The new Elder Scrolls game will have no chance of being great, right?
Skyrim was such a success with the mass market, it's only going to get worse from here on out, right?
nah, the only shit TES game was oblivion. every TES game since daggerfall has been a success with the mass market, and that's because they cut out an ridiculous amount of stuff between daggerfall and morrowind and a ridiculous amount of stuff between morrowind and oblivion. comparatively, they didn't really cut that much stuff between oblivion and skyrim. anyway, none of that really means anything because the games generally end up being fun and, apart from the detour in quality that was oblivion, the series is fine. everyone's gonna buy the next one, love it and play it for 100 hours, then come on 4chan and pretend to hate it until tes 7 comes out and then the process will repeat again.
I think the next TES game will be pretty damn good.
They made a shitton of money with Skyrim. When Skyrim came out, RPGs all still only featured pretty simplistic combat for the vast majority, but nowadays TES has much bigger competition and they really have to step up their game with the new title.
I think this competition, from games like the Souls series, The Witcher, Hellraid, etc, will make the next title become pretty damn good.
In Todd's own words, they were sick of TES by the time they finished Oblivion.
By my own speculation, Skyrim was the product of passionless focus groups and marketing.
Morrowind was the last TES game made genuinely by passionate developers.
I think many people just prefer Morrowind because it was their first TES game.
When you play TES for the first time, they are always good, but if you play another title of them, because of their quite unique gameplay.
However, they are still flawed as fuck, no matter if Skyrim, Oblivion or Morrowind.
I played Morrowind for the first time in 2012, and I enjoyed it the most out of the three. Your opinion is shit.
There are plenty of people who have said in other threads that they've played TES since the first one and found Morrowind their favorite, or gone backwars from Skyrim and found Morrowind their favorite, etc.
Morrowind was my first, and still my favorite, but I can actually explain why. It's not just novelty bias.
My biggest niggle is that, these days, Bethesda half arse a games UI, world and even bug patching and just let modders fix all that shit for them.
That fucking Hearthfire DLC, we had a mod that did the same thing but better!
That said, Oblivion I enjoyed greatly. Yeah it also was flawed to hell, but I thought the UI and combat were a nice balance between being action orientated and RPG based. Without the random missing bullshit of MW or the annoying kill animations of Skyrim.
Not to mention the quest arrow in IV was usually just helpful rather than in your face YOU MUST GO THIS WAY AND TALK TO THIS GUY THEN KILL THIS GUY AND USE THIS THING HERE.
MW was shit in the reliance on the poorly written journal. Skyrim had NOTHING like a journal (Fucking hell you can't even ask for directions, an NPC says the name of a place and you instantly know where it is, meaning even if you turn that fucking annoying arrow off you're basically fucked as the journal has nothing useful written in it and NPCs won't elaborate on the location) to the point where it was detrimental.
>played TES since the first one and found Morrowind their favorite
Morrowind was also completely different from Arena or Daggerfall, since the game took much longer to come out. Its not really comparable.
good for you for not letting shit taste hold you back
> they didn't really cut that much stuff between oblivion and skyrim. anyway, none of that really means anything because the games generally end up being fun
skyrim has the shittiest quest of all fucking RPG i've ever played.
>Did I ever mention something about mods?
No, of course you didn't. You just said you played Morrowind, which is why I assume you played it without mods. Otherwise you would say you played modded Morrowind, which is something very different.
May be that unmodded, Morrowind is the best, but even then it still be flawed to oblivion. The only way to really enjoy these games, apart from if you never played such a game perhaps, is to mod the shit out of them.
What features are left for them to take out? I haven't played Skyrim, just curious.
If you say a game sucks without playing it, you get told that you can't hate it without playing it.
If you sink a hundred hours into it, to know it through, and say with authority that it sucks, you get asked why you played it so much.
There's no winning internet debates.
I'm sorry your standarts are so low to be able to enjoy TES without mods.
Just go to /tesg/ for example. Everyone uses a shitton of mods there, because that's the only way you can enjoy these games. They were practically build to get modded.
>Bethesda is one of the few companies to release actual games and doesn't include the ending in dlc or have micro-transactions
>/v/ still made it cool to hate them because they aren't Nintendo
>little kiddies come on /v/ and read about how cool it is to hate Bethesda
>all of Bethesda's future releases are metacritic bombed and the games flop
>Bethesda sells the rights to fallout and elder scrolls to bioware.
I can see it all now. Good job, guys
Well I said one, not four. But yeah.
