks that is reason to remove the petition then perhaps they will. Just don't get your hopes up for it to be removed based on it being deemed a false flag operation. There are lose within the /lgbt/ community that feel as if the T part is a political liability. The fact that the HERO ordinance in Houston was repealed is one example. It was largely repealed based on campaign of "men in women's bathrooms". Fear mongering? Yes, absolutely. But it was effective fear mongering, that, caused protections for Lesbians and Gays to be removed because those were part of the same ordinance that gave bathroom rights for transgender people.
if someone doesn't actually have anything that points to transgenderism and just wants to be a cute animu girl then yes it is unnecessary.
my point is that people fool themselves into thinking that they're legitimately trapped int the wrong body or were born with the wrong brain when in reality they're not much more than fetishists or just mentally ill.
sorry but unethical practices in the medical world are no myth.
there just seems to be very loose parameters around concluding someone is ACTUALLY transgender.
a hormone imbalance isn't conclusive of transgenderism is it?
how does changing your gender make sense over trying to get your body to natural levels?
>if someone doesn't actually have anything that points to transgenderism and just wants to be a cute animu girl then yes it is unnecessary.
Yes, that's why people only medical transition if they're diagnosed into gender dysphoria.
It seems pretty clear that Milo intentionally wanted the /pol/ crowd to support the petition. In other words, the petition isn't representative of what the LGBT community wants, but of what cultural conservatives want.
>In other words, the petition isn't representative of what the LGBT community wants, but of what cultural conservatives want
There is certainly some truth to that. Though objectively looking, how do you determine how much of the support is from without and how much is form within? I find it extremely unlikely that the entirety of the support for the petition is from /pol/.
Allowing transexuals to get the same sort of cosmetic surgeries 1st world men and women do would bring them would bring in any real money?
Common anon, how again can 0.2% of the pop buying the same procedures about 40% of Korean women get, and 15.1 Million Americans each year get be a cash cow?
You're in denial my friend.
>Yes, that's why people only medical transition if they're diagnosed into gender dysphoria.
right, and then it all comes back to our society being okay with diagnosing medical problems by having them fill out a questionnaire. do you have any idea how easy it is to get medicated?
when there are only a handful of people preforming some of these surgeries yes someone is definitely profiting. do you think they see each patient as someone who genuinely needs medical treatment or do you think they see a nice fat paycheck?
arguing that there isn't any unethical medical practice is moot in the first place. it happens all the time and I'm sure there's no exception for stuff like SRS or facial surgery...
>/pol/ can't be gay
All trannies need to kill themselves
>a hormone imbalance isn't conclusive of transgenderism is it?
Well, that's why I said if you want to spoil me with money, I'd have no problem with more invasive tests.
That said, there's a causal relation between extreme 2d:4d values and the sort of embryonic hormonal abnormalities that cause GID so it's a fairly safe bet.
And really, if hormonal abnormalities are in play, I don't see why it would be wrong for me to take safer, bioidentical versions of the subsidized otc contraceptives women can get.
Actually, simply by the principle of equality under the law and less government intrusion, I don't see why it's anyone's business what anyone buys, hormonal or cosmetic if it's under their own money. The fact you wouldn't bat an eye when women do the same thing -just with government money- is odd to me.
I'd never argue that people can't do what they want... inject yourself with racoon blood I don't care but I still think there is plenty there for discussion. my original point was to just say that there's clearly some people out there transitioning who are probably biologically normal. pointing out that the medical world isn't exactly ethical all the time is more of an after thought.
>do you think they see each patient as someone who genuinely needs medical treatment or do you think they see a nice fat paycheck?
Are we talking about cosmetic surgery in general or the guys who limit their work solely to trans?
Cause if the later did like the doctors in Korea and stuff and advertised to old women with money, they'd probably have much healthier margins. It's probably some sense of charity on their part.
> do you have any idea how easy it is to get medicated?
You do realize the only thing you'd ever have to do to get ethinyl estradiol contraceptives if you're a woman is pick them up OTC. Or ask a doctor and taxpayers have to give them to you for free.
And ethinyl estradiol is orders of magnitude more lethal due to it's chemical propensity towards blood clots and pulmonary embolisms.
If you're gonna start complaining and demanding obtrusive regulation, then why not focus on the genuinely dangerous stuff taxpayers subsidize?
In the mean time, lay off the much safer stuff I buy and pay for with my own money.
I wouldn't say zero evidence. The post did appear on /pol/. It is reasonable to infer that at least some people from there signed the petition. And it is reasonable to infer that some of the people from there who signed the petition weren't part of the /lgbt/ community.
They're fraudlent because they say they hate gays just as much as the trannies and started it just to shit things up for both.
Being straight and hating gays is kinda mutually exclusive to being gay, let alone representative of anything.
>I'd never argue that people can't do what they want
Medically justified as a common sense solution no less.
The only thing I said is that your claim that most people are faking it doesn't seem terribly credible considering that even here you get threads checking all the biomarker stuff off all the time.
And even so, I'm just gonna reiterate what I said in >>5191898 and point out the financial gains doctors would get from transexuals using the same type of hormones and same type of cosmetic surgeries normal people get is minuscule.
The idea that doctors support this just to get a much smaller pool of clients with much smaller profit margins than what they already have is not terribly compelling.