Every MMO copies wow but adds one gimmick to try to be "original". Some go for action combat, some go for double jump, but they are all still the same exact game.
So how do you fix MMORPG's /v/? What brilliant idea do you have to save the genre from another 20 years of WoWclones?
We wait for the genre to crash so all the developers who are chasing after WoW's player base fuck off, leaving those who want to make genuine good MMOs.
Asian grindfests will always exist
>He doesn't know about Shroud of the Avatar
let players "create" and influence the world. have quests that can only be completed once to encourage competitiveness while also allowing players to shape the world. something like a dragon comes along and once a player kills it its dead. no other person can kill it so now this guy is an actual hero. maybe a goblin is trying to unite the goblin clans and if nobody stops it he succeeds and forms an army. the army starts to destroy villages and if nobody stops him entire cities. all of these would be just rumors and not assigned quests so players who are interested would search them out while other players would ignore them in favor of leveling or doing assigned quests. let player become rulers and rule over their fiefs. have an ingame economy that players could influence through trade and taxes. maybe some players would decide to attack travelers/caravans to steal from them. so the ruler has to hire players to hunt them down. stuff like this
>Getting inferior versions of both years after release
Wait for it to crash, make a new one with the same stuff and say its a call back to "those great MMO's of the past".
Don't have to do anything new and the genre prints money again.
It had explicit levels for combat, but the level isn't the same as in most modern MMOs where being a higher level will generally mean you will win in PvP or do more damage in PvE, etc.
In regard to what the anon I replied to, Runescape's skill/level system isn't really explicit.
Not anymore. Bots have been gone for at least a year now. Your other two points still stand, though.
did you read the part about the goblin destroying cities? those would be gone forever. as a result of the actions of the players. some chump exploring ruins could accidentally release a lich (there could be an ultra rare item in one of the rooms) who would lead an undead army and if players dont stop him he destroys everything in his path.
In his defence I think it would work better if instead of dropping items they would stop certain materials that if taken to artisans could create items. I think crafting as opposed to drops should be a staple in the next great mmo
Take Runescape's basic mechanics.
Apply it to a game that plays like the Witcher.
Bam. I did it.
Again, this comes back to
And how would you plan for lets say a million players playing at once 'influencing' the world? Sure you can have a world big enough, but it wouldn't be profitable.
Stop trying to create all the content. No matter how fast you can create content, it can be completely devoured in 1/10th the time. More emphasis needs to be placed on player created content, both towns, and quests. If not wholely, then at least in part.
Stop taking away interplayer dependencies. Seeing WoW's player interactions be reduced solely to trading, dungeons, and PVP is sad. You could do everything else in the game without seeing or needing another player now. If you're going to reduce your game to being an effective Guild Wars type game, where the only time players exist in your world is in your party or in the city, you're throwing away money on making it open world.
are you fucking retarded. In this scenario, there is fucking MILLIONS of different outcomes for every single fucking tiny little quest that can ONLY be compeleted once.
You are thinking too big, that amount of programming can not be done for like he said, a world with millions of people
Combat levels were always irrelevant due to the wonky calculation of it and the advantage of being a pure. Skill totals were always completely irrelevant except as some requirement just to push a quest back along the progression list.
>More emphasis needs to be placed on player created content, both towns, and quests
This has never and will never work. All you need to do is look back at CoH's arcitect system. Or something like little big planet.
Very few people will manage to create something worth playing. They will be rated highest and people will play it over and over. Everything else will be shit, no one will like it or touch it.
A team can create content that many can enjoy cause they can test it and check each others work.
A single player is going to make somethign half-assed then get discouraged when the community tears them up theh give up or lash out.
And if someone does manage to make something awesome they will be praised to hell and back. Gratz, you just created an e-celeberity for that game. Enjoy the shit they dish out or get waylaided by their fans if you don't like it.
Everquest landmark relies on players claiming spots of land and then building stuff within their plots. You can fast travel to popular places, but you still have to deal with the eyesore that sits next to your castle.
Sounds like an attempt to bring a single player experience to millions of people at the same time.
Which is a flawed concept from the very start.
What most people forget is that MMOs are played for
>playing with bros
>actually interacting with people
MMOs main purpose are to feel comfy and to cooperate with people to accomplish a common goal, enjoying yourself playing a video game with other people over the internet, with a casual atmosphere.
All the other stuff is polish, but still very important for the overall aesthetic. For instance, why do MMOs no longer have good loot and armor skins and shit?
That, along with many other factors, helped make Vanilla WoW so fucking homey, having your own unique look up until the endgame when you have endgame set armor.
That'd be really good though. MMOs where each player is actually truly unique in some way and where players have real control over what happens. You aren't just some priest 10 levels lower than that guy or who has worse gear than that guy.
You are a bandit who kills people who are daring enough to make treks on the road without hiring other players to guard them. You could have your own signature style or interesting experiences where you for some reason feel sympathy for the guy you are about to ruin and something else ends up happening. You could be a community organizer who networks between all the merchants or craftsmen to organize traveling parties for people so they are safer from bandits on the road. You could be an ACTUAL assassin and take contracts from other players to kill certain other players, having to track them down manually by talking to people who might know them like people in the same profession and guild as them, acting like you're just someone who wants to offer them a trade.
Games like Ultimate are so, so much more than modern MMOs in so many ways. Forcing you to be some kind of fighter/warrior/mage/rogue, making the penalty for death anything but extremely severe (that's not permadeath) and removing players' ability to do anything they want such as kill any other player for any reason (with guarded safe town zones of course) and make trust and reputation a valuable asset, are what killed MMOs.
-Make leveling to max level little take little more than a week tops, even for casuals that play 1 hour a day. And use it to teach players their classes and roles and give them practice. Make tutorial quests that have players use their abilities, like the monk quests in WoW. After reaching max level the player can either start to grind for gear on his own for a long time, or group with friends and gear up quickly.
Overall, the whole process of getting a player from complete noob to starter raider/pvper should not take more than two weeks tops. I know the hardcore whine about this, but getting players to actually PLAY your game is the most important thing. Leveling alone while all your friends are level capped is not playing.