A better answer to your question would have been "the sample size you get from playing games with randoms is nowhere near 'everyone'." Nor is it the opinion of /v/ anywhere near that of "everyone".
Nah bro. Nah.
Yea, and this game was actually just mediocre shit.
Meanwhile I really can enjoy games because I actually play good games.
I dont hate Bethesda, I just think TES are obviously fucking flawed as fuck.
They function great as a ground structure for mods though. that's I still play them.
RRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE YOU WAIT UNTIL TODD *RODS LIKE A GOD* HOWARD STEALS *YOUR* GF NORMIE, THEN YOU'LL BELIEVE US!!!
>Yea, and this game was actually just mediocre shit.
We talking about Oblivion again?
>Meanwhile I really can enjoy games because I actually play good games.
Sure you do scooter.
>We talking about Oblivion again?
No, we were talking about Morronwind, obviously.
Why even respond if you obviously can't even follow discussions.
>ermygerd dice rolls so flawed
You twelve year olds crack me up.
It was a joke. Your opinion is shit, and you've been talking out of both sides of your mouth. You don't like vanilla Morrowind. Cool. Your problem.
The mass-market eats up bethesda games, People who don't play games regularly call themselves hardcore gamers because they played 15 hours of oblivion a couple of years ago.
Nomatter what they release it will be heralded as the best game ever and better than all of the previous games, and it's just going to be another generic, you are the chosen guy/girl to save the world from the bad things. It;s a tired formula that never ceases to sell 1 million+ copies
>implying the combat gets any better if you have stamina
Shit still looks awkward as fuck. People make fun of Skyrim for having no gameplay, but Morrowind really takes the cake, imo.
Thats the thing. Bethesda can get away with half-arsed games because they are pleasing to the casual crowd on the surface, and thanks to their extensive modding tools; they can let modders fix up and alter the game to give access to an even bigger market.
I use skyrim as a comfy simulator with all the hardcore weather mods and shit, wouldn't have bought it without mods.
I will too anon, and I will enjoy it even more than how mad everyone here will be
MGSO looks bretty gud, imo. Aesthetically, if not technically.
We'll see, they could stumble on a good idea by accident, but I agree that they did well enough that they have no incentive to steer far from the path they set out.
Now Skyrim wasn't a *bad* game as much as it was a disappointing game. It's enjoyable for the first 20 hours and some can apparently enjoy it for much much longer despite all the repeated caves and samey fetch quests. Skyrim sort of sells a feeling; you are the Dragonborn, go out and forge a name for yourself. You know that whole 'you can climb that mountain' bullshit they are selling at this point.
The main issue I have with it, the issue I guess we all have with it, is that the feeling of having a whole world to explore quickly disappears once you realize most the places you can find are going to be similar. That guild quests are basically another way of sending you out to the same fucking dungeons with the same fucking undead vikings. It becomes tedious.
So 'disappointing' is really my main thoughts on it. It's still a roleplaying game, you can still do things in it, but once you get over the initial hype it's more shallow then it's predecessors and I have no faith they will make the sequel have more depth.
>The thing is is that he's right.
No he is just comparing two totally different games.
Daggerfall has totally different focuses than Morrowind, same goes for Skyrim compared to Oblivion or whatever.
>No he is just comparing two totally different games.
That tends to be what happens when you compare one game to another, anon.
>Daggerfall has totally different focuses than Morrowind
This I could buy.
>same goes for Skyrim compared to Oblivion or whatever
This not so much.
If only they didn't rush Skyrim and made it with PC in mind first and consoles second like they did with Morrowind.
They did great with the concept of Creation Kit but it fucking sucks.
>That tends to be what happens when you compare one game to another, anon.
No, games are often very similar to each other. Others are much less similar. The person who write just things that everything has to be the same as before, just because it is the same series. If something is lacking then it immediately makes it the worse game, without relaizing that it also added much on different parts which the other title did not have. That's just retarded. But it's what they all do.
>tfw everyone says Oblivion is shit but you really liked it, almost as much as Morrowind
I don't get how anyone can say Skyrim is better that Oblivion though, Oblivion shits all over Skyrim.
