A lot of the complaints from reviewers (aside from the game being challenging) is that they were "criticizing" the platforming because you actually had to platform instead of having to rely on magnetic ledge grabbing that Assassin's Creed and Uncharted standardized.
>>267068250 >>267068332 Yeah, I realize, and that sucks because I do like stealth games, but I just feel uncomfortable and weird with third person. Deus Ex? Thief? Dishonored? I'll lap that shit up. Hook me up with Sam Fisher and I can't do it.
I played the first 5 minutes today, going to continue today. What i have to say so far is.
1) It really reminds you of the earlier Metal Gear combined with some Hitman style hiding of bodies and all that. 2) I really like details such as you can get detected if walking on a cirtain surface, carpets makes you silent and stuff. 3)Combat feels really weak as it is supposed to, but i get the feeling that if you master the timing of that parry thing it could turn into assasins creed really fast.
I really fucking love goblins and the setting, but i would prefer if i could play as a Skaven
>>267069071 It is an issue because it takes choice away from the player. Maybe I'd rather run and hide instead of doing the same section over and over. It sucks after progressing and having to start over because some dude found a body.
>>267069532 its improved a bunch of gameplay things from the original and the levels were pretty good worth playing the others not made by acquire are not worth playing imo first one is the best dat ost mang https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpPLGtG2Nk8
>>267070497 I was about to say that we'll soon enough accelerate artificially our perception of time to play more perceived hours than pas in real life, but the same thing will probably be used to make game that much faster too, making backlogs still hopelessy large.
Its pretty good, and for that price its worth it if you like stealth games.
Punishing as fuck if you get caught Huge open maps with lots of vertical and horizontal paths Pretty good detection system but guards forget about you too quickly, and will home in your position too reliably Has one of those "if you hit a chair, you make noise" systems and implements it well Getting detected isnt "You were spotted, now everyone on the map will come and kill you"
But I think the skill system actually hurts the game, they should have made it so you had all the skills at the beginning to play around with, because early on your clones are useless as shit.
>>267074312 >>Haven't had the chance to play dishonored. >>Levels are very vertical. Like Dishonored then, I'll have a look thanks.
>>267074313 Dishonored has great level design >interesting levels all round >lots of alternate pathways >plenty of exploration potential >lots of vertical exploration on offer Dishonored is all round good.
>>267074846 You just have to remind yourself that this isnt Ass creed, ledge detecting isn't the problem, more that jumping from ledge to ledge isn't automatic, you have to maneuver the jump manually and shit, when you wrap your head around that it becomes easy to use and gives you a lot more freedom to make crazy vertical climbing, think thief 1 and 2 like mantling, except you cant use it everywhere.
>>267069837 Nope, first its like old platformers games that if you want to grab the ledge of the platform you are in you have to walk to the ledge and fall off by walking, then you can do like the other guy said and kill the enemy if you have the ability but yeah, most kills here are loud as fuck, and even the muffled kill (takes a lot longer) makes sound so if there are two guards 10 feet from each other they will still hear the kill.
This is another one of their games, is amazing how it doesn't even have a wiki page: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7IpM7_hw9k
Fucking AMAZING strategy game, and also FUCKING HARDCORE; this game is so god damn hard and addicting. Imagine your best MMO fights non-stop with charming companions characters ala Baldur's/Neverwinter. Super underrated gem right here.
>>267063930 read a review its shit because its not like Assassins Creed its shit because controls are not automated like Assassins Creed its shit because its not casual like Assassins Creed its shit because you can't win the game by pressing just one button you should play the sims4 see ? thats a huigh quality game!
It's okay, bit on the cheap side but that doesn't bother me.
Unlike most stealth games out there, there are constant situations where you can't just take out everyone quietly and you absolutely have to sneak past instead, I like it. The "highlight usable things" vision isn't too annoying either, to my surprise.
