>>468727 Sure. It's a "outdoor organization" ran by discriminatory christian douche bags, which has gone from a "awesome outdoor experience" for wealthy white christian boys to... well. It's still only for white christian boys, but now the "awesome outdoor experience" is sadly lacking.
>>468738 >much wordier Lets break down the camping one and see how much actual adventuring and outdoorsmanship there is. 1. None. Explaining safety 2. None. Explaining (not doing) cleaning 3. None. Making a plan (that will not be followed) 4. None. Making a plan (that will not be followed) 5. None. Explaining how to pack. 6. None. Explaining what to pack. 7. None. Making a plan (that will not be followed) 8. Cook 3 meals. Explain safety and make a plan. 9. Camp 20 nights and go on 2/6 item trips (boats, bikes, rappelling). Also plan and carry out a community service project (that will not go towards your eagle scout badge. 10. Explain what you've learned and how it makes you a better citizen. Also weave the mission statements into your explanation
Safety aside, this can be broken down to: >Cook breakfast, lunch, and dinner. >Camp 20 nights >Rock repel, bike ride on a trial, climb a mountain, row boat, or sleep in the snow.
Kids do not learn by being in a class room and no kid wants to spend 9/10ths of their time listening to presentations when they could be doing something. It is time to replace the boy scouts.
Is three saying the scout has to meet the standard of the event he talks about in two?
Or is three saying the boy has to meet each of the standards listed in the table? The table is a long one but lists things like "pull-ups" which don't seem like a "track and field event" for which you can list rules, right?
>>468800 1. Explain Safety 2. Explain Safety 3. 4 months of an activity 4. Explain rules and sportsmanship 5. Complete four events and do better 3 months later. 6. Organize sports meet with an official on the premise.
>>468803 I think it is meeting the requirements of the chart.
>>468782 >Kids do not learn by being in a class room and no kid wants to spend 9/10ths of their time listening to presentations when they could be doing something. >It is time to replace the boy scouts. Yep. I'm my kid's den leader (he's a bear) and the restrictions on what you can and cannot do are idiotic. My wife's the other den leader. I let her handle most of it because it pisses me the fuck off to even read his manual.
Man, American Scouting sounds gay as fuck. Britbong here, and for half the year we didn't even have our weekly meetings in a building, we went down to our scout campsite and played widegames and practised knots and learnt survival skills and fire building and pissed about in the river. Scouts was genuinely the best thing I ever did.
>>468821 Yeah, and we're kind of looking into it. Only problem is the local Area Council is named after my wife's grandfather and she has emotional attachments to this pack as her grandfather, father, and brother were in it. This fucked-up pack is why my oldest kid, who was in a good pack but a bad situation when he lived with his mother was almost to an eagle and didn't get to finish. Scoutmaster didn't like having a new kid in town ahead of some of the locals. Politics is bullshit, especially in something like scouts.
>>468736 Really? Perhaps the American scouting movement is infected by deeply religious zealots, like many other parts of that society? Swearing allegiance to god and the queen is part of the original promise, but they're just words.
I'm pretty sure Lord Baden Powell didn't start the movement as a religious one. It's a pretty cool society in the UK still anyway, I went and my kids go now. They had 4 camps that I recall last year, they cut their fingers with knives, made penny stoves, knots and fires all good stuff...
>>468842 When I was a scout in Norway it really depended on the scout leaders personality. We had one guy whos main focus was on the religious part, he would have us sit down some times and dedicate that weeks meeting to bible stuff. Those were my least favourite scout meets of course. I stayed for the outdoors trips. There were some really awesome trips. The other leader couldn't be bothered with that religious stuff and during a big regional meet he took us to the football field to play football while all the others (hundreds of scouts from all over) were sitting in front of a stage and listening to psalms.
>>468890 >Boy scout in France >Approx 14, second-in-command >Ask the younger ones to set up the tent, while I start a fire >A youngling asks to relieve himself >I magnanimously grant him permission >Says he can't find toilet paper >I say I don't give a fuck >He leaves
>The morning after >I quickly go exploring the nearest field to take a leak >See shiny stuff everywhere >WTF?! >I go take a look
>The dumb fuck didn't find toilet paper, so he used fucking aluminum foil. >We both drop, and he gives me twenty > I then order him to pick up every single bit of aluminum on the field >"B...but it's covered in shit" > I don't reply..I stare at him with that hatred/pity/you-re-a-fucktard look >He scrams
>It's summer camp time! >A week in the woods with a few hundred scout bros >Everyone in the troop going, even the ones that just show up once a month >Even Michael the new little kid
Michael came to meetings, but never campouts. Not fat, but getting chubby. Total momma's boy. He'd been in the Troop for 4 months and had just gotten his Tenderfoot.
>As we're loading the trailer, Michael's mom pulls aside the Scoutmaster to talk to him >Hands him a pile of letters for Michael, 3 per day for the whole week, with what time of day she wanted him to get them >Scoutmaster (who was a total bro) has a classic What The Fuck look on his face as she leaves >I was Senior Patrol Leader and he and I discuss this weirdness on the 3 hour drive to the camp >We get there, check in, and go to our assigned campsite >Scoutmaster figures, "Fuck it", and hands Michael letter #1 >The kid immediately bursts into tears and sits down in the dirt, still crying >No one has idea what the fuck to do with him, wind up leaving him there when we go to lunch
The next week included the following: >Michael never changed clothes--he stayed in his Class A uniform the entire time >He never showered >As far as we know he did not take a shit for 6 days--someone told him there were spiders in the latrine and this freaked him out to no end >He hid from us before meals and survived on candy he bought at the camp store >He didn't sleep in the canvas tent. Sometimes we'd find him passed out under a tree somewhere. >He skipped all the activities he was supposed to do >All the running away and hiding left him absolutely filthy. By the end of the week he resembled a survivor of a carpet bombing. >This crust of filth was marked by a series of channels on his cheeks that had been carved by his tears
The Scoutmaster and those of us in troop leadership just didn't feel like dealing with it. In a way it turned entertaining after a while. You'd see him crouching like a feral animal in the bushes at twilight.
>>468815 It's worse in Canada. My son just joined the beaver scouts (the age 5-8 boy scouts program). I get told by "Rainbow" and "Sunshine" the female lodge leaders, that it's no longer called the Boy Scouts of Canada, it's now just Scouts Canada. Reason being, a few years back a couple of girls wanted to join Boy Scouts. Apparently Girl Guides/Girl Scouts/Brownies wasn't good enough for them so their parents sued Boy Scouts to allow girls. Now it's Scouts Canada and it's co-ed. I am not happy about this. Modern feminism and SJWs have overthrown one of the best and oldest fraternal organizations in North America.
>>468842 >>468854 >>468920 The Boy Scouts of America are basically owned by the Mormon church. They call all the shots and are increasingly making or keeping it a white, upper class, straight only, protestant organization. They have been battling in courts for years now about whether or not they have to admit gay or pro-gay kids and atheist kids. As of right now neither are allowed in.