Because England is like a generic fantasy setting
morrowind was broke though, honestly
you could enchant a ring or something with 100 lockpick on target and completely bypass the entire mechanic for free, or levitate past huge obstacles, or just obtain the best gear in the game within minutes
it was so broke on launch a min/max build can clear the game in like 13 minutes with the way buffs worked and stacked
that being said i'm not praising later installments' implementations, you can clip through walls and static objects with skyrim's physics engine while holding a plate for example
what i'm saying is mechanically they're all just as shit and not worth comparing
Despite being different, the guy's first complaints (I didn't read the entire post) were a lack of a property buying mechanic, that every single settlement in the game can be fast-traveled to, and that the game lost scope to make room for graphical improvement. Every one of those things is a valid complaint, and the first two wouldn't have been any problem to implement.
>you could enchant a ring or something with 100 lockpick on target and completely bypass the entire mechanic for free, or levitate past huge obstacles, or just obtain the best gear in the game within minutes
It's funny because many people argue that they got rid of most of the enchanting options because they were pointless. Not everyone knew how to obtain the best armor early, nor how to enchant things well.
I also never said he didn't have valid complains.
However, just because the game has flaws, or its predecessors did something better, doesn't mean the game is bad or the prequels are better.
I'm sure Morrowind also did much on the gameplay better than Daggerfall.
Honestly I'll never understand why people think some of the shit they removed didn't need to be removed. I agree 100% they went way overboard in Skyrim, especially the removal of stats- just, why?
But removal of skills I don't get why people complain about as a blanket thing. If you're just going "hurr the number of skills used to be higher" then you don't actually know what you want, because perks are a thing now. Making there only be two weapon trees wouldn't be such a big deal if they made perks let you specialize in swords, axes, whatever.
And spellcrafting was largely gimmicky. It was just you sliding bars around until you found the most efficient way to cast a spell, and they didn't really allow for any true variety ("hm, do I want a small fireball that costs 1 MP or a big fireball that costs 20?"). Not saying they shouldn't add it back in but spellcrafting in the form it was in was overrated as fuck. As shitty as Skyrim's magic was at least conceptually a lot of spells were different- a flamethrower, a firebolt, fireball, big explosion etc.
pretty sure gasoline is a proper noun which titles the combination of compounds found in feul
whereas petroleum is the title of the crude resource which doesn't accurately describe the hydrocarbons
one of which properly describes what you put into a car
or a "wheelmobile" as you ignorant cunts call them
>TES 6: Hammerfell announced
>No mod support
>Khajiit Orcs and Argonians are now DLC
>Pre-order day one for access to two handed weapons
>Bioware style relationship bullshit scattered through out the game
>Skyrim comes out
>I love it
>friends love it
>spend hours playing it in turns
>still enjoy LPs and gaming youtube at this time
>get stoned often
>talk about how we're going to make a webcoming called Sven & the Dragonborn
>talk about how we'll make a Brodyquest video called Dovahquest
>talk about setting up "Emporer Palpatine plays Skyrim"
>mfw too talentless to make these happen
>mfw opportunity passed years ago
Don't even like SKyrim, LPers or
I'd have hope that, even if Skyrim was a great hit, they received the criticism from older fans and realized that removing features and streamlining everything was a bad idea, even if it made the game more accessible.
But who am I kidding, my optimism and hope will only lead to disappointment.
And for the love of god they need to do something about the combat.
Just play Nehrim and Enderal if you want to see what Oblivion and Skyrim should have been like.
Seriously. SureAI is like an alternate world Bethesda that's actually passionate, tasteful and talented.
Respectfully, It sounds like you didn't actually use the spell making to its full potential.
You could make spells that had multiple effects, you could change durations of the effects independently of eachother, and, at least in Morrowind, you could combine any spell effects, making a infinite number of combinations.
In Oblivion it was slightly less, but still vast, and extremely useful, and fun.
Removing in Skyrim was a travesty.
I can't tell if you're just pretending to be dense. Yes, Health Magicka and Stamina are still there, but anytime someone says "stats" they mean the base stats you see in almost every fucking RPG like Strength etc.
I think he's only played Skyrim.
Someone's going to wind up having to explain why someone might want a veriation in Attributes and Skills, rather than just one or other, which will of course ultimately boil down to opinion vs. opinion bullshit.
I knew you could do stuff like that, there just wasn't a lot of practical use for it.
Yeah I could make a fireball that also lowers the enemy's strength and personality if I wanted to, but what situation am I actually going to use that? When you give the player incredibly situational spells the player's probably just going to cast those separately.
Again, I would NOT mind them bringing it back at all, it's a really cool system. Obviously I want both ideally, but if I really had to choose between spellcrafting and just a couple unique spells done well, I'd probably choose the latter.
