>>284245571 >edgelord If you want to go back to your prancy faggoty characters from FFX and onward, be my guest. Homosexuality isn't a crime, anon; but don't expect to be respected while you're busy sucking Nomura's cock.
>>284245397 This guy literally has no clue what he's talking about.
It has nothing to do with FFVII and everything to do with financial threats due to TSW tanking at box office, the merger with Enix, the decision to only focus on core IP for safe spending, and the departure of their best talent because of that.
>>284245869 >>284246123 >KH series post 1 >Valkyrie Profile 2 >Star Ocean: Till the End of Time >FFXII, XIII, and XIV, Revenant Wings, Tactics A2, Dissidia, and Type 0 >The World Ends With You >Bravely Default >Drakengard 3 okay
Squaresoft was killing most of its IPs and doubling down on Final Fantasy before the merger. Its the main reason the merger had to happen.
Then after the merger, they put even more money into developing even bigger FF games while ignoring all their other IPs. None of this is the fault of Enix. If anything, the constant profit from Dragon Quest has kept the combined company alive, while many FF games under performed. One Dragon Quest spin off can sell 1.5 million copies in Japan alone. While most spin off FF games struggle to sell 350,000 copies worldwide.
Final Fantasy is a slowly dying brand that will never reach its success on the Playstation. That's what killed Squaresoft and will eventually kill SquareEnix. I just hope Enix finds a way to survive when Square kills itself on Final Fantasy XVI.
>You say this, but XIII sold by the fucking boatload. It sold less than FFVII, VIII or X. And units sold is not the same as profit. Especially since more than 1/3 the copies of FFXIII were at bargain bin prices.
>As will XV We will see. But I forsee it won't even match the sales of FFXIII. After its wasted 9 years of hype and jumped to consoles with even smaller install bases. Its also not getting the 4+ years of consistent marketing and hype like FFXIII did before its launch. The only people who know or care about FFXV is hardcore FF fans. Which is nowhere near 6 million people.
>>284245618 I think XIII wasn't as bad as people say (it's still far from good though) and I'm cautiously looking forward to XV but you're straight up wrong. My first FF was XII so it's not like i have any nostalgia for Squaresoft either.
>>284247363 >My first FF was XII Same here actually. I don't think its fair to think XIII was anywhere close to bad though. At absolute worst I can see it as mediocre, but not bad. Not with that combat, characters, visuals, or music.
>>284247191 Keep telling yourself that buddy. FFXV will be the highest selling FF game since FF7. You wanna know how? All my normalfag friends who've never even heard of final fantasy or never played it want to get XV because it's no longer turn based and it looks very pretty and has driving. This time, both FF fans and Normals are going to buy this game. That's literally who they're marketing this game for, "A final fantasy based on reality". Also the game is only 60% done, once it gets to 80% the marketing will pick up like crazy, don't you worry.
>>284248274 Maybe X and probably XII. Other then that no.
But I really fucking love XII. Im glad Matsuno had a chance to work his magic in the end. Even if the higher ups fucked him in the ass near the end and tried to contort it into modern FF. Too scared it wouldnt sell. Even though Matsuno shits platinum 40/40 hits every morning.
>>284248627 You're not getting a Cid Highwind, you're not getting a Barret, you're not getting a Tifa, you're not getting a Yuffie, you're not getting a Rufus, you're not getting any Turks, you're not getting a flower girl. You're getting 4 faggots in a car, enjoy.
>>284248274 X was ok I think it was the last offering from the guy who directed 7 and 8. I haven't really touched the series after X. XII was set in that unfamiliar crystal universe setting that gets reused now instead of them making a fresh universe. Though FF XIV is really good I think that is in the same continuum.
Dragon Quest is still an Enix property. I think his point was all DQ games have been made by outside parties. The only games actually made by SquareEnix proper have been DQMonsters: Battle Road and Dragon Quest X. Both headed by the current lead on Final Fantasy XIV funny enough.
