Just saw this at the bookstore. Checked the archives and no-one on /lit/ had made a post about it previously, despite the fact that it was released several days ago.
Wheel of Time is not lowbrow and transcends genre. In /lit/'s formative years, Wheel of Time was an extremely popular and entertaining topic of discussion. What happened to /lit/? Why is every single thread now about 101 curricula and anything ignored by academia is ignored by /lit/?
The Wheel of Time Companion says Bela survived, btw.
>Wheel of Time is not lowbrow and transcends genre.
Both of these are bullshit. I read the first or so before I had enough. It wasn't the worst thing I've read but it didn't transcend shit.
I don't know which is worse, the kids on here that just discovered "serious literature" and throw a tantrum every time they see anything genre related or the genre lovers that try to elevate their favorite books to something they will never be and never tried to be.
Sometimes it's fun to read a light hearted adventure, to escape from the world for a bit, but don't try to justify it like it's some deep fucking thing. It's escapism, escapism is fine, and escapism can help you through some really low points in life.
Are you serious right now? If so that's the saddest attempt of trying to legitimize your love of fantasy.
But just for a chance to show off on the internet to someone that thinks such a bullshit number matters, it's 151.
I have nothing against Wheel of Time. I like fantasy, it's fun to read a fantasy novel sometimes but please stop trying so hard. It's not that deep and that's just fine.
>I've found that sub-gifted types don't really understand the Wheel of Time fully.
WoT was a great read. Even if there was a bit of a slog through books 8-10, it was a great series. I love that RJ was able to craft a bunch of characters to hate, like Elayne or Cadsuane. Normally, most we're supposed to like every character, but RJ did a great job of cultivating absolute cunts. That said, he made a bunch of characters who are just great, like Mat or Bryne.
So do you think discussion of any bad writer never benefits the board, or RJ in particular for some reason.
I think wot's aight. And I believe discussion of bad writers can bear fruit.
I definitely didn't mean "RJ is a bad writer THEREFORE /lit/ wouldn't benefit from discussion of WoT".
And I agree with you in that "discussion of bad writers can bear fruit" is a statement statement so general, so inclusive, that only the thoughtless could object.
I appreciate Jordan a lot more than I do Tolstoy. In either case, unless you believe you can grok a work in translation (or, you understand Russian) you probably should have used better examples.
In modern mainstream fiction, if you discuss good and evil, you're castigated for being judgmental or for being old-fashioned. Originally this was a way of deciding which was the greater wrong ('It is wrong to steal, but my child is starving to death. Obviously, in that situation it is better to steal than to let my child die of hunger.') But today that has been transmogrified into a belief that anything goes, it's what you can get by with, and there is no real morality, no right, no wrong—it's simply what produces the Platonic definition of evil: 'a temporary disadvantage for the one perceiving evil.'
In fantasy, we can talk about right and wrong, and good and evil, and do it with a straight face. We can discuss morality or ethics, and believe that these things are important, where you cannot in mainstream fiction. It's part of the reason why I believe fantasy is perhaps the oldest form of literature in the world, at least in the western canon. You go back not simply to Beowulf but The Epic of Gilgamesh.
And it survives pervasively today. People in the field of science fiction and fantasy are willing to accept that the magic realists are fantasy writers, but to the world at large, 'Oh no, that's not fantasy, that's literature.' Yes it is fantasy. And a lot of other things, that are published as mainstream, really are fantasy but not identified as such.
I'm glad this is coming out because world building was the only think Jordan was good at (except maybe meaningful one-liners).
>Wheel of Time is not lowbrow and transcends genre.
WoT is unfortunately both.
> In /lit/'s formative years, Wheel of Time was an extremely popular and entertaining topic of discussion.
WoT discussion was great while it was still going on because there were so many unsolved things going on. Although the last book was the best, almost everyone lost interest in WoT after it completed.
>The Wheel of Time Companion says Bela survived, btw.
I am genuinely interested to read about this.
Wheel of Time is not bad because it's genre fiction. Wheel of Time is bad because Robert Jordan was an atrocious, indulgent novelist. Any editor that he wasn't married to would have crossed out about half of each book. The character motivations were absolute garbage. Every single romance developed just because the characters magically fell in love. All action was hidden behind 1000 pages of worthless text and subjugated to the last 5.
I could go on for multiple posts -- because WoT is possibly the most flawed book series ever written -- but I am getting outraged and autistic just thinking about it. Every time I think of WoT I wish Jordan wasn't dead, JUST because I want to tell him what a terrible, insulting author he is.
Actually, it's quite well-written.
>Although the last book was the best
Ha ha, no. Brandon Sanderson is a terrible author, one of the worst working today. He didn't even read the notes.
I really enjoy the fact that so many people propagate memes instead of doing proper analysis of The Wheel of Time, and underappreciate it as a result.
It won't be a critical darling for at least a hundred more years. It will never be memed on Instagram. It's great, actually.
Having just finished the WOT after a 6 month binge, let me clarify a few things:
1) The dialogue, motivations and character interactions were pretty fucking atrocious at times. Full of braid tucking, lip pursing, snorting, light!, blood and bloody ashes! Honestly I felt embarrassed sometimes about how much I enjoyed it when I came across passages like that.
2) The writing is repetitive at times, and as said before, could have used a harsher editor.
3) Some books are super slow, which I didn't mind or notice that much, because when one finished I just picked up the next.
For all of it's faults, I absolutely loved it. I haven't been that engrossed in a world ever, and the story lines, adventures, and the "world building" were pretty goddamn epic. You really do begin to care about the characters, and the way the plot moves along is enticing.
It is not fabulously written, but I didn't enjoy it for the writing, but the story. The characters can be wooden sometimes, but a lot of that can be justified using in-world examples.
It is a masterpiece of world building and "high fantasy" and highly entertaining.