-Gear should work in a similar way to the Souls series, where lowbie gear can be upgraded to be feasable at max level, but to truly be competitive you have to hunt down rare drops and craft gear.
Player crafting should be an essential part of the gearing system. But there should be alternate ways of getting materials to prevent gold farmers.
-This is more WoW centric, but I've always felt that PvE and PvP should have separate leveling systems. Let's say instead of levels use ranks. Your Hero rank is PvE and rises according to how many NPC's you've helped, quests completed, reputations filled, rare mobs killed and dungeons/raids cleared. While your Military rank is your PvP rank, and rises as you slay enemy players, raid towns, kill important NPCs like faction leaders, and according to your results on BG's/Arenas etc. Each has separate rewards and very rarely intersect.
You seem to have played WoW. Do you know if I might enjoy it?
I played Tera and it was ok but quit after like 30 levels becaused it sucked.
Tried FFXIV free trial and I got so tired of it. There was nothing to do except kill monsters. Gear was just handed to me as I leveled and dungeons were extremely un-fun.
Grew up playing Maplestory so I never played a good WoW clone that I enjoyed and of course never played WoW vanilla.
Except all that stuff can already be done in most MMO's where PvP is possible, there just isn't any reason to do it.
Players could ambush enemy players on the roads, but eventually they'll say "Why bother" when all they're getting is a couple of points or kill score or whatever.
Give players a reason to World PVP, to form raiding parties, and they'll do it, even if all it is simple fun.
No kidding. And they don't even have decent tools to let people playing Everquest Landmark make decent stuff anyway. Even the -good- stuff looks like shit compared to professional stuff.
I loved UO so much. Nothing since has even come close as they're all so determined to create massively single player content.
Like the Golden Rule of MMOs, "If you have friends to play with, play. If not, be ready for disappointment." That was true in Vanilla and it's true now.
The few good players left in WoW are in tightly knit guilds that don't allow any outsiders in, for good reason, since it's often a waste of time for them and the new guy.
Of course you might get lucky, but you have to be willing to show you're competent.
Either that or just LFR.
I really enjoyed City of Heroes, Dark Ages of Camelot, FFXI and WoW when it was first released until I finally quit in 2007 during BC.
Are there any MMO's that are fun anymore? Or is it all instant group queuing and zero interaction and exploration?
Killing someone in a shitty WoW clone does fucking nothing.
Killing a traveling merchant in Ultima lets you take all of their shit, meaning a crapton of their value as a player. This creates enormous tension and fun when traveling, and absolutely forces a strong social aspect of the game where players form traveling parties or players can sell their services as mercenaries and are in heavy demand.
Sure you can pay someone to guard you in a WoW clone but why the fuck? You die? Respawn and start walking again, or use a teleport service. It's not like you lost anything valuable.
By far, the most important thing is that players need to be able to have an actual influence on the world. If that means the MMO needs to be less "massive", then so be it.
Second, we need less of an emphasis on story. A set story is almost always going to lead to a "theme park", because an MMO can't have branching storylines, and the devs are going to want every player to experience the story.
>massively single player content.
I think this is the problem, really.
I've played WoW since 2007, and since Cataclysm hit in 2010 I have not been in a guild characters other than my alts or interacted with anyone outside of an RDF/LFR group.
And even though I'm happy I can still play the game like that, I also know that's not what an MMO is supposed to be.
No it wasn't. In vanilla WoW you made friends just by existing. Nowdays you get to know a few people if you go way out of your way to do so and they just quit, make new characters, jump from guild to guild, etc.
It's just not the same. I went in to my first MMOs without any friends who played. Came out with a ton of people I played a lot of games online with, who have since drifted apart of course.
First of all, MMO's have to end the F2P model. No matter how it works, if you don't pay money you are meant to feel like a second-class player. Have subscriptions instead, and give a week or so of free unrestricted play.
In my opinion, MMO's tend to favor only the highest players on the server. I would like servers to be smaller, but inherently linked to preserve the MMOness. I'm thinking along the lines of many servers of only a few hundred to 1000 people on it, where you do PVE, PVP, etc on your server, but can transport into another server to fuck it up as some pseudo-avatar. Let the players come into other servers as mobs, or just their characters with reduced power. If one server is able to accomplish sabotage/destruction/misc goals on another server, their home server gets bonuses, items, etc. This will make the people that play together work with the small base around them, and develop a strong sense of community even with the reluctant. Plus, it has the potential to be super-serious or incredibly lighthearted, depending on what you want to do with it.
But, isn't players being able to lose ALL their shit while offline what caused the great unwashed shut-in masses of the Everquest Era?
I mean you've all seen that episode of Mission Hill right?
I am just waiting for Camelot Unchained and Everquest Next.
Atleast both of them are trying something new. If both of them end up failing, I think MMO's might end up a dead genre for a long time.
Yeah, because the game was fucking *new*.
Go play any other new MMO and you'll find players willing to make friends who drift away eventually. It might take less time but that's because people on the internet have social lives now.
The only reason WoW was/is so successful is because it's the only MMO with relatively smooth and fluid gameplay, whereas almost every other MMO that has come out recently is a laggy unplayable mess
prove me wrong
I can't say how to fix MMOs. I can only make suggestions on what I personally would like.
Puzzles and brain teasers to progress through a quest/dungeon. Not that fucking google shit they have in TSW either. That's just an insult.
Roleplay areas BESIDES A FUCKING BAR. A coffee shop, a library, a school - anything but the same fucking bar.
Stop it with the 1 massive storyline shit. 1 town shouldn't have the most people at it just because it's the end of the storyline and the last dungeon is there. That's fucking retarded.
Traps. Platforming. Use of elements/enemy weakneses and perhaps even terrain to make the fights have at least some semblance of strategy involved.
See my previous post >>257486376
It was the smooth gameplay along with a light warming atmosphere and a pretty optimistic and outgoing community that was encouraged by the features of the game.
Because you need to go out into the world to do stuff? How are you going to acquire ores if you never go out and mine them? How are you going to slay strong creatures and sell their loot? How are you going to find wild beasts to capture and tame? How are you going to mix special potions if no one goes out to gather the ingredients?
