i know you guys always make fun of vaporwave and macintosh plus but what do you honestly think of her music?
i think she's mediocre at times, honestly. i like Polytravellers (mainly because i'm an ambient nut) and a few other songs from other albums by her, but she just has a very inconsistent discography overall.
>there are people who actually think that gender dysphoria is normal and not a mental illness
She's okay. If FS had never come out she would be on the same level as all of the other first wavers of vaporwave in terms of popularity. Too many releases with too much filler. As is the case with 90% of vapor artists. Dudes got talent, just needs a filter.
i'm loving this "phobia" meme
what else is out there
the simple fact that they exist elsewhere outside of the human species proves that that statement is false. simply because people have a hard time coping with someone they can't classify as traditionally male or female doesn't make them an oddity
just fuck off. there is no such thing as a mental "norm". why don't we take the most hetero, intelligent, happy, functional person in the world and then label every single way in which YOU deviate from them cognitively as a "mental illness".
"mental illness" is NOT a term that we should use to stigmatise people. it is a tool, an arbitrary description we made up to describe abnormal variations in the way someone's brain works IF those changes are obviously significantly detrimental to that person's wellbeing and functionality. it is intended to separate individuals from the symptoms they've involuntarily developed, in the same way that we do not criticise and humiliate people for deigning to, say, develop cancer.
it is not the norm nor is it ideal to be trans for the trans person themselves, and it obviously is the result of some kind of atypical brain development or something such. nobody's arguing that. but they exist in the millions, they are human beings with the same rights as anybody else, and society has to deal with that, not just bitch and moan about how nature is WRONG and everybody should be straight and cis and mentally healthy and tall and white and beautiful. the point is that trans people are perfectly capable of being happy, productive, successful people, comfortable in their appearance and their body, making full use of their intellect, functioning within society. by far the main thing holding them back is OTHER people and their stupid outdated bigotry and biases (i.e. you). Obviously this is not on par with things like schizophrenia, severe depression, bipolar disorder, borderline, etc. because these are obviously significantly detrimental to the quality of life of the sufferer even in a vacuum, and regardless of the supportiveness of others around them will almost certainly impair their ability to function as happy and independent individuals.
This is true except sex isn't always, intersexed people exist.
The >her meme is getting to be really pathetic though. Like whether or not you agree with people transitioning, that's so not even the point, it's a discussion on the persons music, not gender.
Yall are cancer
So I'm not that guy but as a person who has gender dysphoria I'm gonna tell you you're a fucking idiot for claiming gender dysphoria is normal. It's not. Transitioning is my method of dealing with the thing that's wrong with my biology.
Being transgender isn't a mental illness. Having dysphoria is, you fucking twat.
>it is not the norm nor is it ideal to be trans for the trans person themselves, and it obviously is the result of some kind of atypical brain development or something such
Didn't know gender dysphoria also severely impaired reading comprehension, retard
as someone else said, I very clearly acknowledged that dysphoria isn't normal. i just said that even though it is abnormal people don't deserve to be ridiculed and dismissed as somehow sub-human for experiencing it.
thanks for reading thoroughly, not jumping to conclusions, and not being a dick, though.
What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Navy Seals, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret raids on Al-Quaeda, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in gorilla warfare and I’m the top sniper in the entire US armed forces. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of spies across the USA and your IP is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re fucking dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that’s just with my bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in unarmed combat, but I have access to the entire arsenal of the United States Marine Corps and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little “clever” comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue. But you couldn’t, you didn’t, and now you’re paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it. You’re fucking dead, kiddo.
Society is wrong. People with "dysphoria" are only allowing gender norms to reign supreme.
No, you didn't. You heckled that one dude when he said dysphoria wasn't normal and that it was a mental illness. There was no ridicule or stigma, he just stated facts.
You're contradicting yourself, bruh.
>reading is hard :( thinking is hard :( i'll just use this dank may may that the internet tells me means i don't have to do bother with any of that yet somehow YOU'RE the one in the wrong
you know you have to be an adult to post on 4chan, right?