In Canada you still swear allegiance to God, Queen, and country, but god can mean any higher power and the meetings themselves have no religious context. In our town they are however held in the gymnasium at the United Church of Canada, which is our version of the Church of England.
>>468960 >Modern feminism and SJWs have overthrown one of the best and oldest fraternal organizations in North America.
My nephew went thru Cub Scouts and into Webelos but once there and they did a few camping outings, his dad pretty much dropped him out of it, as while there were no girls involved, the _moms_ were and actually went on camping trips with the troop(!) which turned into a lame "family" outing and not Boy Scouts.
>>468960 >Apparently Girl Guides/Girl Scouts/Brownies wasn't good enough for them so their parents sued Boy Scouts to allow girls.
Could you even image the shit storm if it happened the other way around? Girls get patches for going to build a bear and stuff. And could you imagine the embarrassment of being that one troop, the one who ruined it for everyone, the one with the girl who needs her own bathroom and tent because she can't share.
I mean, women are barley people as it is. Couldn't they just be ashamed of their existence and not fuck up everything for everyone?
Some people are REALLY insecure about the idea of women in any of their ole boy clubs because they think all women cringe at the idea of physical labor and being dirty.
In all of the outdoors shit I've been involved in, the women had no problem keeping up. The only problem with .young. girls is that parents want to treat them like dainty dolls and then fret when the girl child is less than useless outdoors.
I personally don't care if you want to keep troops segregated by sex because there's some hygienic shit girls could stand to learn about the outdoors that boys don't need. But there needs to be an avenue for parents who want their girls to actually become outdoors people vs parents who want their girls outside but don't want them to actually do shit.
>>468782 >Kids do not learn by being in a class room and no kid wants to spend 9/10ths of their time listening to presentations when they could be doing something. >It is time to replace the boy scouts
When i was in scouts, on the first day of a merit badge at summer camp all we went over was first aid an "safety." Every. Single. Time. For environmental awareness or whatever it was we went over first aid. It was insane
>Grow up in Tokyo >Join local chapter of 'Murrican Boy Scouts for expats >Love the hell out of it, earn badges and gain ranks, etc... >forced to move back to US, try to join local Scout Troop >"lol you have to start over because we've never heard of the scouts being in any other countries" >yeah, nah, y'all are cunts
Years later my friends, who happened to all be in the local scout troop, told me that it would have been super easy to re-do and there was no good reason for me not to join again.
I still regret it to this day.
(http://www.fareastcouncil.org/join-scouting/units-in-the-council in case any of you don't believe that there are Boy Scout troops overseas)
>>468960 Apparently Girl Guides/Girl Scouts/Brownies wasn't good enough for them
see, i'm split on this issue. i had a fucking awesome time in scouts, and definitely understand the advantages of it being all-male. there's a ton of social pressure that gets shrugged off by separating boys and girls in adolescence, makes it easier to pay attention, etc etc.
but i feel bad for the girls who want to learn how to go /out/. not sure how the Canadian version is, but here in the US girl scouts is fucking pathetic. my sister was in up until maybe third grade, they would go "camping" once a year in a cabin with running water and electricity. the leader bought a bunch of bed sheets exclusively for this trip, and then threw them out afterwards because they were dirty. not donated them to homeless shelters, not used them for crafts, straight up ditched them.
I think it's Explorers that has co-ed options around high school age, focusing on high adventure activities. that's a good time to teach boys how to behave around girls without being total spergs, and help keep girls interested in the outdoors. it'd be nice if there could be two tracks, one for boys and one for girls, that could come together around upper middle school/high school age for bigger activities like high adventure trips, but still have separate meetings and smaller trips.
>>468969 actually, openly gay boys are now allowed in BSA, but openly gay leaders are not. the Mormon Church was actually in favor of allowing them in, it was the deeply religious South that heavily opposed it. The backing of the Mormons is basically why they were allowed in.
>Be in Scouts ever since age 5 >was a useless idiot with 2 left hands as a kid >became capable of doing stuff because of scouts >become first in command of sub-group >order around minions just like they ordered me around. >having fun with my bros who are also in command of other sub groups >wait, my minions dont follow my commands! >what is this insubordination? >have a chat with scout leader who helps me become a good leader of my sub group >helps me remember how my sub group leader wasnt the tyrant I Always thought but actually a good guy >become bro leader to sub group: discuss tasks we have to do and who should do them etc.
Fuck, the shit I learned from the Scouts is still usefull. When we are doing group projects at uni I see fuckers at age 23 who have less group skills then me at age 14.
Also, skip ahead to current day: >be old enough to become scout leader >choice between boys age 11-15 or girls age 11-15 >all bros are scout leaders at the boys group >fuck it, new experience can be fun >choose the girl group >be the first male leader in 2 years >female leaders have fucked the group up in the 2 years in between >all the kids do is crafts and games >kids start dropping out & are constantly complaining its too tough >start introducing basic scout elements like hiking, reading a map, using a compass, building rafts and making fires. >kids complain loudly in first instance >they start enjoying themselves more and more >skip 4 years later >girl group is now a group of kids that is having fun cooking on campfire whilst some scout leaders rather cook on gas
>be me at ~16 >up at scout camp >every year at camp, we take this giant cargo net that was originally used to tie down gear and hang it up by four trees, then use it as a giant swing for like 10 people >we had this chant where half of the group would whisper "Jews" as they swing the net >the other side would whisper "Us" as they swung the other way >as we swing back and forth the chanting would get louder and louder until we were all yelling at the top of our lungs >at some point we get complaints from the troop next to us (they had like 6 jewish kids with their parents and they were mad as fuck) >Scoutmaster was a total bro and passed it off as us saying "Jesus" but in a weird accent >many keks were had as we continued to yell as angry parents stared at us
>>469000 >Some people are REALLY insecure about the idea of women in any of their ole boy clubs because they think all women cringe at the idea of physical labor and being dirty.
>N...NAWALT, man, NAWALT!
Once you get women involved it's only a matter of time before they start insisting that you figuratively take down the calender with bikini models on it.
If you let them in your hunting club pretty soon killing animals will be against the rules and they will insist that looking for geocaches with summer sausages in them is just as good.
Of course not all women are like that, but most are, and some of the ones that are will want to warp the purpose of the "boy's club" in ways that are hard to change back when the organization is filled with women that have an instinctual aversion to danger, dirt etc.
>>468960 >I am not happy about this. Modern feminism and SJWs have overthrown one of the best and oldest fraternal organizations in North America.
American scouts sounds like a piss poor version of the British original. You must be a faggot if you're afraid of girls, in the UK, girls who want to learn how to paint nails and do hair join girl guides and girls who want to make fires, put up tents and cook outdoors join scouts. I got laid more than once at scout camp. Beats being molested by some religious nutjob at an all male sleepover..