Making towns safe would have fucked up pre-Trammel UO. There was always some danger of thieves in towns and it kept people from idling which meant more people to talk to. Also, the amount you'd lose from getting PKed was the amount you risked - you could do just fine in UO on loot that'd take 5 minutes to replace, but if you thought you were a bad enough dude to keep powerful magical weapons safe you could risk taking them to fight with in dungeons.
this might have brought a breath of fresh air to the MMO genre, but alas it was cancelled thank you CCP...
I wish that game was released. Not because I would play it, but in the hopes that all the WoD roleplay faggots would stop bringing their shit into EVERY FUCKING MMO THEY play.
Seriously, what is wrong with you people? Can't you play a different character from your shitty edgelord vampire? Can't you try something DIFFERENT?
Has any mmos ever tried token subscriptions?
Like small $5 a month subs
It seems like every single sub mmo goes for $15 a month. Did they do market research and find out that 15 is the highest people are willing to go before they realize they're being fucked in the ass?
Any subscription will do really, any mmo without a sub fee is guarantied garbage.
1. It keeps out children who don't have access to a credit card
2. It keeps out BRs because they have esoteric as fuck electronic gaming laws
I think you guys are seriously underestimating players' ability to justify cowardice when valuable goods are involved.
*Maybe* the bravest ones would actually end up hiring other players to farm for them. But then they would be afraid said players would steal their good and sell them to their competition. And you'd end up with a whole another group of players acting as police and lawyers while the original group becomes happy merchants all in a bidding war over the last fucking stack of cloth on the market.
Trust me, I've seen it happen.
>Runescape's basic mechanics
>Plays like the Witcher
They're not because they force it and make it all about one little part of a huge zone. Ss vs tm worked because the zone was location to a large amount of quests both sides which made the players indirectly compete for quest resources. Same with stv, sadly blizzard is too dumb to realize it
A good pokemon MMO. And not a shitty MMO with pets that assist in combat, but a real trainer feel. Have up to 3 monsters out at a time, give orders to each, maybe allow first person control, but just maybe. And
procedurally generated monsters from breeding
Won't fix MMO's, but could shift the cloning off of WoWclones
Honestly, as bad as that is, it still sounds way more fun than modern WoW clones.
I'd love to be one of those warriors who go out into the dangerous as fuck world and explore shit most people never see.
First of all, fuck every single thing about WoW's leveling. Every. Single. Thing.
Either take original UO's gameplay and iterate from that (more ways players can interact, more systems to help players police themselves, more mixed PvE/PvP) without creating a themepark / hub quest system within a 3D engine
Take EQ/FFXI gameplay and iterate from that (encourage grouping from the very beginning, add more variables to mobs, better AI, non-instanced dungeons that intelligentally adjust to player population, huge multi-mob world raids), possibly make it more actiony like Vindictus
Just throw more content into Archeage, because shit, it's halfway there in both directions
>MMO about colonizing a new world
>the farther into the wilderness you go, the more dangerous it becomes
>towns and colonies can live or die depending on various factors
Basically, I envision a combination of Dorf Fort and Eve
I feel like AA had potential but that labor system and everyone looking the same fucking killed it for me. I was even playing with friends and I died a little on the inside.
I mean I might load it up again if I get into the third beta but I've gotten into both the first and second one and I haven't played for more than the few hours I played during the first one.
Its been in beta for a while, the alpha server is just seperate and closed off to beta-only players, who can only play on designated dates
Hundreds of thousands of beta keys are being dumped tomorrow for the beta this weekend
not everything would be like that you would still have quests to go out and kill some bears but you would get a few fate of the world type quests where players would influence the outcome. like with the goblin if anybody goes and kills him he never makes the army but if nobody follows up on those rumors he starts burning vilages.
I wanted to expand on this idea a bit.
It's a full 3d world where you control the trainer and can summon monsters and give them orders to attack. Though there will be a very pokemon-like leveling and evolution system, the key point in combat will be clever usage of combination attacks with your team. This will make combat interesting for new players to feel like they can be competitive via skill instead of grinding, and will create high-level play.
A key feature is that as your monsters gain levels, they get bigger. A level 20 monster will be much larger than a level 10 monster of the same type, and the area of effect of all of the attacks will scale as well. An important point here is that while the player cannot directly attack, it can still take damage. As levels get higher, the battlefield becomes more epic and dangerous, and attacks are chosen not just by raw damage output, but by player survivability from friendly fire.
Monster combination will play a key role, largely for crafting a team of monsters with attacks that work well together. As a player grows in skill, they will realize the need for new strategies and will need to mix new blood into the fold. On this note, regular content additions need to be added on a secretive basis. Each week, a new monster is added to the game, with varying levels of rarity, but the players are not told what or where it is. A new monster with a potentially powerful new attack could be found anywhere in the world at any time. Zones will be level capped (either restricting high level monsters, or reducing the levels while in the zone) so that high level players will explore earlier parts of the world without significantly inconveniencing players that are at the level for that zone.
>I'm too young to know anything about a genre but I'll talk like I know shit anyway
My first mmo was Tibia actually, so go be a shit-head elsewhere.
I loved Tibia back in the day, it was like Ultima Online's stupid cousin. But now it's completely chocked fucking FULL of Br and the devs ruined their own game. Aka It's shit and not worth playing.
So I'm sticking to my original fucking statement.
>So how do you fix MMORPG's /v/?
Kill them all. It's the only way.
It's really not, questhub leveling is far different from exploration/hunting based leveling, same with non-instanced vs instanced dungeons
Even vanilla was far removed from EQ (and its actual successor, FFXI)
Maplestory would be a solid mmo if you removed all cash shop items except for cosmetic items and pets/pet items teleport stones you have to jew people somehow and I feel like cosmetics and convenience items are fair.
Next you make different classes actually mean something instead of every job of every class have several screen clearing attacks.