>>284248849 There's a lot of things, but I guess what I like most about it is its combat and lack of random encounters. I like the fact that how many enemies an attack will make or whether or not an attack hits or misses or if you accidentally hurt your teammates depends upon the timing of attacks. I thought it was cool that everyone runs around on the battlefield all the time.
I'm also very fond of Sazh and Vanille, and about the only character I find myself hating is Hope.
>>284249121 I couldn't get past >the lack of towns >level caps >no armor/weapon variety >tons of cutscenes >l'cie, fal'cie >unlikable characters I kept playing it, waiting for it to get better, and when it finally did, it was too little, too late. The story is so bad. It's really bad. And they throw around these lore terms as if you already knew them, never really explaining shit.
Nice job deflecting, but it won't work. You originally claimed FFXV looked just like FFVII. But that's idiotic. You tried to defend this by claiming they're both 'modern fantasy'. Which I never claimed otherwise. I named another modern fantasy (FFVIII) to point out that two gamers in the same genre don't look the same.
FFVII is dystopian fantasy. FFVIII is the opposite of this. FFXV is nothing like either one, taking far more influence from actual modern day settings and designs. FFXV looks closer to Type-0 or TWEWY than FFVII.
>>284249645 >And they throw around these lore terms as if you already knew them, never really explaining shit. Its not a good thing that they did this but if you read the main menu becomes easier to follow.
>>284249150 The battle system is clunky and dull. Theres no real design choices gameplay wise with your character. You follow one way paths to grow. Theres no skill setup or party configuration so to speak. 2 of the character play themselves which further compounds the issue.
The environments are incredibly boring with no real sense of wonder or exploration until Pulse, but even then youre stuck in and endless expanse doing hunts if you want any form of variety from the game.
It moves incredibly slow and the characters drone on and on going in circles with the conflicts in their minds. Their interactions are one note to say the least with no complex emotions or personality outside their one characteristic.
To make the dialogue and interaction worse the setting is is convoluted as fuck and you have to search through a sub menu of encyclopedia entries to ever know what anyone is talking about because the game does a shit job of introducing concepts and ideas about the world. It fails at world building and story telling on every level.
Its was supposed to capitalize on the fan service of a female Cloud. Thinking thats what makes a good game people will love. Disregarding all form of story telling and the way you construe one to the audience.
The game is pure trash on nearly every level with dull gameplay, dull characters, and an uninspired and poorly planned setting. Fuck your hallways and lightning points. We could sit here all day talking about why this is a terrible game and not even touch the obvious.
>>284249150 Linear corridors for most of it, no town exploring, unrelatable cast, story completely fails to make you sympathize with the heroes plight and you are never given a reason to care for anyone on Cocoon, the few sidequests that are there are given by inanimate objects. Game relegates most things to an in-game wikipedia. Character growth is linear, boss fights have timers to attempt to hide the fact that the battle system is heavily flawed, battles aren't random anymore but they might as well be with how enemy placement is handled leading to an insane amount of inescapable battles. Want me to go on? Well here's the pro's: Music's ok and the voices are sorta ok (Sazh).
>The story is so bad. If this was a reason to dislike a FF game, we'd have to ignore every FF game.
I also laugh when people claim its too linear and 'hallway simulator'. Its not like the past FF games gave you much freedom. Even a game like FFVI and VIII which had lots of places to go and an 'overworld', most places were empty until you hit a certain story trigger.
Final Fantasy is the one series I can think of where more linearity and focus on story could actually improve it. Problem is, the story is always so bad you want to find something else to redeem the game. And few games ever have anything else...
>not really, IV, VI and XII have decent story FFIV and XII have some of the most ridiculous and plot hole stories in the series. I mean, you go to the fucking moon and fight a guy controlling another guy who's controlling another guy.... And FFXII isn't even a complete game.
>>284251003 >Every FF game has a shitty story and is linear as fuck That's a little hyperbolic, don't you think? I mean, the story to FF7-10 really wasn't that bad.
At least Final Fantasy games with an overworld let you explore, and had secrets, and had towns. Towns are important in an RPG. They let you just relax and hang out. You need a break from all that action sometimes.