>>>>469000 Just as often it's an issue of insecurity the other way around. A lot of people are threatened by the idea of segregated fraternal and sororal societies. Now we only associate them with geriatric organizations like the Red Hat society or Masons, religious organizations like the Knights of Colombus, and at Universities with Grecian societies. But the idea that girls and boys benefitted from time among peers of their own gender was a given until very recently. Fact is, it's not just hygiene differences between the sexes, plumbing isn't the only thing that seperates us; there are cultural and societal differences too. Those are often best addressed by people of the same background and experience, rather than try and include everyone in a "one size fits all" box. There are many organizations like girl scouts or girl guides that mirror the lessons taught in boy scouts but are also taught to girls from an /out/door woman's perspective. I have a daughter as well as a son, because she looks up to her big brother and her dad she likes to do all the things we enjoy, like woodsrunning, camping, fishing, etc. I encourage this, but in a year when she is old enough I will not be enrolling her in Scouts Canada (formerly BOY Scouts of Canada), I will sign her up for Girl Guides and take an active role in her participation of that program. It has nothing to do with insecurity. She deserves to be part of an outdoor sorority with a tradition of producing exemplary women with a vast knowlege of the outdoors. Girl Guides has been good enough for 106 years and for over 7 million girls, the boy scouts for even longer, I don't want my kids to be the first generation that threw out more than a century of tradition and history because some kid's parents care more about (bullshit) social justice, than they do about the actual programs, their past, their purpose, and their individual merits.
>>469066 Gender segregated environments have their benefits, in education for one thing. Of course, this is provided the learning outcomes are the same.
It has long been the tendency in the (UK) scouting movement to have vastly different activities for boys and girls, especially in the younger years. This does encourage choice, among girls at least, I don't think boys are allowed to join Rainbows, Brownies or Guides, but lots of girls prefer to choose the more exciting activities that Beavers / Cubs or Scouts offer.
I was in the boy scouts for a while. The leader's son was an absolute cunt and my step father was a piece of shit. Really soured me on that, honestly. The son and his friend were never disciplined and I hated (and still do) my piece of shit step father.
That was my experience in scouts. One leader was a great guy though. Had problems walking and needed crutches but still did everything he could, and more. Saw him a few times at my magnet school.
>>469085 If it were up to me, I would ban the leader's child from being in his fathers troop.
When I was at an island retreat, me and my friend were kayaking out near the island 1/2 a mile from the shore. His son comes out on his own kayak, flips mine, takes it, and goes back. I had to swim for half a mile. When I complained to the scout master, he's just like "Eh".
Not to mention, our stupid scout master decided that he couldn't teach Simple Simon because it wasn't in the book.
>>468960 They started letting girls in the Rovers in the 70s and It's been fully coed since 1998, dickhead. It's also good for your kid to learn to respect both sexes, since you're obviously a worthless role model.
Eagle Scout here. I was in the program since Cub Scouts as a Tiger. I have to agree the badge system does suck. It gives you an OK introduction to the sport/ skill but hardly any more than that. As far as my troop goes we were pretty active. Other than the stock summer camp trips we started doing more backpacking just as I aged out. Overall I'd say my troop was a little better about Doing rather than learning badges. >>469075 >>469090 Not sure where where this is coming from. We do give credit to Powell where credit is due. Also Scout trivia has drilled the difference between Powell and Boyce into my head forever.
>>469233 It's quite clear now that culture had good reasons for segregating men and women, at times. Thinking we are so much smarter than our ancestors about this has been a terrible mistake for civilization.
I'm not scared of strong independent women, nor am I gay and I don't detest anything feminine, but I really think Scouts is better without girls. For a couple of hours a week, and a few weekends throughout the year, it was a chance to be sociable with just a group of fellow boys and men, and I feel that was very healthy for me. I have nothing against girls learning survival skills etc, and wouldn't be opposed if someone started a mixed gender society, but I think Scouts is something more than that. It's about camaraderie and learning how to be a better man (and I'm sure that my leaders would agree that it's very nice to be able to get away from women for a bit). As well as that, pubertal boys will act differently around girls, trying to impress them, or chatting to them at every opportunity they get. Kids have fucking 6h a day at school to do that, as well as any free time they wish to spend, why is it needing to be forced on Scouts as well?
Again, I'm pretty sure I'm a healthy, well-adjusted individual, but part of that is down to my time in Scouts.
I personally dgaf if scouts stay all boys so long as some thing becomes available for girls that isn't the trashy sop that you might call girl scouts. I laugh every time a guy whines about women being superficial, weak and opposed to the outdoors, and then bars young girls from the chance to do so.
In my experience with grade school kids, they all start out the same; girls are just as competitive as the boys if not more so because they feel they have something to prove. Then around 3rd grade, suddenly mummy and daddy don't want princess to hurt herself or dirty her new dress. Little girls who are just as capable as their peers are told to pull back and not get in the way of the boys
Hell yes I'm mad, don't whine and balk about women not being outdoorsy, and then make it impossible for girls to learn the necessary skills to do from an early age. Especially when I see how amazing some women are out in the field.
>>469258 Except this isn't true. I'm in the Marine Corps where men and women both are theoretically exposed to the rough and tumble lifestyle but there is something about women, even Marines, that, in general, makes them inferior in an outdoor situation. Most whine, complain, and cannot physically hang with the boys. That's just my personal observation.
That said, I'm all for making the girl scouts more 'scouty' or opening up a sort of co-ed version of the scouts. But the boy scouts should remain closed to girls. There needs to be a place for male bonding time.
>>469258 >make it impossible for girls to learn the necessary skills to do from an early age.
Nobody is stopping girls from learning outdoor skills but shoe-horning girls into Boy Scouts (or moms going on Boy Scout outings) isn't about teaching girls skills, it's about politically correct feminists preventing boys (and girls) from doing anything at all.
"I can't do something or don't like doing something, so you shouldn't be allowed to do it and I'm going to be right here the whole time to make sure you can't!"
Once girls and moms are involved, it's no longer Boy Scouts and instead becomes safe and lame "family outings" where nothing of value is learned or experienced.
This is exactly why my nephew was pulled out of Scouting; a bunch of chattering bitches would be at the weekly meetings and go on the campouts and continually interfered in the process; "don't get dirty!", "don't play with that knife!", "get away from the fire!", "don't go too far!", etc and so on.
Meanwhile, none of these women contributed anything (as they have nothing to contribute) and would simply plant their asses in a lawn chair and expect the dads who were on the outing to wait on them hand and foot.....
Just because 50% of the population is female, doesn't mean that every conceivable event or activity must be 50% female.
>>469262 There is science behind the notion that women have "in-group preference" that men do not have.
ie. If in a mixed group a woman goes against you for some reason the women of the group will give her the benefit of the doubt. Even if you make a very good counter backed by evidence they want to believe her and will attempt to disregard it.