Skyrim was pretty strange. It got a shit load of attention from fans of TES but somehow also got hugely popular with casuals and normies. A lot of these people claim Elder Scrolls is their favorite franchise and have only played Skyrim. You see a lot of "gamer gurls" talk about Skyrim/Fallout 3 for whatever reason.
Its a pretty great game but most definitely overrated. Its similar to the large population of Zelda fans who have only briefly played one entry. So many bandwagoners out there thats why we have memes of people confusing Zelda and Link, and even Samus with Metroid. Sad but these people do exist.
>I knew you could do stuff like that, there just wasn't a lot of practical use for it.
I beg to differ.
>make a fireball that also lowers the enemy's strength and personality if I wanted to, but what situation am I actually going to use that?
That's a really narrow, and purposefully worthless?, example man.
>When you give the player incredibly situational spells the player's probably just going to cast those separately.
Which takes time, depending on how much UI fumbling is involved.
You are the one who is dense. There are still many stats, like being able to levelup archery, smithing, etc
All these base stats do is just breaking the game anyway.
When you have a cap at level 81 or whatever (which is a good thing), then its just retarded to be able to level up health, strenght or whatever so much.
All it does is just turning you into an ultimate damage sponge later on and the combat becomes even more pathetic.
If you level up strenght, then what the fuck are the perks like added 1h weapon strength for? Same goes for intelligence, which is basically just the same as magicka anyway.
It's either just gamebreaking or straight out redundant.
>As shitty as Skyrim's magic was at least conceptually a lot of spells were different- a flamethrower, a firebolt, fireball, big explosion etc.
are you for real ?
holy fuck i need to never come back here.
This sums up the TES cycle pretty well. I remember when the majority of people shitposted Oblivion back and forth and now people circlejerk about how it has "amazing quests" even though much like Skyrim it has like 80% trash quests and 20% good quests (although I will admit the best quests in Oblivion were better than the best quests of Skyrim).
And the whodunnit quest, the one people never fail the bring up, while very cool in concept, was done laughably poorly because you could murder someone in the corner of the room while nobody was looking and then you tap one of them on the shoulder and they'll still be all "CAREFUL BROTHER THERES BEEN A MURDER I THINK IT WAS THE GUY UPSTAIRS"
let's be real, you'll hate it whether it's shit or not for the simple fact it'll be popular and praised amongst "normies".
is skyrim the best game ever? no, not even close. but is it enjoyable enough that i and plenty of people could sink hundreds of hours into? yes.
>I'd have hope that, even if Skyrim was a great hit, they received the criticism from older fans and realized that removing features and streamlining everything was a bad idea
yeah,im sure the sales department agree with you...
>Im pretty sure many have said the same when Morrowind came out.
I wish people have played Daggerfall and Redguard
It will probably be just as good as Skyrim, if not better, and at the same time will receive little praise for not being Skyrim 2. You'd be hard pressed to find someone who says they love the series without finding out Skyrim is the only one they've actually played. Majority of praise the game received was from these types of people. Ive actually run into multiple people who hail Skyrim as the best vidya ever created and none of them played any other Elder Scrolls or even had a desire to. These people will hype it up but ultimately be unsatisfied when it isnt Skyrim 2.0.
I miss the times when everything had a purpose.
When games couldn't afford to throw completely meaningless stuff in. At a time when only the quality hand picked stuff made it in.
Now it's all just spewing a lot of meaningless content and empty choices at the player and hoping that he thinks some of it is interesting.
You have no idea what you are talking about. People are talking about a bunch of games, you clearly haven't played them and you're spilling your fucking idiocy all over the place and confusing yourself. Just shut the fuck up.
what the fuck,how do you read my post
all the spell were the fucking same in skyrim.
rune of fire
exact same shit for lightnign and ice.
skyrim magic was absolute dogshit you fucking shitheadposter
I admit maybe I have shit for imagination but the most useful thing I could think of is stuff like multiple elemental attacks and such, or heal all stats, etc.
A lot of the combinations you could do just seem more RP-friendly than anything- but then again, that's part of the whole point, which is why I'd welcome it back for sure.
Partial redundancy in stats is not necessarily a bad thing, it can allow for more variability in builds. Also all that shit you listed are skills and not base stats.
As for balance issues, are you implying Skyrim was free of those?
If you cant see that there are stats in Skyrim then its obviously you who has no idea.
Enjoy your archaic rpgs which let you magically distribute points in everything, although you actually did something completely different in game.
Stop acting like you have any idea about this stuff though.