My only gripes so far are that the controls can be a bit wonky and the levels are a bit boring both visually(art style, constant empty rooms without any clutter or decorations) and content-wise(very few secret areas, bland structuring, no clear reason for existence of a lot of rooms which was never the case with Thief/Dishonored/Hitman/whatever).
Not the best stealth game out there, but worth playing if you like the genre.
>>267087210 I really wanted to like it, but I ended up quitting due to boredom. The game was very railroaded and repetitive. As its saving grace, the protagonists are great characters and the soundtrack is fantastic.
>>267089038 Same. Their lack of polish is usually the result of ambitions far too big for their budget. I just love those buggy messes that simply refuse to settle for copying and mediocrity. It's a breath of fresh air in an industry based around playing it safe.
>Constant questions of is it good/worth it >People reply yes because it's an amazing game with devs who really care, but a small budget >People come back and complain they've been tricked >Just because the game is a little rough around the edges
"Potential" is the key word here. If you ruin the game with terrible sound design and clunky controls where every action is a scripted animation sequence, immersion is impossible no matter how fancy the visuals are or how first person it is.
>>267098594 Well you wouldn't be able to see your surrounding if you were actually trying to be stealthy in real life. Being put in the 3rd person offers the player too much information he can use, limiting the cheaty information he's getting from 3rd person and giving him the real deal 1st person would mean he'd have to actually think before acting.
And not just know when to move or what have you simply because he can time things right from seeing around corners.
Honestly I'd wish stealth games would be more unforgiving, and not hold your hand like some EA gamer.
The angle you see at in a First Person game isnt anywhere close the average person is seeing. Couple that with the fact you are missing other senses that tell you where the rest of your body is and you have a far more frustrating experience.
>Muh Realism is laughable as First Person isn't realistic at all.
>>267099801 >The angle you see at in a First Person game isnt anywhere close the average person is seeing.
Of course the FOV isn't the same. You can't render a world from the perspective of a character's eyes in a real human FOV if the display isn't right in front of your eyes without it looking unnatural or causing disorientation. It's simple geometry. That's why console games have a more narrow field of view. You are only seeing a 60° slice of the full view because you are looking through a window several meters away. The closer you get to the window, the wider an area you can see through it. Any deviation looks zoomed in or out.
And the morons who are in charge of making PC ports of console games in many modern game development companies don't even know the theory behind the systems they are porting.
>>267101159 Exactly, and its for this reason and the reason that rarely are you given indication of where your body is in a first person game that third person is better for a game like this where there is a lot of 3D platforming required.
I always found Thief piss easy as well. Being in shadows is effective invisibility, and taking everyone out is absolutely trivial. Even without savescumming a half an hour of gameplay will let you grasp the mechanics and you will never get detected.
Expert mode just added objectives.
There should've been more missions like the BOLIS :DDDDDDDDD station one where you can't knock anyone out or be seen or more guards with blackjackproof helmets on higher difficulties.
Now that I mention it, I've never played a genuinely hard stealth game and I played a lot.
I have personally never had any problem figuring out where my body is in first person games with 3d platforming. The first time I played Thief I had instant body awareness even though the body was invisible. And in fact, having played Shadows of Mordor recently, I seem to be having trouble determining jump distances precisely because it is a third person game. For me this environmental awareness just feels more natural when the camera is closer to a realistic position. Though it could also be because of the fact that I play on PC and the game inexplicably plays in a 60° FOV. So no wonder I can't figure out distances. The game is constantly zoomed in.
But I support the idea of optional perspectives, as long as one does not adversely affect the other. Like when Thief: Deadly Shadows introduced an optional 3rd person mode, and the movement in both the third- and first person modes was based on the clunky animations of the 3rd person mode. The developers also cut the mechanics of climbing ropes, swimming or getting on or off ladders anywhere but at the top or bottom, because that would have required so many new animations.
I wonder how horrible Dishonored would have been if there was a third person mode chipping away at development resources and causing animation-centric compromises.