Men do not back each other up in this way, in fact they want to back up women against men as well. They do not do it quite as strongly as women do, though. The consequences of this are that if you had a group that is 50/50 - women are going to get their way every single time. You'd probably need at least 80/20 men to women to have a hope of women not getting their way.
So, what's wrong with women getting their way? They have instinctive desires to be safe and clean. If you get women in something like a scouting group you're going to see an inevitable shift towards not going innawoods, not taking any risks, not doing anything interesting.
It will only take one woman in a group to suggest something silly and non-/out/doorsy. All of the other women will back her up due to their in-group preference. Most of the men will then back the women up. Men that go against it will be made to seem like bullies. They are ATTACKING this poor woman that just wants her boys to be safe and camp in a rented instead of outside. What an asshole that man is, he should leave the group!
A very similar thing to this can and will happen in basically any gender-mixed group.
>>469269 >"don't play with that knife!" Kek, that reminds me. One time at camp this massive autist I was sort of friends with was getting teased by another boy, so the autist did the logical thing and next time it happened he pulled out his knife and held it up against the guy's chest. The rest of us thought it was hilarious and the kid just about shit himself. The leaders were all off having a beer at their fire, and when someone told them about the incident a couple of days later, they laughed even harder than we did and said the little shit deserved it.
If any of them had been women, I wouldn't be suprised if my friend had been sent to juvenile prison, and he probably would have been kicked out if he had done that to a girl, or even if a girl had just seen. But as it was, no-one had to get in trouble and we all had a good time.
>>469269 >Nobody is stopping girls from learning outdoor skills
At the same time no one is making it actively easier for them to be involved, and segregated organizations contribute to that. Like i said earlier, you can keep them segregated but in some way make girls organization that actually teaches outdoors skills as well as/instead of hair braiding and cookies
>"I can't do something or don't like doing something, so you shouldn't be allowed to do it and I'm going to be right here the whole time to make sure you can't!
I shouldn't be surprised that people are honestly convinced this is the majority of women but I'm not. It still does not invalidate my point. A few insufferable witches should not stand in the way of young girls receiving a proper education.
Yes, your nephew was in a shitty situation. He has the option to moving on to a different organization. Most girls only have girl "scouts" or nothing at all. Which is why I think it's necessary to make easier avenues for girls, which in part involves removing this idea that girls (and women) are not able to be in outdoors suggestions instead of being over emotional about catty helicopter mom's who are not even a majority of the population.
Even better, when you educate these girls properly, what happens? They grow up, have children and become the antithesis of a soccer mom
>>469285 >in some way make girls organization that actually teaches outdoors skills
You're assuming that this hypothetical organization won't eventually degrade into braiding and cookies. Why do you believe it won't happen?
>I shouldn't be surprised that people are honestly convinced this is the majority of women
It doesn't actually need to be a majority of women. You only need one dumb meddler and the other women will back her up rather than put her in her place, that's what they do.
>A few insufferable witches should not stand in the way of young girls receiving a proper education.
The young girls will not receive that proper education in boy scouts after the influence of women corrupts it into being girl scouts without the cookies. To get your desired outcome you need no adult women and very few female children. As long as the females are outnumbered they will mostly conform.
I did Scouts in Australia and it gave me the best experiences of my growing up. For most of it my unit/troop had more girls than boys and there was never any problems resulting from it (except the girls bitching about each other).
>>469270 >It will only take one woman in a group to suggest something silly and non-/out/doorsy. All of the other women will back her up due to their in-group preference. Most of the men will then back the women up.
This isn't my experience of life at all - I wonder, what kind of workplace environment this is true in?
>>469289 >You're assuming that this hypothetical organization won't eventually degrade into braiding and cookies. Why do you believe it won't happen?
How long do you expect this transformation to take? It hasn't happened in the last 30yrs in the UK, where girls and boys can join scouts. The girls have the option of braiding hair and painting nails in Brownies or Guides, those who want to learn different skills join Cubs or Scouts.
>>469232 1. Safety 2. Nutrition and Safety 3. Nutrition 4. Explain how to cook. 5.Prepare a nutritional menu and cook it, then get reviews on it. Also safety. 6. Repeat 5. 7. Repeat 5. 8. Research what you need to do to become a cook.
>>469325 >Teenagers. Guys will agree to whatever they think will make girls like them.
I don't remember being that pathetic as a teen. There were only a couple of girls in my scout pack, but plenty at school. Can't think of any environment where I'd prefer a sausage fest, women are awesome once you learn to deal with them.
>>469328 >I don't want to have to learn to deal with anyone on camp. You're admitting here that they are difficult.
I've never found women difficult, but all skills are learned - some come easier than others. I'd rather deal with some cute girl pitching my tent than some awkward autist - I find them harder to deal with.
>>469334 >By the look of these US scout badges they have already mutated. Admittedly this probably started before women...
Americans are well known for their capacity to fuck up any decent ideas - In the UK, the home of scouting, the badges still involve almost 100% activity.
>The impression I get is that you are abnormal in that you would be able to resist any natural inclinations and treat women as actual equals. But, do you believe that everyone else is like that?
Most people learn how to deal with / get along with girls at school - scouts is not much different, I remember being more focused on my own development, but enjoying the company of boys and girls in different ways, not much different to school.
Some people will always struggle at interpersonal relationships, with girls and boys, I have always found awkward people more difficult to deal with, be they male or female.
>>469117 >>469123 What does wanting your kid to have the classic boy scout experience that you grew up with have to do with not respecting women or being a bad role model? And "SJW" is just the common term for people extremely polarized to the left. Also I have never been to /v/, /int/ is my homeboard and the term is used there to describe radically liberal people that care more about progressivism than common sense. It has nothing to do with gamergate or their rabid anti - feminism that is jyst as bad as the SJWs but in the opposite direction. I started coming on /out/ recently because /int/ was overrun with /pol/ fags and they are just as bad as the SJWs. It's never healthy to be too far in any direction.
If the girl guides has become a pansy institution it should be adressed, some of their practices might need an overhaul. What does not need to be done, is to change another organization like the boy scouts.
I sent my daughter to cub scouts because she loves outdoorsy stuff, whittling bits of wood, making fires, fixing stuff, carrying swiss army knives and generally being prepared. She wanted to learn knots and climbing.
I couldn't give a fuck that some social oddball who hasn't learnt to deal with girls at school yet might be perturbed by it. Fucking retards / autists should be kept at home if they can't handle life.