People with dysphoria (I like the condescending quote marks you used, nice touch) aren't doing jack shit with gender norms. It's a biological condition that causes psychological damage. At this point, transition is the most effective means of treatment. That doesn't have shit to do with society. It's possible to have dysphoria, transition one's physical sex, and still not conform to gender norms. My boyfriend and I are both pretty great examples of that. I'm a butchy trans girl and he's the most flowery trans guy you'll probably ever meet.
>getting this buttflastered defending trannies on a memegenre thread, in a ebin memes website
But you can't transition to being an actual woman. You're just a dude with a chopped off dick on hormones. You have absolutely no idea what it means to be a woman, never will and will just end up as some bigger mess of seeping makeshift orifices and hormone smoothies.
PS. Make sure when they bury you, you get cremated so someone doesn't offend you after death by using the wrong pronoun or whatever the fuck people do now to facilitate people that should be getting psychological treatment.
the low effort tranny meme is arguably the spiciest meme of our time - half of these men don't even bother covering up their fucking stubble
like I have no fucking idea what the thing in the OP is supposed to be or if he's trying to cosplay as the Weasley twins, but holy shit lmao atleast fucking try
I'll be honest with you /mu/ and 4chan BBS.
I only come to check 'em, checking intensifies, why so much check? Did you check 'em already?
It means, there are 1 per 49 threads that you could actually share something on, if it's not obviously your love story with the /kpop/
You couldn't have gender dysphoria if there were not gender norms. Transitioning to treat it is by definition catering to those gender norms.
I have identity "dysphoria" and can't do anything about it.
Regardless of your opinion on transgender-related topics, the fact that people can't just use a word describing a person in a sentence is pure unbridled autism. Why are nicknames okay but a three-letter word isn't?
No, you're just uninformed.
Gender is a socially constructed idea, yes. The norms, attitudes, behaviors, and expectations assigned to the two sexes are artifical and have no basis in biology. This is gender identity, a human concept.
Sex is the biological and physiological spectrum (more like a pages-long checklist, really) of primary and secondary sexual characteristics.
Sex dysphoria, contrary to popular belief (mostly tumblr-tards), does not come from a person wishing to engage in the gender norms of the opposite sex. It comes from a neurological disturbance in hormonal chemistry in the brain's development, usually around puberty, that causes a psychological rejection of the body's primary and secondary sexual characteristics around the time of bodily development. If not treated then, it manifests into a full on rejection of one's biological sex.
I suffer from dysphoria. It started roughly around the age of 13 and progressed further and further until I decided to confront it at the age of 21. It doesn't spring from wanting to wear dresses, grow flowers and be a pretty girl. I reject most gender norms assigned to women. Dysphoria has nothing to do with identity. It's a condition. It causes me pain. Transition is my means of addressing it.
Make sense now?
bullshit special snowflakes jumping the bandwagon of legitimate gender dysphoria to justify their childish desire to be book and video game characters because normal life is too boring. it is logical from what we know of how gender develops, and backed to an extent scientifically, to be transgendered. it's some fallacious new age hippie bullshit to think that somehow you are actually your favourite video game character or a dragon or a plant or some similar bullshit, at best means you're just an embarrassing attention whore who's a little too obsessed with their fave fantasy universe and too easily influenced by internet fads, at worst indicates you are genuinely mentally ill and desperately need to be treated. it's harmful to the trans cause because it is such blatantly childish, ludicrous bullshit, and if/when people unfamiliar with trans issues see it lumped in there they'll be more likely to dismiss transgender people as similarly delusional.
>bullshit special snowflakes jumping the bandwagon of legitimate gender dysphoria to justify their childish desire to be book and video game characters because normal life is too boring.
literally the same thing can be said for most trans people these days.
gender dysphoria isn't as common as you're led to believe on the internet.
>implying either of those two things have anything to do with the conversation
>implying animals aren't capable of constructing gender roles artificially and arbitrarily the same way humans are because humans are also animals
Gender roles as a concept are a consequence of and construction based on sex, not a predictor of nor indicator or it.