>Final Fantasy is the one series I can think of where more linearity and focus on story could actually improve it. You sound like you want movie games
Believe me man, I tried to like Final Fantasy 13. I really wanted to like it. I was hyped as fuck since 2006. It was just about the biggest gaming disappointment for me ever. My feels get in the way, I guess.
>>284251003 IX gave me the freedom to fight endgame enemies halfway through disc 1. VII gave me the freedom to backtrack back to the first area at pretty much any point of of the story on the first disc and also gave me 2 optional characters. VIII is shit but at least it let's me break the game and run around challenging idiots to card games. I could go on. Also, likable characters make a huge difference. Now try and claim that XIII has likable characters besides Danny Glover with an afro.
>>284251830 >IX gave me the freedom to fight endgame enemies halfway through disc 1 Um what? The entire disc 1 of 9 was on rails. It was the longest opening of a final fantasy ever at the time. The game literally did not open up till you popped in the second disc.
>>284251830 If they released an FFVIII sequel with no combat or important stories. Just Squall and gang travelling around the world becoming Triple Triad masters. I would buy a copy, and one for all my friends.
>That's a little hyperbolic, don't you think? I mean, the story to FF7-10 really wasn't that bad.
Depends entirely on your opinion. Everyone seems to have a different opinion when it comes to Final Fantasy. For example, I think the story in FFVII and X is full of tons of inconsistencies and plot holes. FFVIII on the other hand has the best story of the series to me.
But I can still acknowledge that even FFVIII has a handful of really bad plot holes centered around forced plot twists. That's the problem. Even at its best, a Final Fantasy game is trying way too hard to be different and blow your mind. And usually it ends up having the opposite effect.
Being able to go back to previous areas is not really open ended gameplay. You can do that in many linear games as well.
FFVIII is a better example because it actually did attempt more customization options. As well as having to get the majority of spells and GFs from exploring the world. They weren't just automatically given to you in a cutscene like in FFIV or X.
I still need to play some of the earlier FFs. Just picked up IX. Played 3,4,6, and 10 from square soft days even though 10 got later printed with Square Enix brand. Also got Secret of Mana on my plate so cant judge that yet.
My favorite of what I've played so far has been SMRPG.
>>284252097 Grand dragons with limit glove and the thunder ring, try it sometime. You could spend time digging up chocographs, upgrade to light blue, backtrack through Gizamaluke's grotto, dig up more chocographs and get the oak staff on disc 1. You could go back to Lindblum plateau with Quina and learn limit glove to be able to beat lvl 65 Grand Dragons.
>>284252524 Well unlike you, I don't keep a mental encyclopedia of every piece of dialogue in the game so these plot holes you're talking about have never affected my enjoyment of the Final Fantasy games.
Initially I said FF13 had a shitty story, to which you replied, they're all shitty. I guess they are somewhat childish stories, but I'm standing firm in my opinion that FF13 is shit on a whole 'nother level.
>They weren't just automatically given to you in a cutscene like in FFIV or X. This is why I was legitimately disappointed in Aeons in FFX. Felt like there should be 3-4x as many of them considering how many were in FFVII and VIII. At least give us a new game + option with more of them to unlock.
>>284252838 Its not even just how shit the story is. Its how bad of a job they did presenting it and introducing the world to you. Most of the game you have no idda what youre doing and unless you consult the in game references and read up on things the game never tells you, chances are you wont even know what or why youre fighting at the end or what the fuck you even just experienced.
Even if you take the time out to learn from the encyclopedia it still sounds ridiculous. They try to take simple things and make them complex. But it feels forced and unnatural. The story never progresses in an engaging or smooth way. Earlier Final Fantasy games, plot holes or story quality aside, never had a problem crafting a believable world and introducing it to you in a compelling fashion.
XIII could have skated by on good gameplay even if the story was shit. But it has none.
It's a pretty shit taste opinion, but I fucking love Star Ocean Til the End of Time
Ignore the ridiculous plot, the clichey and awful cast, the fact it's barely sci-fi for most of the game for some reason, and you get this really great action RPG with a ton going for it.