Usually I don't give a shit about gender-related hand-wringing, but the anons talking abut how involving women in Boy Scouts can quickly ruin it have a serious point. I have the feeling that in some regard it's tied to local culture. Case in point, my troop:
>Started out rural Texas near Dallas >Troop was awesome outdoorsy guys and their bro-tier dads, who were all blue-collar >Dallas area experienced rapid population boom in the '90s, with many new residents coming from out of state >Our town turns into a suburb
One year when Webelos were picking which troop to join after crossing over, we had an insane bonfire on a campout where we had invited a bunch of Webelos dens along. 55 kids joined the troop as a result (which more than doubled our size). Many moms got involved. All of a sudden:
>Night-long games of capture-the-flag are banned >Bonfires are banned >Can't make kids sing silly songs at meetings to reclaim gear they forgot on campouts >Campouts drop to one a month, then one every 3 months >"Why would anyone want to go fishing?" >The yearly survival-style trip is deep-sixed >Curfew enforced on campouts >No more impromptu lessons on plumbing, auto repair, hunting, and carpentry >Troop meetings turn into moms "teaching" via videos they find
All the older guys who weren't close to Eagle quit. Those of us who did get Eagle didn't stay long. Maybe there's a place where involving moms in Scouts won't make it stop being outdoorsy and awesome, but I sure as hell haven't seen it.
Uk Scouts aren't Boy scouts, just Scouts, girls have been allowed in since the change in 2007. IMHO awesomeness of scout groups varies from group to group, and depends on how motivated the leaders are to get the kids out there.
>>469346 I don't keep a certain type of company, it's just the usual 4chan phrase for extreme progressives. If I were talking about this off of 4chan I would use a terms like "the far left" or "bored people." I am ewually critical of the far right and when referring to them on 4chan I use phrases like "/pol/ tier" or "inexperienced children/autists" My terminolgy aside, all I want is boy scouts to be a place where boys can go and learn some of the skills that will help them be men, without the distraction of women. They get plenty of chances to socialize with girls outside of Scouts, it's nice to have one place where boys can just be boys and have nothing outside that. The exact same thing stands for girl guides/scouts. If some of tjose chapters have become dainty or list sight of their purpose that should be adressed therein. It shouldn't be fixed by changing Boy Scouts to be more inclusive.
>>469388 >Night-long games of capture-the-flag are banned >Bonfires are banned >Can't make kids sing silly songs at meetings to reclaim gear they forgot on campouts >Campouts drop to one a month, then one every 3 months >"Why would anyone want to go fishing?" >The yearly survival-style trip is deep-sixed >Curfew enforced on campouts >No more impromptu lessons on plumbing, auto repair, hunting, and carpentry >Troop meetings turn into moms "teaching" via videos they find
Sounds like a steep decline, but as with all volunteer organisations, they're only as good as the people volunteering. In the UK we don't allow a barrage of parents to turn up and take over - you leave the kids - girl or boy and fuck off. You only need 3 people to a group of 30.
Do american parents accompany their kids to scouts or something?
>>469396 >all I want is boy scouts to be a place where boys can go and learn some of the skills that will help them be men
Care to elucidate? What manly skills can only be learned in the absence of women? My mother taught me to repair car bodywork, set engine timing and hone valve guides. I'd like to pass those skils to my daughter, only autists and weirdos get too hung up on skills being gender specific, a skill is a skill.
>>469400 I teach a lot of woods craft to my daughter as well. In addition to sailing, hunting, and fishing. I'm no mechanic but both my son and daughter will know how to troubleshoot problems, change tires, fluids, and filters, and not get screwed at an auto shop. It's not an issue of curriculum, both genders should be able to learn the same things. Hete are some readons I like gender seperation in scouts
1.) Tradition and history, these are very important to me. I am more pissed about the jew and shitty uniforms than I am about desegregation. 2.) It shouldn't be a social affair, it should be a learning experience. No matter what anyone says, when you mix sexes, people start worrying a lot more about how they look, or how they are being perceived than they should. It's not autism or basement dwellwer if you like a girl or boy in your den and want to impress her or him to the detriment of the program. 3.) Operating in gender specific groups allows each sex to learn from and with people that have more similar experiences to their own. 4.) Sometimes the boys just need a chance to be with the boys and the girls just need a chance to be with the girls. It's healthy to spend a little time with your gender peers.
>>469412 >1.) Tradition and history, these are very important to me.
Pretty poor reason to maintain anything imo - It was everyone's number one reason against the abolition of slavery wasn't it?
>It shouldn't be a social affair, it should be a learning experience. No matter what anyone says, when you mix sexes, people start worrying a lot more about how they look, or how they are being perceived than they should.
Depends on the age of the kids I suppose, membership in the scouting movement drops off heavily after 14 in the UK - when most people discover an interest in the opposite sex. It's harsh to say it, but anyone still involved after the age of 15 is pretty much a bit odd. My daughter doesn't bat an eye at being one of 3 girls in her pack but she's only 7.
>>468727 >be scout for 6 years >sell nothing but popcorn >dominate pinewood derby despite leader banning my designs >finally get to learn how to use a knife >fuckyeah, butterknives and plastic butter knives >carving session cut short 20 minutes in after troop leader breaks knife and stabs himself
Apparently I was in a troop that was nothing more than a afterschool daycare but fuck the scouts
>>469511 after just confessing that you were in a babby care troop you go on to say "fuck scouts" ? upper kek
i will concede that safety requirements in merit badges are so hilariously overdone, but once it was hammered into our thick heads we never had to ask again. more fun stuff can happen if you know how to be safe without having to look back
>>469527 >if some serious injuries happened in Europe
At some point, I'm guessing someone in some european country has lost a finger or something at scouts. No mass pack shootings here, but I consider americans significantly more litigious, not more accident prone.
Assuming I am rightfully attributing posts in this thread you were already suspicious there in that you appear to be completely unaware of the impact of letting females into a male space. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt, maybe you're in some rural area where you only run into capable women that do not suck, or something.
But it seems here you're willfully ignorant of something like gamergate as well... I'm thinking you're a leftist and at some point you have been conditioned to believe things like men and women are the same in all things and gender differences are a "social construct" but also irrelevant. You're being presented with a lot of anecdotal evidence here and you don't seem to be crediting anyone here's perception of their experience as accurate.
>>469881 >I'm a macho, macho man. So I can completely ignore the potential deleterious impact of women in a male space.
You guys are saying you've got all this social experience so I feel like I shouldn't have to be explaining this stuff to you. It isn't misogyny, it's just how the genders operate, broadly speaking. You want to take a few examples of women that don't fuck things up and suggest this is what all women do. I could even go so far as to credit you with describing the majority of women as being this way. But, some of them won't be that way. Some men will be fags and try to ruin shit too. But if a man acts like a fag people tell him to shut the fuck up and stop trying to ruin everyone's good time.
If a woman tries to fuck things up the other women will back her up, because they are social creatures and want to avoid confrontation among females. Then men like YOU will back them up. When a socially awkward nerd like me points out that this one woman wants to ruin everyone's good time: you will step in front of m'lady and tell me to stop being so mad, I'm scaring the women, or something.
Ultimately the disaster probably has more to do with people like you and the "good" women than it does the one cretinous woman. She's one person with a bad idea, it takes you to shield her from criticism and implement the bad idea.