>mfw any sjw will get butthurt over any social issue
>mfw you get this butthurt on a japanese imageboard
>psychological rejection of the body's primary and secondary sexual characteristics
Can't you just like watch Videodrome or something?
Your psychology is caused by gender, no?
>gender dysphoria isn't as common as you're led to believe
To be fair, this is actually true. There are scores of "trans" people who transgress gender presentation merely as an execution of personal freedom rather than medical necessity. And in all honesty, I think it's an admirable choice to do so, but they need to stop pretending it's a necessity for them and admit they just like being gender antagonists.
No, your psychological state is both affected by and effected by society's gender expectations, but it's not as simple as changing your attitude about it.
I wish it were. I struggled with it for years. If it were as simple as saying "Well, I guess being a guy isn't so bad", that'd be pretty radical.
Honestly, if they all just admitted that they just liked pushing gender boundaries and weren't transitioning for medical reasons, I wouldn't even be upset. But pretending to have dysphoria is pretty insulting to those of us who have it and have brinked on the edge of suicide over it countless times and nearly lost family over it. It's not cute. It doesn't make you special. It's just like people w ho pretend to have schizophrenia or something similar.
When did 4chan become so accepting of the mentally ill?
You're either born a man, or a woman. If you have a penis, you're a man. And vice versa with women
Quit complicating things you fucking losers
I agree with you on the latter point (I'm not so sure on the former, since I'm not familiar with her on a personal level), but I think there are plenty of people here who would rather never have had to hear her music.
>they need to stop pretending it's a necessity for them and admit they just like being gender antagonists.
Is there even a practical difference, though? You get treated equally as shitty by mainstream society and I'd wager that the antagonists do feel a legitimate need to some degree.
Yeah, and I agree that it's a cunt move, like >>54198134 says, to jump the transtrend bandwagon because you wanna be different or progressive if you claim that you're genuinely trans, experience dysphoria, etc. when in reality you aren't/don't. Defy gender norms all you want, but yeah, don't pretend it's anything more than that because you're doing actual trans people for whom it is genuinely a distressing pyschological issue a total disservice.
It's a slippery slope to go down though to start trying to draw the line between transtrenders who claim to be legit but aren't and trans people who genuinely experience dysphoria.
That's a fair point I hadn't considered. Even for those who do it out of preference, it still doesn't appear to be a walk in the park. In retrospect, I suppose my anger stems from the fear that people who don't have dysphoria but still transition make those of us who do have it seem disingenuous, but that's probably an ego-related thing.
Like I said, I still think transgressing and/or dismantling gender roles is admirable enough as an action despite the incentive, I just wish people would be honest because those who aren't cause the line to be blurred.
I think I sort of see what you mean, but I think the inquisition against "transtrenders" only contributes to the problem. The fact that society AND the trans crowd doesn't accept partial gender deviancy as a legitimate expression kind of forces those who are in between to choose one or the other. I don't know, I just can't imagine that anyone would willingly choose to hate their body and very person while also being reviled by like 90% of the populace just to be trendy in very niche internet circles.
You've given me a lot of material for reflection. The LGBT community already suffers enough internal struggle, so I suppose you're right. If intersectionality is REALLY our goal, it's wrong of us to dismiss those we might see as having only one foot in the door, so to speak.
Though like I've said, my only problem with transtrenders is the lack of honesty when it comes to intent, but that's a personal problem I have to overcome. It's ego-related, because my identity feels threatened by those who are able to get on hormones and receive treatment when they didn't have to go through the pain I did all those years. But your post has helped me realize that maybe it's not so bad, and I should just be happy for them that they've found a way to express themselves without having to endure what I've endured. I feel like more people with that attitude of non-attachment to people's intentions would be a big step towards community and intersectionality.
Thanks for your contributions, you've helped me see things in a pretty rad light. I appreciate it.
> you just dont browse tumblr
And that is where your argument is now moot.
No matter what anyone thinks about all this, /mu/ is not the place to discuss it.