Finally you raise the difficulty to make being a party useful instead of just who gives a shit just get people to make our numbers go up
>Have fond memories of Runescape and WoW
>All those memories correspond with amazing, memorable areas or quests
>Almost every one of those memories also come from social interaction to achieve a goal
>No MMO features real social aspects anymore, or nobodies cares enough to socialise
I had more fun chopping trees or fishing for lobsters in Runescape, entirely because I was talking to people my own age, while we all grinded.
I had a lot of fun in WoW, because I formed friendships with people while trying to get people to run dungeons with me, and joined a guild that talked constantly.
Every level was an achievement (took a couple of hours, had great rewards) unlike now where it's just something between you and endgame. Remember getting a mount at 40? Remember how you worked for it by saving money or doing a quest?
Remember seeing those people run around with cool shit while you were level 20? Remember trying to GET that cool stuff that was HARD/RARE?
Now everything is handed to you on a platter, with 0 incentive to work for anything.No social interaction in a genre born from it.
No, I played the good ole tibia back in the day. I still remember talking to the orc in the secret language to buy items and leading new players underground in rook to convince them to walk into the flame only to take their starting apple.
Learn to use reading comprehension.
Is tibia currently good? no. That makes it a bad mmo. Therefore it is not on the list of good mmo's I've played. If it were still good then it would've been on the list.
God sometimes you faggots are fucking retarded.
The problem with that is that the masses for whom these new games are made don't get that. You can't throw 100 mil at an MMO and have it appeal to the people who actually want to work.
tree of savoir Its happening somewhat hopeful
black desert online looks decent.
acheage HAHAHAHAH 50-150 buck for testing the game fucking priceless.
FFARR while its not everyones cup of water I find it enjoyable and relaxing to mine up stuff.
wildstar had something but then they fucked that up pretty quickly.
teso had nothing
gw2 two years nothing to show for it. gw1 had already nightfall. still no guild halls no guild wars everything is stale as fuck. Still trying to push pvp esports when pvp is unbalanced mess.
wow fucking shit is dead just fucking let it fucking die already holy shit people its like you lose your pet and sleep with its dead body every night
then you got all these side things that keep afloat. rift,tera, and so on.
and the problems are here because wow was huge for a sub based model and like its now just a cash cow and people want that cash cow. while gw2 did reach a huge financial success in its own way its two years of nothing to show for it.
Son, you're embarrassing yourself.
Does anyone know the current state of Runescape?
I remember they changed the combat significantly, but I also remember someone saying they were going to change it back.
If it's even just somewhat similar to the old combat, I might consider giving it a go to play the quest lines.
>acheage HAHAHAHAH 50-150 buck for testing the game fucking priceless
Beta keys are free and easily found with a google search
Why shouldn't they take the money of idiots? It's better that they have it, than some shitty themepark MMO
I wish they'd stop trying to phase out leveling.
>LFG giving you multiple free levels per instance making questing immediately obsolete at level 15
>you're being carried if everyone else has heirlooms
>no need to explore
>can pay to be max level
for fucks sake, stop this shit. half the game is building your character from scratch and you can barely do that anymore
>vindictus is barely an MMO.
Why because it's instanced rather than open world? At least it tries to do something different.
Actually I just remembered another one I used to enjoy. Dofus if anyone remembers that.
But yeah anyways I never even played vanilla WoW. I hated it and how it played from day fucking one.
How am I embarassing myself exactly, because I apparently Have good taste while you suck up grind fest bullshit and boring combat?
Take for example tera, they claimed it was Really action focused and innovative combat. So I download the 30gb trial and get slapped in a pretty theme park with decent visuals only to be immediately disappointed by their so called "revolutionary" combat system. It's a fucking joke. It's just the same floaty animations every mmo has.
Jesus the only 2 MMO's I have any interest in currently is seeing Phantasy Star Online 2 getting localized and A Monster Hunter MMO for the west.
I don't like mmo combat at all. It was fine in the pre-rendered 2d days but it's sure as fuck not tolerable in 3d. Combat needs to have weight to it like vindictus or Monster hunter, or go for a Tactics like system that dofus had.
>Why because it's instanced rather than open world?
Yes, the first M is for Massively, Massively is not a few people fucking about in an instance being 100% of the game outside of one town
You could have the same gameplay experience with a peer-to-peer game
>dat damage control
Whatever helps you sleep, anon.
I can agree that vindictus would've been much better if it was open world rather than instanced. But I've yet to see an mmo with combat on the same level that isn't instanced in some way.
I can shitpost and show reaction images too you know :^)
No actually I haven't, what is it.
Played RS because it was fun seeing through scams and playing babby-tier merchant.
Played another game, DOFUS, where I barely leveled because I spent most of it exploring and interacting with other losers, helping newfags and then talking to them, etc. S'good times.
Nigger please, don't try to pretend WoW leveling was ever anything resembling a badge of courage, that shit was dead simple and 100% soloable on any class within a matter of days
Meanwhile in older games, solo was not an option and you needed to rely on (or manipulate) people to help you get anywhere, and if you fucked up or had a bad day, you lost levels
>I can shitpost
I am well aware of that.
>>and show reaction images too
>mfw you haven't post a single reaction image so far
>mfw you're embarrassing yourself again
1-60/70 was not a "matter of days" affair, especially for certain classes (warrior and paladin come to mind).
Level 60 was a triumph. To say otherwise is to admit you didn't play back then.
Oh wait, I think I might know what you're talking about. I saw gameplay of that a while back. Iunno though man, it looked like the hitboxes were shitty like Freedom unite in my opinion. I'll still take a look to see if it's improved any
I actually think you have great taste.
I also tried Tera with all the hype it got and, yeah, the combat is disgusting.
Though I agree with the other anon, that Vindi is hardly an MMO, I still feel that it's one of the best with fast-paced combat.
/v/ tends to have shit taste with mmos anyway.
Go compare sizes somewhere else, the adults are talking
This is true
Thanks man. I was personally hyped for ArcheAge for a while until I tried the closed beta myself. Honestly it was a bigger kick in the dick than fucking Atari's Alone in the dark
I think Mabinogi did this very well. It doesn't matter what your actual levels are, they only exist as a way to gain skill ranks. So power among players is mostly determined by what skills they choose to work with.