>>469884 >When a socially awkward nerd like me points out..
Anything, I discount it as the babbling of a socially disabled person.
When I have to deal with a socially awkward nerd like you (of either gender), I feel like it's a pointless exercise and you should have stayed indoors.
I'd rather deal with sociable, communicative decent people of either gender.
If your expectations of women have been smashed by them generally rejecting you, I can understand why you'd prefer a male only club, but many people do not have that experience with women and enjoy their company.
Some freaks will always feel easier around their own gender / just their family / just their mother, depending on disability level, but the rest of society shouldn't pander to them.
Again, I'd rather spend time with cool people, be they men or women, as opposed to freaky geeks, be they men or women.
>>469905 You get that you're demonstrating the behaviour I'm talking about, right?
I'll be the one saying. >what? you want these kids to spend the weekend filling out worksheets in a hall, why don't we go... y'know, outside? And you'll be the one saying >hey bro, if you don't like what she suggests why don't you go out yourself and leave us alone? >i'd rather fill out worksheets with chicks than go camping with sperglords, lol.
>>469905 I think you know it too because in that post you've made a point of pretending you're talking about "either gender" here. It's pretty clear from your previous posts you only think bad behaviour can come from men, not women.
Why you're seeing fit to white knight for the women we've all talked about in our anecdotes I do not know. No women in this thread are being attacked personally.
>>469910 >what? you want these kids to spend the weekend filling out worksheets in a hall
In the UK, the leaders choose the activities, parents leave the kids then fuck off. Having a couple of girls in each pack hasn't changed anything.
>I'll be the one saying... If you're the socially awkward nerd you claim to be, you won't be saying shit - you'll be hating every second of the social experience. Try saying what you want to girls and boys - you really can't speak your mind in front of a woman? If they have a shit idea, it's entirely possible to tell them so.
>you only think bad behaviour can come from men, not women.
Let me be clear - there are autistic, socially retarded women and men. I've met both and I'd rather deal with normal people.
I tend to dismiss personal account that are written with some kind of warped agenda or mind set. I'm not trying to be insulting here just look at it from outside the box a little. The conversation you just had with the other guy there was interesting but I still don't feel I agree with you.
That's not to say you couldn't change my mind but what you're admitting yourself is "broadly speaking" shouldn't be the basis for banning an entire gender.
>>468736 I can't claim to be in touch with modern scout troops but that wasn't my experience 30 years ago. American society as a whole has lurched to the right complete with a resurgence of Calvinism. The scouts simply reflect what's going in in the larger culture.
>>470160 unfortunately that doesnt seem to mean anything anymore to people while theyre still within normal scout timelines. people brought sleeping bags to my ordeal, couldnt deal with that chilly as fuck 40 degree night.
shamfur. im glad its taken more seriously within its own circle. what lodge are you in? Tsali reporting in. post your lightly-treading grounds
From what I've seen of scouting, it was a good organization that was ruined by cultural marxism.
From wikipedia: >In September 1972 the Boy Scouts launched the Improved Scouting Program. They published a radically revised handbook which made learning outdoor skills optional for the three lower ranks, They eliminated outdoor merit badges, no longer considering them required; those removed included Camping, Cooking, Nature, Swimming, and Lifesaving. Under the new program, a Scout could reach First Class without hiking, camping or cooking over a fire. The Scoutcraft information and requirements were replaced by information on drug abuse, family finances, child care and community problems.
tl;dr the BSA committed sudoku in 1972 in an attempt to recruit more Urban Youth, and to pander to feminists
The Christian fundamentalist overtones probably came in at this point, since they were the only people interested in trying to salvage the shattered remains of an erstwhile mainstay of American boyhood.
If you come across a scout handbook from the 1950s or earlier, you might well find it useful. Don't bother with any from the 1970s or later; I don't know if the 1960s editions are any good or not.
I'm not really comfortable blaming the Mormons for Scouting's problems, although the Mormon troops I've seen have definitely been afflicted by them. I suspect the opposite happened, actually - all Mormon boys are in scouts, so all of today's Mormon scout leaders grew up in the sanitized and pussified Scouting of the late 20th century.
>>470245 all of those requirements (save Nature merit badge) are back as required. it was partially salvaged, but reaching out to Urban youth should have been left to the Salvation Army with their Boys & Girls club
>tfw my last scoutmaster abused his power to let his asspie son get eagle at 13, and then killed our troop by canceling campouts so he could use us to attention whore for gay marriage instead >tfw most of those guys didn't get / will never get eagle because of that faggot I'm not sure how I feel about scouting in retrospect, honestly. I was fortunate enough to have incredibly competent scoutmasters for most of my time in the program, but the way my troop died left me with some bitterness about the whole thing. I guess it hurts to see what was one of my favorite organizations become yet another font of degeneracy. At least I got some good skills and friends for life out of it.
>>468736 Yeah....no. I was involved in scouts from 8yrs old to 18yrs. Earned my eagle rank. My wife and I are Webelos den leaders now. Scouts has nothing to do with being white or any of the other nonsense you spouted.
Some boy scout troops get kinda touristy so the outdoors experiences then are lacking. That's when you step up and fix it or find a troop more your style.
>>470287 I couldn't really dedicate enough time to it to be the scoutmaster they deserve right now, but I'm looking into being an ASM at a different troop. It's a good excuse for me to go camping, and it helps them too.
>12 or something >winter >staying in cabin with scout bros >cabin close to lake, only a semi thick forest between, so you cant see lake >decide to take a walk >see animal hoofprints >oh man that is so cool >maybe a deer? an elk? >quietly follow the trail, they werent there before, maybe i can catch a glance >somehow i didnt see it >deer standing on ice, probably just 1 meter in, taking a shit and peeing >it spots me >panics, pee and shit is so hot it made the ice melt a bit >ice breaks >it falls forward and facepalm on ice >runs away >my sides >no one believes me >show trails >show the shit that is lying on the ice
>>470387 The program has obviously improved since then; I should have mentioned that. Sorry for the overly-provocative shitpost.
Still, I think Scouting today is only a shadow of its former self, and this attempt to broaden its appeal beyond the outdoors is ultimately the reason for its decline. Obviously there are still good troops here and there, but I don't think the average Boy Scout in 2015 is anywhere near as capable in the outdoors, nor as satisfied with the program, as in 1915.