>>267102864 >There should've been more missions like the BOLIS :DDDDDDDDD station one where you can't knock anyone out or be seen or more guards with blackjackproof helmets on higher difficulties. Yeah, there really should've been. I guess you could argue the game did record those things and so you could easily impose the challenge on yourself but then again, you can make the easiest, most dumbed down game really difficult if you impose the right challenges.
>>267101673 This looks really good to me but I have huge backlog already and I'm kinda broke Kinda shame, at least single fucking dev doesn't have ridiculous prices at launch and the game looks really fresh at this day and age. Probably gonna get it as soon as it goes to sale.
>>267102984 My arguement isn't "A first person game could never be a good 3d platformer" its that I don't believe Styx would be a good first person 3d platformer.
Styx has a lot of segments that have you hanging off ledges, climbing up ledges and leaping off of ledges. If it were first person you would be starring at a wall too much and wouldn't have enough information to properly time your jumps, it would result in a lot more cheap deaths and we already have reviewers banging on about that in its current iteration. (Mainly cause they are bad and don't realize this isn't AssCreed and you don't stick to things). First person would just make the game frustrating and would need to have some serious redesign to accommodate it.
>tfw linux Anyone know if this game works on wine? I rarely play vidya any more but can't pass up a proper stealth game. Just finished Dishonored and that was a blast but I'm looking for something more traditional.
>>267063930 Fuck, I wish I wasn't broke for the month already. I backed Pathologic's remake just a few weeks ago and also chipped in to a guy's patron project. He does YouTube video comics and is called Lev (Tales of Mere Existence). But I can't afford this game right now even though it seems quite neat
I really like supporting the little devs
I kind of identify with them because I aspire to be one too
Does this game have psychic guards? If someone detects me will every NPC around be alerted even if he didn't have time to warn anyone before i killed him? This is important, i'm so fed up with this shit.
>>267105371 It is if executed properly. From your post i conclude that you're just not a fan of the stealth genre. As you said, Dishonored is a fun "stealth" game, but these features make stealth way too easy. Gotta leave it to them though that they included lean and no third person cover bullshit like Deus Ex.
>>267105665 To this day i don't know who actually plays TES games in third person. People say that they improved it a lot in Skyrim, and they did. But it's shit nevertheless, Oblivion 3rd person was just horrible to begin with.
>>267105481 I haven't noticed any real problems like that. As long as you're not caught out in the daylight guards will take a bit of time to "investigate" giving you a couple seconds to skitter off and find somewhere to hide before raising an alarm, but once they're alerted you cant stealth kill them except with throwing knives and they'll shout for help immediately.
>>267105763 I'd like to enjoy stealth games because it's an interesting concept but in practice it too often revolves around waiting for NPCs to move while sitting in shadows. A gimmick like disguises or powers makes things more interesting.
>>267105237 Meh, for me it's a non issue. There's like a thousand other factors that are more important for me to get sucked into a game. Attention to detail is probably the big one. I just can't stand the whole "only first person realistic games can be immersive".
It's even worse when changing camera angles cause changes in the controls. Instead of pressing forward to move forward, you press right to move forward because the camera is looking at your character from the right.
I noticed that in Shadow of Mordor, regardless of whether you look forwards or backwards when hanging from a ledge, your character always moves to his left when pressing left, and his right when pressing right. Which I think is pretty great because I hate anything contextual. It doesn't excuse all the other contextual shit in that game though. Like all those accicental stealth attacks when trying to drop down.
>>267106616 First person ultimately helps immersion but you're right. Especially aspects like atmosphere, good sound design and little pieces of fiction that expand on the world. Also level of interactivity.
>>267087697 >In some ways Styx feels like a stealth game from an earlier era, but one that's more dated then vintage. It tries to pick up a few tricks from more modern games in the genre, but much of its core wouldn't have been out of place alongside the earlier Tenchu or Metal Gear Solid games. This is from polygon. Score - 50(5/10 with their rating system)
With those retards it's obvious it'll get low metacritic.