Though this causes more problems with balancing and blatant power-gaming.
and obviously if your total level is massively higher, you'll be stronger, but that's par for the course in any game.
Would any one play a Dark Souls MMO?
The main thing doing this is that you would want to have 200 ping at most. Less than 100 would be optimal. That means that every country would need multiple servers, which would be pretty expensive.
Yeah I remember DOFUS
>catchy yet immersive music score
>unique clases, style
There was always one class that seemed a bit better than another, balancing was always a constant but that always kept the interest of the playerbase. Any class could more or less become good, but with different forms of investment and payoffs for it (ex. Enutrof).
It did PvP nicely, anyone could have a battle anywhere, and raised the stakes with factions. I think they have "hit contracts" now, and lastly
>dat risk you'd always take when you were a low lv. doing PvE and a higher lv. joined your party because you could kill your own team mates.
I think the biggest problem with mabinogi was that you could abuse the rebirth system with cash to constantly rebirth every other day after grinding for dat AP.
it was such a bullshit system for pay to win
I saw some Archeage videos and I was disappointed as well. I thought it'd be similar to Mabi with the things I've heard about, but after beta, everyone's saying it's basically like an app store game.
>Not the guy you're replying to, but please stop acting like a giant sperg.
I totally agree. Nexon is jews, everyone who's played their games knows it.
The skill system is what I was highlighting, not the rebirth system, though they finally reduced free rebirth wait times to a reasonable rate.
In the early days, like g1-3, you had to buy service just to get access to Trans or Egos. S'why I quit till like g8.
I mained an Ecaflip and regreted every fucking second of it.
it was fucking most bullshit class in the fucking game I swear.
Wakfu was supposed to build on the sucess of Dofus and I was pretty interested in the idea for a while. But after trying the game out I found myself running around clueless as what I should be doing. Shame too.
Wasn't the wait time for free rebirthing near the end of mabinogi's lifespan like once a week? I haven't played it in years. Last time i logged in I found my account had been hacked and everything I owned was wiped clean.
Though speaking of pets, remember when the first exploration expansion came out and they had those flying mounts? Man those fucking dungeons were cool. I think my favorite part of mabinogi was that they kept the combat system pretty fresh for an rpg style. every battle required quick combinations and counters to certain skills for each enemy type rather than simply left clicking and sitting back and stroking your dick like WoW and every other mmo in the universe seems to do these days.
It's been every 3 weeks for quite a while and only within the last year, I think, that it was down to just one. Payed rb's being once a day I think?
Yeah, though I have to admit, I didn't get a flying mount til like...I'm not sure what came first, griffin or flying carpet. I remember literally walking to every moongate on foot. Maiz was pretty spooky back then, but every Iria dungeon is beautiful.
I agree, the combat system is easily one of the best out there. While it's not quite as fast-paced as I like, it requires a lot of combos and crown management, especially at lower levels.
Did you play during g1-3?
My ideal mmo
>customizabke world lkke wurm
>Skills like eve/swg combined
>Skill gain ljke eve and uo combined
>Crafting like swg
>property like swg
>Magic is like unicron style rare and requires lots of training
>characters die of old age in 2-3months real time
>Continue as legacy as old characters child with some skill rubbed offf
>You play as a sjngle person at a time from your own familybut manage an entire estate of hirelings and family
>your non played characters become npcs running routines you plan out
I imagine this game often. Start a character whomarrries some npc wench in game. Pop kids out. Send one to join the local militia (he becomes a hireling for the player who runs the town) train the other to be a sailor. Start sea trade industry. Lose my last son to pirates. Old man dies of old age Have to start over again.
In Wakfu, I think you rolled with pubs, joined a guild, and then figure shit out in the game. I've found myself clueless in games before, and usually the best thing to do is get some attention. I did explore but I wasn't sure what was restricted/unfinished or not, but you know what, I hope to re-apply my theory once I get access to the Steam Beta.
I guess you could say I main'd Sram, I remember him ending up with a really shitty build. I do remember wondering how Ecalfips could live with themselves, they really were unpredictable and fun to PvP against because of it, but I believe your DPS wasn't quite on par with other beefy classes huh?
Still, those damage multipliers with your Crit Bonus + Claw of Ceangal allowed you guys to do some big numbers that had my respect. As for what happened to my Sram, I believe my friend and I shared emails because we'd also share accounts, but he made like 6 other "carrier" accounts for our shit that I suspect were purged along with our main accounts because of botting.
I played since beta but I only completed the story line up until g2
those fucking enchanments you get for completing it though, makes daggers into fist of the north fucking star.
I remember when I'd first started and I did a bunch of small jobs for npcs for an entire fucking weekend just so I could buy a claymore. I felt like such top shit with that fuckin claymore
Have a different kind of combat system. One that doesn't involve a fuckload of abilities and hotbars. Have any MMOs tried to mix up combat in such a way recently?
I started almost the day after beta ended. I remember thinking the only way to load Defense was to click Use on the book.
It could just be nostalgia, but I loved how sincere the setting felt when it was so bare bones. Making friends, exploring dungeons and actually having difficulty with things like Ciar. The little things just felt so unique and immersive.
While I appreciate how much bigger the game is, that ultimately leads to more problems with updates.
With my playstyle, I couldn't really afford anything past replacing basic equips. I pretty much only wore my newbie wear and a hat. Even now, I pretty much only use wooden blades and daggers.
There is currently rs3 and oldschool. The old school servers are dug up from 2007 and do not interract with rs3 servers. You have to level your character from nothing in oldschool. They recently have added "legacy mode" to rs3. This is the old combat, somewhat. What it really is is a wrapper for rs3 to make it easier to swallow. You cannot PvM efficiently with Legacy (except perhaps the QBD), it is primarily for PvP. Even then, it is nothing like it was before. Good luck grinding 100++ days worth of play time on 2007scape.
Oh shit, dream MMO time
- Your character has a life span, but monsters and pvp don't kill you. You die from important events and specific monsters, like a world boss, or a dungeon boss.
- What will normally happen is unconsciousness, where you respawn in a nearby Inn or temple not far from where you died.