Getting smarter by adding points to Intelligence, although all you did was just slashing people with 1h sword makes zero sense.
A flamethrower, a fireball, a rune, and a explosion around you is still more effective variety than "small fireball and bigger fireball" that Morrowind/Oblivion had.
I want spellcrafting to come back as much as anyone, but not if that means we go back to the days of magic being nothing but different-sized red orbs.
>Enjoy your archaic rpgs which let you magically distribute points in everything, although you actually did something completely different in game.
Confirmed for not actually playing Morrowind or Oblivion, because your stat gains in both those games were also determined by what you were doing.
Also this applies to Skyrim just as much, if not more, because you can get a 10 Magicka every level without fail even if you were playing as a Warrior the whole time.
>not turning the HUD off
>being this much of a casual
>Also all that shit you listed are skills and not base stats.
They are stats just like base stats, just connected to skills more.
The original post was about not having any stats in game which is plain out wrong.
There are stats in game, but they just make more sense now, are more intuitive and more immersive.
I never said Skyrim is balanced. learn to read. Every TES game is unbalanced as fuck in vanilla.
And to really balance them, you actually have to remove even more base stats, to prevent becoming a damage sponge at later levels.
>I admit maybe I have shit for imagination but the most useful thing I could think of is stuff like multiple elemental attacks and such, or heal all stats, etc.
Well, to be fair, that was the most -pragmatic- thing to do in Oblivion.
>A lot of the combinations you could do just seem more RP-friendly than anything-
Maybe. I found some that simply cut out on UI time, like summon spells that simultaneously made me invisible, or Paralyze + Damage, etc. If we're talking specifically about pragmatism, yeah, it's hard to argue against removing spell crafting in a context where there isn't a chance for the spell to fail, or, in a post-TES3 context, restrictions to what spells you can actually cast.
>but then again, that's part of the whole point, which is why I'd welcome it back for sure.
Yeah. I just wish it were back.
I played Oblivion, but I honestly dont care what other games you are actually referring to.
Base stats are just retarded anyway. All they do is just breaking the game at later levels and making the game even more unrealistic, when you happily can tank 20 hits into the face just because you leveled up health enough.
Skill stats are much smarter and more logical, but nostalgia hipsters like you will never get this.
>he thinks having reduced character building options is immersive
>muh streamline, muh useless stats
it just sounds like you people don't like RPGs, and want to force them to be something they're not
also this idea that too many stats make things impossible to balance is consistently disproved by plenty of RPGs. Don't mistake Bethesda not being able to level scale for shit for the system itself being flawed.
>hurr durr its a fantasy so there must be no logic in it
Yea, I'm sure if Aragorn just could take 20 arrows in his head and walk like nothing happened, LotR surely would have been a great success...
pff,k well its shit cause there shouldnt be magic.
any game where there is magic is instantly shit.
make the next elder scrool,swords and shield:the game NO MAGIC ALLOWED.
also you die in one hit to chest or head and you can loose your limb.
i also want to die if i die in game.
No, its just people like you who always make up their own system of what a game has to be like to be considered RPG.
I like RPGs but I also can see that they still have many flaws in their systems.
And the vast majority of them is flawed and unimmersive, unrealistic as fuck, when it comes to level scaling.
It's just all about damage sponges and other retarded stuff instead of actually tactics which requires reflexes and actual gameplay.
Max level up in Dark Souls for example... What you will have is a character who can 50 hits before you die, jump around like a ninja in the heaviest armor and probably dual wield two giant dragon tooth swords, while at the same time still being the most intelligent wizard on the planet.
That's all these base stats do. They just break the game at later levels.
Again, the problem here is that you're assuming that removing stats somehow accomplishes what you're looking for, when that isn't the case at all. People have done rebalance mods that do basically what you're asking for without removing any stats whatsoever.
They're never going to do that in a retail release because most people think dying in one hit and needing to quick load 70 times for one dungeon is annoying.
What would your ideal Elder Scrolls be, /v/?
>Set in most of Tamriel
>200 years after Skyrim
>17th Century aesthetic
>Set over an incredibly huge area
>Class system (customisable in the same manner as NWN)
>Advanced follower mechanics (can issue orders by mouse and set up scripts like in DA:O)
>More complex spells
>A story in which you're not the chosen one
I actually really enjoyed the combat in Morrowind. Like barely hitting anything at first, making every hit seem satisfying and meaning ful, and then you start leveling up and you hit more and more often, and it's just cool. It's not immersive, but neither is Oblivion or Skyrims combat.