>>267106847 >Most of those aren't even immersive Lol but they are. If you have an opinion about third person games that's fine but don't go pulling shit out of your ass about how the most immersive games are third person when there are games like Thief, DE, SS2 etc around.
>>267106760 Sound design goes a goddamn long way. I can still remember playing Stalker Clear Sky and first reaching Cordon and hearing the wind blowing through the trees, and how I never heard that in the swamp. It just sucked me right into the game.
>>267106636 Unreal 1 is an amazing game, but I never felt immersed in it.
>>267107231 It's a low profile game, they probably didn't send them a copy, and they probably put forth minimal effort reviewing the game considering the small fanbase they risk pissing off. That and most reviewers consume so much AAA shit that any game that diverts from that formula will probably just be odd to them.
what he said just made me want to buy the game more.
>>267107390 >mfw At least you tried. http://www.giantbomb.com/immersive-sim/3015-5700/ Have a look if you like >>267107398 I never got around to playing CS but SoC was gold when it came to immersion and atmosphere. I think I spent about 100 hours in that game before I finally burned out on it.
As for Unreal, I think the immersion is there. Especially when the levels open ended, the soundtrack is incredible, you see constant notes lying around and as you dwell deeper and deeper into the planet the environments get incredibly rich and interesting. Unreal 1 was overshadowed by HL1 unfortunately but it's an incredibly immersive game imo.
>>267108331 >, but the atmosphere of the game is second to none For me the best atmosphere in games came in Thief Gold. After 6 years I still play Thief 1/2 regularly. Whether it be the main campaign or the fan missions.
Have you tried the Doom's Mod Merge: Anon Edition from /vg/ stalker thread? Great mod.
I'd like to think these king of hidden gems will shine in a distant future and gain some sort of cult following, but who am I kidding except for myself. I feel bad for the devs because they actually have the will to put out something fresh on the table except for your daily military arcade shooter or tolkien fantasy safe game.
>>267107845 I'd consider HL1 a bit more immersive, but you do have a solid point on Unreal 1. I didn't read a ton of the notes and the story just sort of drops you on a setting and introduces a ton of things so abruptly. Half Life 1 had a nice slow start to ease you into the world and get the setting started. Plus, the way people talk to each other and you do a lot to set up the setting.
Also as for Stalker, CS is fine to miss, but SoC and CoP are amazing. The immersion there is really hard to top.
I just bought like 2 games off of steam so I'm trying to hold off, but this game actually seems neat.
I started playing it a bit, it is fun and difficult so finishing areas feels rewarding, I might even bump my difficulty up to goblin since I am on hard atm. The level design is really nice and Styx himself is a great protag, he is so cynical and a complete ass, plus that voice actor is perfect for a little goblin man. Pretty much this trailer sold me on it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pacPaPfCbXs But it is nice to see /v/ likes it too.
>>267108605 Starting CoP first is what I would recommend. It's the most polished by far and it gives you better starting gear than SoC, so the inital difficulty hump is much more forgiving. They are clunky games, but once you get used to them they're fantastic shooters.
Also vanilla SoC is overrated, feel free to mod it if you see fit.
>>267108830 I think HL1 was immersive in it's own right but for me it just doesn't have the same appeal as Unreal 1 does in terms of world building and atmosphere.
Stalker series is definitely up there in terms of immersion.
>>267109046 Doom's Mod Merge:Anon Edition makes the game freeplay and lets you start off as any faction member doing quests for that particular faction or any other faction that you're not in a war with. >>>/vg/82577264 Go to the mod repository and download to see. No main story, just a bunch of quests. It's great for immersion sandbox gameplay.
>>267105475 oh wait I got this I hope you're still here I saved his stuff from e-hentai
http://sakuga.yshi.org/post/show/245/animated-flipbook-tatsuyuki_tanaka http://exhentai.org/g/215754/8e4ab739bd/ It's also called Canabis works or some shit you can find the 10 minute animation if you google it.