> Doctors and wounds
- Potions don't exist, bandages and ointments exist. You can ony revive wounds and inns and temples.
>Hall of Heroes
- You can look back on your characters of past reincarnations in a hall of heroes, looking upon gear and skills you died with in an easy to read UI.
>Trade is based on Supply and Demand, Players post goods on auction house based in cities
-Mines are in mountainous areas, farms are next to rivers, fish are near oceans. There is no fast travel, so finding food
>Randomized world spawns at start of the game.
- You can spawn in any mapped position in the game world, from an Inn, to the Capital of a city, to the bottom of a haunted ghost mine.
>Monsters are unique
- You wont see 500 goats in one area, because they roam and go from water source to water source. Monsters like trolls and dragons are rare and travel long distances, or stick to specific caves, so they are hard to find and hard to kill.
>Hunger, Thirst, Fatigue
- Simple needs feature that can be mitigated with certain stats and items.
>No quest hub npcs
- Quests are put on player made bulletin boards around the world, that disappear when completed.
>TES-esq skill system
- Your main skills consist of 10 skills in which you can specialize in all of them. As a money sink, skills you don't specialize in slowly dissipate due to memory, but characters with high int can remember for longer time periods. This creates actual classes in game, so no one can become master of all.
What's wrong with ArcheAge?
I played the beta and I liked it.
I'm sorry, but did WoD suck? Oh, that's right. WoD isn't even out yet. In fact, it's not even finished yet. Does not having 10/10 qts count as a bad game? Is that what you're saying? Because if you're saying that I can assure you that you're wrong. Why would you make this topic when the game still isn't out? Blizzard is still making it right now and they have been the best rpg designers in the world for how many fucken years now? They're up against one of the newest company's in the Industry, who just happen to have a lot of hype because they show sexness. But you know what? They still fucking suck. Blizzard is one of the best fucking teams in the World. They have made the greatest fucken MMO ever. WoW - World of FUCKEN WARCRAFT. WoW would of won game of the year if it wasn't for the shit fucks that left during the last two expansion. QQQQQQ dem panadas QQQQQ muh end game. Maybe you should shut the fuck up before you make stupid ass topics like this. You know why? Because you're going to be embarrassed when WoD rocks and someone bumps this topic. Oh look at that, SOE are on the verge of financial collapse, maybe because they're based in fucking Japan. Fucking japs. Are you a fucking drunk? Are you retarded? Are you autistic? You are a fucking idiot and you should never make a topic on this board again and I'm fucking serious. I almost have a feeling you're the only guy making all these anti-Blizzard - anti WoW topics because you're a faggot hater who doesn't like the team because they're good. Fuck you, be good at something in YOUR life and then maybe try to troll these fucking designers on the board, like I give a fuck. It's so easy to spot out these threads now, you'll all fucken retards. Always doing stupid shit like this. Why don't you try to be a good poster? Just for once? For once in your fucking life try not to make a topic like this. That's just you, you're always be right at getting it wrong. Fuck you. You are nothing.
From what I've heard here, the crafting system works like phone app games with energy points that regenerate after a certain time, but paying to be a member or something increases that crafting regen by a large amount.
I don't have first-hand experience, s'just what I hear frequently.
Tell me about your experience with it.
Like. For what fucking purpose.
Giving up the whole genre.
Multiplayer games don't work by genres like the singleplayer ones does because they tend to form superclusters of very specific games.
WoW is popular because WoW is popular, not for any other reason, and the same applies to CoD or minecraft.
No matter if the game is actually good or bad, if everyone plays it, everyone will play it, and even if your clone is a billion times better, if nobody plays it nobody will play it.
I want an MMO where everyone just travels a wasteland in one single direction and you find shit. You can kill each other or help each other if you so choose.
It would be awesome and terrible at the same time. The start zone would be a complete clusterfuck of destruction, and north would serene, and you could go miles without seeing someone. And if you do, it would be tense as fuck.
Yeah, labor points.
I bought a founders pack, which meant faster regen + offline regen.
Never had a problem with running out of labor points, did questing in between and trade runs.
But yeah it's a shit tier mobile phone game mechanic.
Other than that, questing is unoriginal and the same old kill 20 nippleworms and gather 15 shitsausages.
The only things I liked were the classsystem, gear not being locked to a specific class, trade runs and the housing.
That type of questing turned me off to Tera almost instantly.
I really love games in which your avatar truly represents you in the community. Games with that type of in-depth social aspect.
Just makes everything you do that much more important.
I imagine some kind of geometric game based on a grid and all that which incorporates MUD levels of interaction and possibilities for PvE and PvP situations you run into, but all with the person going forward.
and then eventually one guy makes it, and gets to alter the next "round" some way as everything resets. It'd be more like a coffee break game really/
>Monsters are unique
>You wont see 500 goats in one area, because they roam and go from water source to water source. Monsters like trolls and dragons are rare and travel long distances, or stick to specific caves, so they are hard to find and hard to kill.
What happens when they map out the precise path every mob takes and toss it on a wiki so it removes the hunt alltogether
Instead of leveling up, you never get stronger, only more skilled as a player. Your character's level is based on how well you play, but only serves to show other players how good you are at the game.
I guess it would have to be random spawns and paths depending on the environment. And I don't think you would want it too hard for the players to find the animals, so I don't think I would mind them knowing the general paths the animals take. But it isn't only deer/goats walking the woods, bears and other nasty shit would be out there too.
MMOs are garbage. I did love Guild Wars 1. GW2 is some of the most despicable, upper management abused shit I've ever seen.
The only MMO I'd play would be the game I thought GW2 was going to be before the beta came out, and obliterated that idea entirely.
I mean you might as well be playing another genre. Although GW1 comes close to that because leveling is so easy, acquiring skills is a slight grind though, because tend to neglect that since the game is 2ded2criticize.
I remember when I was trying to play the game a little less after thousands of hours- I knew that was a luxury but I figured I had to move on anyway. Of course it's a pain re-visiting the game now, but the Nostalgia Wars guild has a thread up here now and again that makes it easier to do so.