Girl Scout here. let me tell you the story of "boys and girls are equal!!!11!!!1!!"
here in sweden we dont have boy scout/girl scout, we dont split up FYI
>10 or something >leaders tell us to set up camp, they will not help unless necessary >some boys volunteer to chop wood >girl says "why cant we do it, just because were girls?" >"no, but you dont have a badge, you wouldnt be allowed to anyway" >some girls proceed to do nothing
>12 >see snake, its not venomous >oh my god my moment has come, ive seen this before >perfectly grip it by the neck >yesssssssss >show off >girls run away in panic >boys approach, "oh wow cool" >ask leaders if we can eat it >i dont think your parent would allow that >aww >girls nowhere to be seen
i have few more i think, the weird thing is that there were still these kinds of girls in my group even when i got much older, the thing is that they never learned to plan after their abilities, and after what is more effective. i was well aware at a young age that men are naturally stronger than women, so of course i didnt chop wood, not because of laziness, but because it would simply be more effective if a man did it, so many girls never understood this or denied this, and never made up for it, some didnt ask how to do stuff, so they never learned. im starting to dislike girl scouts
>District Mastership >being held in my city >volunteer immediatly >the guy who is probably the most hardcore scout in our group volunteers >one other girl volunteers >she doesnt show up >only me and other guy >ITS IN OUR FUCKING CITY AND ONLY 2 SHOW UP >have fun regardless and get to know each other
we still bring this up just to let the others know how disappointed we are sometimes
>>470413 Its really the reason why I left scouts. I was in scouts from when I was a cubscout all the way up to boyscouts, but never made it past tenderfoot. I gave zero shits about rank, so I stayed tenderfoot for years.
My troop started out with a lot of hikes and short camping trips every few weeks. There was something awesome going on almost every weekend. Then we got a new wave of young scouts and a new troop master that was a fat piece of garbage that wouldnt show up. We started going months without a hike or trip. The meetings turned from trip planning to bullshit bookwork and patting eachother on the back for wearing a uniform. I almost got kicked out because I didnt wear mine.
It was a handful of us that were really intk the outdoors, and a shitload of little pussies put in scouts by their soccermoms.
Eventually when I was about 17 there was a new "Junior troop leader" that was prettt much jusr there to do what the troop leader was too lazy and worthless to do. The kid was like 13 and making us learn from a book with a smug look on his face pretending to be our superior, trying to make us do god and family bullshit. Thats about when I left. The scouts I knew and loved were dead at that point.
Last I heard the troop was desolving. Good riddance. I believe the fault lies with kicking out the good knowledgeable outdoors types when they reach 18. The troop takes a hit each time and never really recovers. Scouts need a major reform if they're going to last the next 50 years.
>>470446 this happened to my troop when i was 2nd class, except we booted out those fuckers and still do something every weekend + a high adventure thing every summer. im still there as OA Representative
The little shit that got moved to Junior troop leader had an overbearing mother that had to be apart of everything. She was a cop or something so the troop council was practically eating the shit out of her ass to get any connections she had. Regardless if she and her son were a cancer eating the troop from the inside out.
she was overprotective, so would barely let him go outside let alone hike or camp. And was the equivalent of a japanese high expectation father, so he had to study meaningless garbage and had no fun.
I actually feel kinda bad for the kid. His dad was sackless if he had one, and his mom turned him into a robot that couldnt have fun or do anything. He knew the book really well, but his common sense and feel for the outdoors were absent. This is why Boyscouts should forever be a male thing.
I wouldnt mind an extra tier of scouting after boyscouts that was coed and age went from 18 to forever. Imagine the military know how and professional marketing and descision making that could be brought to the table with a more mature member base. It should be very freely restricted but also very action packed. Its bushit that we arent really doing this already.
It sounds like American scouts has gone to shit - but it doesn't seem like women are the problem exclusively - more that the only people volunteering are retarded / fat and that overbearing fat american parents have an undue influence.
The leader of my pack (UK) was an oldish woman and she was a fucking legend, taught us to fish, loads of knots and cook a variety of things properly outdoors. We learned bow drill firelighting and how to make a kit from the wood we found in the forest.. Good times. We carved bones with knives, made spears to nail fish with.. learned to make a cutting edge from a flint stone.. loads of shit. Nobody ever wished she was a fat american man.
It really depends on the quality of leadership and what kind of person they are I guess.
19 y/o here looking at Venturing. Is it any good? I was in the scouts for a tiny amount of time when i was like 10 but i was a faggot and wanted to spend more time playing vidya. Really regret that though and starting to get really interested in camping and such
>>470484 no its certainly not girls fault. in fact, i wish Girl Scouts would get their act together enough so a coed Scout experience other than Venturing or Sea Scouts could exist.
and Cub Scouts just need a total overhaul. it seems that less than 50% of cub scouts move on to boy scouts, and those that do (in my experience) always come out babied and expecting this to be the same.
merit badges should be harder, though. if you can get 5-6 of them in a week at summer camp, theyre too easy and boring.
>>470492 yeah. badges should be a bit challenging in the beginning, as to not discourage the kids, make them feel like they can do it, but then it should get harder and more challenging, scouting shouldnt be a hobby after a while, it will be a lifestyle.
>>470495 exactly. and scouts in america really has more potential than its reaching, id say that the Eagles you recognize by their actions rather than their "title" really are some of the most upstanding citizens.
problem is, kids choose their merit badges (at least they did in my troop), and some get into something beyond them, and get partials. i can guarantee unless its required, theyll leave partials as partials. so perhaps they should have prerequisites for some
Not that I remember. We mostly we did D-Bar-A and Charles Howell (which I understands was sold off to developers?) with a yearly canoe trip down the Rifle River and a yearly one week "service outing" to Mackinaw Island, where we'd wear the full (polyester!) uniform, stay in the oldy timey Boy Scout barracks, run the flag up and down in the fort and tell fudgies when the musket and cannon firing demonstrations happened (every hour on the hour, every hour on the half hour) and such, which was pretty cool.
I had a great time in Scouts (and no moms or girls were involved!) but never made it past Star, as fewer and fewer kids were joining scouting and our troop (1463) folded when I was in jr.high and it got down to three patrols of 5-6 kids (when I came in, it was six patrols with eight or so kids each).
>>470719 not that guy you were talking too, I got my eagle last year (troop 1381), and I can say the d-bar-a is still an AMAZING scout camp. if I remember correctly, the only scout ranch this side of the Mississippi.
Can we talk eagle scout projects? what did you do if you made eagle?
I organized a move effort to inventory and tag furniture for the Neighborhood Service Organization in Detroit while they were remodeling. We drove two vans into the city each day for a week, essentially a nine to five job for the guys.
I am actually really proud of my project, having it not be common paint the fence project. I actually sat in on a meeting they had and was introduced to everyone, which was badass.
>>470790 Dug up and disposed of a bunch of concrete where the dumpster pad was, after the church our troop met at moved the entrance and parking lot to the other side of the building. Also patched up and repainted the troop shed.
>>470790 Removed a bunch of invasive plants (read: young catalpa / green ash trees) from a stream at an aviary, and replanted them with native riparian plants. Left the vegetation a little thinned so people could actually get in there and see the stream. Learned a lot about birds in the process from the guys at the aviary, as well as having to research the plants.
>>470790 I started out with the plan of installing a long flagstone sidewalk at a church that had a lot of old people and only a muddy path from the parking lot to the back door.