>>267109903 That particular FM was Disorientation. Sprawling city exploration map. I think I spent bout 4/5 hours just exploring the hell out of it and enjoying the Thief 1esque atmosphere. protip: Explore as much as possible >Seven Shades of Mercury good choice, absolutely stellar FM.
>>267106365 As i said, if properly executed that doesn't have to be boring at all. Take chaos theory for example, you can distract enemies, use remote cams to distract them and take them out, you can knock them out from a distance with ring projectiles or electric ammo (or shoot into a puddle and neutralize a bunch at once) etc.
Anyways, Hitman is a god tier stealth game aswell without all that, you've got some taste.
>>267110207 Downloaded it, will play it later tonight, thanks. Also, yeah, that's Seven shades of Mercury, I've started playing it a few days ago, so far I think the mission is quite well done, although I'm having some FPS drops in certain areas since my computer is shit.
>>267111180 >I've started playing it a few days ago >started It's a pretty expansive mission but I find it's most interesting when you cover the entire FM in one evening. I think Seven Shades took me 5 or so hours to properly complete without too much noise or alarms.
I love how every team of hammerites has a gimmick and a different approach you must make towards them. The entire mission actually feels quite professionally done.
>>267109412 The AI is simple but I'm finding that it works well with the levels (by putting guards everywhere) and the powers you have. Like, the shadow stealth is not very advanced either, but with the levels so broad and open you can focus on scale instead of Thief where you pay more attention to careful shadows in every room. Instead you rely more on climbing up and around enemies, but dropping down silently is non-trivial unless there's carpet, so it all feels like a nice balance so far. Simple but done right.
Some day we will get the next Thief/Chaos Theory... some day...
Shit, now I want to play some FMs too. I have that big image with the best ones that I got from /v/ that I'm using a progress map. I've tried about half a dozen so far, only disliked a couple. The games have the best fucking community, I think those that I liked are easily on par with some of the original missions.
I will almost never defend skyrim over new vegas, but if they got one thing right it was TPP animations. New Vegas is unplayable for me because of the lack of connection between your feet and the ground. Skyrim has an animation for slow walk, regular walk, jog, sprint and most importantly, DIAGONAL MOVEMENT ANIMATIONS
>>267113446 >Is there by any chance a pack to play fan missions? There's a torrent up on rutracker of Thief 2 fan missions but I'm sure they just packed in as many as they could regardless of quality. I'm afraid you'll just have to download all missions separately.
I felt Silent Hill music was completely out of place, it put me off the thing completely.
So far I only played a few but enjoyed most of them immensely. Conspiracies in the Dark and Heart of Bohn are my favourites so far, but there was also some amazing rooftop mission where a guy contemplates suicide and there's a completely hidden objective to prevent it by dropping a certain letter in his house. Thought it was really well done.
Another one I hated was The 7th Crystal, it was basically chain keyhunting and completely missed what Thief was about.
>>267114153 >Damn, I didn't expect this thread to get so good. We need to have stealth threads more often, they seem to have much less shitposting compared to what's happening at the rest of the board. A lot of stealth threads I've been to often degenerate into shit throwing and "This game was better than that game". It's Thief threads that usually lack any shitposting but Thief threads are pretty rare. Here's hoping Styx inspires more stealth discussion in general.
>>267114356 >Also, what's everyone's favorite level? It's incredibly difficult to pick just one. Especially when I enjoyed the hell out of just about every level. Thief 1 >Bafford's Mansion >Bonehoard >Assassins >The Sword >Lost City >Mage Towers >Songs of Caverns >Maw of Chaos
Thief 2 >Running Interference (though a short tutorial mission, the atmosphere was godlike inside the mansion) >Precious Cargo >Framed >Trail of Blood >Life of the Party >Blackmail
Just off the top of my head. I probably missed some.
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