I still say the original guild wars (before heroes) did a shitton of things right:
-levelcap rached at basicaly after the tutorial
-stat equipment had small effects (like +30hp when the basic hp is 480)
-expensive gear is just for looks
-free skill/attribution allocation
-shitton of diverse skills and dual caste system for variety and buttfuckery
-limited skillpool to actually use in combat
-extra utility unlocked during campaign (extra atrip points from quests, and the ability to change the secondary class after the character "ascended")
-no universal skill trainer, and have to hunt down bosses for elite skills
-story missions that had optional objectives
-aiding bots being useless fucks for more serious content
-selectable and upgradeable guildhalls
-titles, and other decor-goals to go for, so in the end you wont become good because you are decked iout in legendary, but because you got good at the game.
-PvP for all kinds of players, pvp only, casual, hardore, random... with, again prestige rewards only. The diference between a vet and a rookies equipment is negliable, and the rookie can acuire the same stuff in 1-2 hours.
and a shitton more. GOddamn, how could they fuck up gw2 so much?
You can't even classify getting skills in guild wars grindy or even "difficult". Yes it is difficult to get certain skills but not because they pose a good challenge but they are just outright dumb. Look at all of prophecies and most of factions. To get a particular skill you have to fight your way to a hero champ which is most likely over an hour away from a town. And is downright impossible unless you have a full formed group. Doing anything in that game with henchmen was an outright waste of time.
gw2 two years nothing to show for it pvp stale wvw stale pve stale.
gw1 two years nightfall was out already all these content updates. All these skills to play around with. Guild halls guild wars hard mode shit for hardcore players.
4 addition classes before two years and all those addition skills.
we get 1 healing skill for each class one shared which was shit and half of them useless. traits most which are useless.
its fucked up there are people defending this shit to which is sad
The Glassdoor reviews are hilarious, and really revealing as to why the company is so terrible. If it wasn't for the mindless cash mules that keep GW2 going, ANet would be dead within a year.
god. fucking. damnit.
Those icons burned into my mind, and as a monk i only want to say... FUCK MESMERS.
Those fuckers can legit nterrupt (not the "fail at activate" kind) even the 1/4 castime shit, and dear god did i hate diversion.
You can use a diffrent more interesting medium for "quests"
Like a bulliten board, or none at all. Make killing monsters worth it by giving every monster a craftable material or unique drop.
Quest hubs are cancer man.
All the gw2 updates are absolutely terrible. What are they thinking with that story bullshit. It adds absolutely nothing to the gameplay. They are easy to do I guess. Lazy anet in action.
Also all the new cool skins are tied to cash shop rng boxes which give you tokens or some shit.
make things simple and concise, so you dont go full retard with stats.
make enemies use the same skills as players
oh wait.. RIP
You stop making MMORPGs and start making AMORPGs.
Too bad western piggus are too casual to have any form of grinding or challenge in their games.
Remember when skills did something besides damage, and their use was key in breaking enemy defenses? Remember when Guild Wars involved planning, strategy, timing and precision instead of just stacking damage buffs and playing whack a hole?
I couldn't care less about quest hubs. I actually prefer grinding mobs EQ style, but like I said removing quest hubs doesn't fix shit. You just replace one with another which is basically the same singleplayer shit in mmo.
>probably not get a huge playerbase
You know what a huge playerbase was back when most of the games mentioned in this thread were popular? 200k active subscribers. Nowadays, anything less than 8 digits is a failure.
Now this is interesting, doing it on a massive scale would require a wicked long word filter list and easy report feature. It'd be terrifying for a while, probably make average players feel like they're in 1984 for a bit.
It's not a problem of being bad. I can find myself in non mmo action games just fine. It's a problem of being tiring physically. Action combat doesn't go well with grinding same shit over and over again.
>It's a problem of being tiring physically.
>It's a problem of being tiring physically.
>It's a problem of being tiring physically.
>It's a problem of being tiring physically.
>It's a problem of being tiring physically.
>It's a problem of being tiring physically.
Every cast had somehting unique to its name to duck around wiht/manage, like how for necros corpeses were an actual asset, elementalists with theri huge manapools and their glyphs could pull some crazy shit (8 man arcane echo'd instant meteor shower anyone?), monk either healed damage or outright prevented them, mesmers and their interconnected skills-effects and mindgames (fukc them to hell and back), and the cookiecutter adrenalin for warriors, pet/traps for rnagers. To not say anything about the expansion classes.
I still hold that the 55hp monk is the most fun thing you could do in the game, went through at least 10 iteration due to nerfs, but still remains.
And that was just one of the hilariously broken combos you could pull off, which made the 1v1 with guildies hilarious.
There hasn't even been one available to the west, all of them are currently region locked to eastern markets.
GW2, Wildstar and such are not AMORPGs, they are MMORPGs with a lazy excuse for an action combat.
Data mining needs to stop. I can't play WoW even to discover new things because mmo-champion already covered new content a month before it was actually released.
Leveling is bullshit. It's only relevant on release of the game or a new expansion. Soon after everyone is max level and no one gives a shit about leveling content after they've done it the first time (if at all). Leveling is used more often to artificially lengthen a game and/or retain customers because of the time you invested in leveling.
Give players choice and allow them to become part of the content. Let players expand upon cities, run their own taverns, inns, repair shops, vendors and resource wholesalers.
Kill the holy trinity. I don't know how to fix this, but I'm so tired of being one of 3 roles.
Make encounters interesting. I read joke threads where enemies target people based on arbitrary facts, like being the youngest, or having a certain color hair. I always thought the trial and error of finding these mechanics would be interesting.
Gambling. What else am I going to do with my hordes of gold?
Allow players to sponsor content/guilds. Imagine an in-game pledging system where guilds can offer their services for sponsors. A PvP guild could keep enemies out of territories, reducing ganking overall, or perhaps they'll go wreck havoc on the opposing side. A PvE guild could go after bigger prey they couldn't afford to before, maybe they'll split the profits or give you certain armor/reagents for helping. Or you could sponsor NPCs and give them advantages they didn't have before. Imagine a small goblin camp, but now they're armed with better swords and armor, causing a headache in your enemy's territory.