Halfway through getting that approved, I really, really pissed off an enormous asshole in my troop's adult leadership and he started a campaign against me that went all the way up to the local council offices. I wound up having to expand my project to include the sidewalk, an elaborate handicapped ramp that had to fit some absurdly specific building codes, and a charity food drive.
Took me almost 3 years to complete it all thanks to the number of committee and City meetings I had to take part in. My board of review was 2 days before my 18th birthday, and it was pretty contentious. My scoutmaster, who was on my side, was yelling at one of the council guys after I left the room.
Taught me an important lesson about how spiteful some people can be.
>helping out at my local camp to with a camporee back in December >go to the bathroom >boy (12 or 13ish) in there asks if I know where he can charge his phone >tell him not to worry about it and to remember that the point of camping is to be away from technology for a bit >replies "but how can I watch movies?" >mfw
I'm not trying to get on my high horse and sound like some purist, but this kind of stuff irks me. Also, anyone else /campstaff/ here? My first season starts in June.
>>471007 dude that sounds like hell, sorry to hear that. I would have just scrapped the project and worked on something else, to be honest.
I hope that scoutmaster is no longer in the scouts. I actually know a scoutmaster that was once kicked out of his troop by the committee for being too controlling, essentially not following the scout lead program.
>>471039 I have had the option to be on campstaff but turned it down. The merit badges I had options to teach would have sucked, and I have been too lazy to search for a new camp.
At my last few summer camps, my scoutmaster would just charge my cellphone halfway though the week. Sometimes I would just plug it into the wall in the cafeteria and no one would care lol.
The only times I used my cellphone while camping was for music in camp or messaging home anyways. Some of my best memories in the scouts were when I took only 1-2 merit badges at camp, and would play boardgames late at night with a few friends and my scoutmaster, all while rocking out to music on the phone.
there is literally nothing wrong with mixing male and female kids in scout groups, he problem are the kids themselves. there is always that one kid who joined scouting because they think it will be just sitting in the sun chilling during the summer, not willing to learn or challenge themselves. not going to lie but its mostly girls who are like that, seeking approval, but there are those who can handle a challenge, and i dont think people should bash it on all girls, nor all boys
Men can't be with unattended girls because lawyers, so adult women are required and outdoorsy adult women are pretty rare.
This is EXACTLY why Girl Scouts mostly consists of hair braiding and cookie baking and shoe-horning them into Boy Scouts won't make the girls (and moms) outdoorsy, it will only turn the boys (and men) into pussies.
In here scouts are more like a paramilitary organization than Disney. It has been like that ever since the 1930s I suppose when it was cool to imitate the Germans. A lot of the scouts complete their military service in the guerilla troops as a result of that.
We do have possible merit badges, but we didn't really bother with them since we figured they are more of a thing for the helping-grandmas-over-the-street kind of scout thing.
We mostly either were camping or were preparing for it as part of our weekly activities.
>>470417 Some of my fondest memories was daddy/daughter outings for girl scouts
> be 13 > outing in Northern Wisconsin > having a camp cook out > each parent provides what they are going to eat > almost every parents brings hotdogs > dad pop out premade foil dinners > pork chop, diced seasoned potato's, and carrots > everyone else is eating a weenie on a stick > chumps
> around 8 > at a summer camp for the weekend > bring a collapsible fishing pole with me > see lake > I'm going fishing > NO! > basket weaving, sewing, arts and crafts, and other pointless bullshit > 2 hours of free time > fuck yea! FISHING! > I am stopped and told the waterfront is off limits > BUT FISHING! > I never did get to go fishing.
> 14 > new leader mom comes in > shit just goes down hill > all about making her daughter the best of the best of the best > her daughter Chelsey separates the group > those with her and those who are agonized her > the group can't do shit together anymore > my dad is ousted at our troops treasurer > the troops funding is never seen again > she basically get more patches than any one else > I know all of them are bullshit because she passed me up in less than a year while I was in for 7. > we don't even do any more outdoor trips > not even the city park for our summer cook out > we went to an Applebee's instead and each parents covers the cost of whatever they get rather than use the troop's funding > to earn badges we have to watch videos that have the budget of public television and the production value of a porno from the 1970's >I remember our cannoning involved putting chairs together in a row and making j-strokes with our hands simulating holding a paddle > call it quits > even my dad agrees > best friend in scouts was Tina > she tried to convince me to come back > "Oh come on! We stay in building with AC, Heat and cable! No bugs! Like ever!" > all of my nope
>>471912 young boys are worse than girls, because at school. teachers are never strict, and essentially let the boys get away with anything, no matter how bad, as long as its not strong physical violence.
>8 or something >out camping >boys being boys, girls being girls >socializing with the the others who take scouting seriously >some retard is fucking groping another girl >what the frickfrack >she tells him to stop but he just continues harassing her >push him away >others come after and beat him slightly as a warning >he tries to play innocent when leader comes >lol nope we aint teachers, real life has consequences >has to do the dishes >he quits later
the sad part is that this happens repeatedly among the young scouts, while among the older, both boys and girls give each other space if asked for or possible, never doing these kinds of stuff or on "accident"
>>469000 Much like a lot of women's issues it has nothing to with the opposite gender. It's about having a fraternal organisation for boys to allow them to develop as men with the guidance of other men.m
Scouts becoming "co-ed" is just one less male only space. Scouts isn't less for having women in it, but perhaps young men are less for growing up without the fraternal guidance they need, especially in these times of high divorce rates.
>>471912 Wow, shitty. For us it was drilled into our brains "Boys want to have sex with out all the time. Penis=Unwed teenaged mother with STD." Which was total bullshit. Maybe 1 on 4 had that "YOU WO-MAN, ME MAN! WE FUCK!" mindset. A vast majority were just friendly. >>472028 Never bothered me directly. Granted I am the tomboy type.
>>471996 It was an even mix of moms and dads in our troop. Sometimes more moms than dads sometimes the opposite. So equality was never ever an issue, at least for us.
>>472004 >Why the fuck are american parents so intimately involved in scouts? >Has it always been this way?
It wasn't when I was in Boy Scouts in the late 1970s.
The weekly meetings were held in the local elementary school gym, with 3-4 men in attendance (scout master, assistant) while the camp outs had a couple more men, as X number of vehicles were needed but sometimes dads (like mine) who weren't into camping, would drive up and back for camp outs simply as transportation.
Moms were only in attendance for special awards dinners.
Now on the other hand, Cub Scouts in my day was wholly run by moms, with each Den of 6-8 kids being operated out of one of kid's parent's basements, but that was mostly just fucking around gluing macaroni on milk cartons and easy safe field trips to the farm and such.
Once we got into Webelos, it was all guys from there on out.
Was British Scout for the majority of my childhood-teens and it was fun while I was younger but when I was like 16 all we really did was burn people's belongings try to have sex with the very few females among us
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