>the west will never have a Monster Hunter MMO
I'm not sure about Black Desert, I haven't paid much attention to it beyond a few videos I've seen.
Something like Monster Hunter Online/Frontier has a good combat. (But bunch of other flaws)
This. Fucking this.
I perosnally do not play very much WoW, and never really have save for like, last year for maybe a month of lazy playing, but I I do know lots of shit is just WoW all over again, or they just do the same thing.
Now, maybe I've played too much .Hack, or watched too much SA:O, but damn, if people could actually create and host their own Taverns/Smiths/whatever(to a certain amount of people in one town, of course), that'd be absolutely amazing. We want IMMERSION. Something to make us feel like we're a part of the game. This is what most MMOs lack. Immersion. We're just some fucking faggots trying to get skills and get good gear and level. That's it. I know that's the basic shit people want, but damn. Some more shit is NOT too much to ask for, right?
Agreed to an extent, some stuff should be avaliabe, whil the rest hidden under spoilers or restricted stuff, though hte problem here is that people want to experience the time when they first learned the ins and outs of the game, and no matter how info-starved you hop into a new game, or what gimick it tries to pull, you already know/can guess how 70% of it works just by looking around on the interface. And its not just because everyone is copying wow. I bet if i sit any veteran form any MMO in fornt of an another one in an hour he/she figures most of it out.
If its not the case, then the game must be trying something radically diferent, and ususaly BAD at explaining the deeper workings of it (like you have 50 interconnected stats which names are basicaly synonyms, and the formulas they are used in are pages long), so you end up reading up on it, and voiala, you got the same problem again.
Yes, leveleing must be done away with. Make areas equally enticing endgame, and just for quest-hubs to choose from. Have something to collect from it, to have fun around with, something unique on every area. Like, each area have a unique looking armor (a look you can apply any stat to, or vice versa) that you can get pice by piece by killing its boss for the helm, exploring it for the boots, finish its quest line for the torso, win in its PvP arena/challenge for the leggings, kill everything in it (like, it puts your party in an instanced version of it and you have to kill everything. they wont respawn, bout you wont either. and they have some nasty suprises) and if you 100% out you get a cool little rewards, like geting your name on its taverns hall of fame or something.
I also think PvP should be enabled 24/7 outside of towns and shit, and enabled inside with special exceptions(Duel, some sort of tournament, etc), but players should have to be outside a set amount of time before they're just fucking slaughtered. There should be a good reward for killing someone though, something worthwhile so PvP is actually enjoyable. Also you shouldn't be able to kill people set levels below you(5-10+ levels lower, etc).
And there should be very rare world spawn monsters, so that those who kill them get something special that not everyone else will get in the next few minutes. I'm talking every week or so(maybe more?) this shit spawns and people who kill it get some badass aesthetic shit or something rare. Something you can't sell in an auction hall.
This man is right. The game feels amazing.
It'll also never get localized outside Japan.
You know I used to run ammo and gasoline on my horse in fallen earth.
Yeah I know that game got a bad wrap and still does but if you get past the first half hour and understand the game it is actually kinda fun.
World boss starts off with a 100g drop from it's horde of gold. If a player has no gold, it exp instead. If it can collect neither, it adds neither. The more the world boss kills, the more enticing a target it becomes.
This mechanic can also be abused, one guild could lead the world boss to a city that cannot kill it, letting it soak up gold and exp until it runs out of steam and returns home. That guild could later come back and kill the world boss, collecting it's gold and exp.
>Fixing your game by copying a dead game
Anon, something is wrong with you, how long did you actually play AA? seriously, it's not worth your time. Maybe once they add the two new races, actual content in the north continent and finally conect the seas. But right now the game is pretty bad.
I absolutely love WoW's combat, animations and it's PvP.
I PvP in WoW for over 9 years. I really wish someone would make a game that's centered around PvP like WoW. 6vs6 BGs, 10 vs 10, 25 vs 25, 40 vs 40, as well as 1v1 arenas, 2vs2, 3v3 and 5v5.
No MMO matches WoWs fluent combat and its perfect animations. This really saddens me. It also saddens me seeing blizzard making this Heroes of the Storm mmo shit tier garbage, I really wish they focused on a third person MMO style PvP only game.
Some of the most viewed WoW content is PvP content, the fullest servers are PvP servers.
We need a dedicated PvP MMO.
Well, I see what you mean. However, I mean, going upon >>257517913 's "Let players expand upon cities", the city itself could grow(to a certain extent), and there would be MANY towns(this would have to be a very large game), each expanding to its own limit. I don't know. It's all hard to integrate into a game, and thus likely not going to realistically happen soon, but it's a good idea. Players, becoming a part of the environment. If that's not fucking great, I dunno what is.
Monster Hunter/Dark Souls-combat, no player leveling, no quests. No healthbars, or telegraphs, you have to rely on visual queues and tells. Set in a post-apocalyptic fantasy world.
Just exploration, and crafting. Clearing out challenging dungeons you find, monsters attack settlements, world is constantly evolving, lots of random programmed events, unrestricted PVP with OP guards in major cities. Players can create guilds and build settlements together, wherein player housing will be.
You can discover rare and powerful artifacts in very well-hidden places in the world. Rare mobs will also be hidden, can contain unique mounts, some can only be killed once per server so as not to be farmed and are later replaced with a variety of other rare mobs.
Just some ideas, I'm tired of every MMO sticking to the same formula, things like this would be interesting to experience.
I hope you realize how painfully right you are, as of 2011 ish every single quest has been nothing but holding spacebar to go through generic god lore dialogue and receieving a 200,000 experience handout
I feel bad for people who still play that now that quests have been thoroughly shat on in favor of the DBZ shonen audience and the Diabdon't combat system, not to mention the quadruple cash shops
>You wont see 500 goats in one area, because they roam and go from water source to water source.
To add on to this, let us loot everything from a monster. Maybe a survival skill that lets you chop up your kill and sell/use the various parts like hooves, antlers, meat and internal organs.
Would love the idea of killing a goat, harvesting its innards and using them as a scrying or divination reagent.