Great crafting system, weapon upgrading system, tons of room for min-maxing, a post-game that can beat your ass if your not good, gameplay that heavily rewards skill, a great equipment system, and a generally comfy and lovable game.
I get the hate for it, I totally do, but in my opinion it's one of my favorite video games ever made, and among Square's finest.
>>284254836 Square Enix wants huge numbers for everything. If a game doesn't push into the 7 digit range easily, they don't think it's good enough to even try.
DQIX probably wouldn't have been localized if Nintendo didn't step it. The company really has some shitty suits running the top. "Why try something new or revive a good niche fan-appreciated series (like Chrono, for example) when we can just shit out another Final Fantasy? Remember to buy Type-0 and 15, kids!"
Its sad that we have to hope for a major failure for Final Fantasy Type 0 and FFXV just to hope it wakes up the management. And even then, they're more likely to put even MORE money into FFXVI than ever think to localize non FF games.
The issue doesn't seem to be money even. It seems to be some pride thing where they want to keep Final Fantasy the highest selling IP in the west. By keeping all other IPs from not getting localized...
>>284255424 >Its sad that we have to hope for a major failure for Final Fantasy Type 0 and FFXV just to hope it wakes up the management. Is it strange that I want this to happen despite looking forward to FFXV?
>>284244441 >>284255703 You are blatantly wrong. Perhaps that's the best Square game you guys have ever played, but it's pretty much shit overall. Even knowing what to expect from it, I still found the game rather dull.
It's average. Just because it is the first average 3D RPG with an overblown budget doesn't mean its not average.
>>284255718 Tyoe-0 is probably not going to sell very well, but in the end it's just a fucking PSP game. I doubt a lot of money went into the project, it's on-par or less than the recent remasters they've been shitting out for their Eidos-side.
XV it's just not gonna happen. Too much buzz, too much coverage, too many true honest to goodness FF fans. XIII and it's sequels might have put them off, but now that something new without Lightning is coming out, they're gonna give it another shot.
Plus with the very stylish graphics and impressive world, I bet a portion of normies will bite too.
>>284256141 I have no interest in type 0. If it was that good in the first place, they would have released it in 2011.
As for XV, I guess I have a passing interest in that, but I'm waiting until the game is below 20 bucks. I mean, I'm not starving for games on my PS3, and waiting to pick up the PS4 will only benefit me in the long run.
>>284256310 You got me, man. To port DQ to the west, all you would need is a team of translators and a team of coders to put said translation in game. Change the menu's into English, get a localization team to westernize Japanese jokes, etc.
DQ7 might be a fucklong game with a million lines of text, but that PALES in comparison to fucking coding anything. It's straight up stupidity, and the expectations they have for any localizations at all are ludicrous at best. THEY'D STILL MAKE MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, but I guess it's not good enough.
I don't think FFXV is going to do as well as people keep claiming. Its way past its initial hype period (by about 9 years) and isn't getting the years of marketing like FFXIII got. Plus, its already been in development so long, its having jump to new platforms. Which it probably would have sold even better on PS3.
Everything is looking to be a rather lackluster set of events that will make the general market overlook it. While major FF fans will obsess over it. But most main series FF games sell the majority of their copies to the general public, not hardcore FF fans.
Basically, it seems like FFXII all over again. A massively hyped game that loses its steam before release. Then gets less than expected sales and reviews.
>>284256335 It not a new game man. I got it preordered because JP loved it even enough to make a HD remaster. I trust them when it comes to FF more than anywhere else honestly. Theres even fan translations and fans have said its great. I've never played it but I've looked up enough gameplay and read enough of what fans think for better or worse. You'll be doing yourself a favor by judging the content yourself to see if its for you than relying on metacritic scores.
That's the main point. SquareEnix may pay for a localization. But a company like 8-4 or Plus Alpha would be doing the actual work. Not actual SquareEnix employees (except maybe a couple overseers). So its not like they're losing anything from trying. Even if the game only sold 250k copies, its more money going into their pocket.
It gets even more stupid when you realize Nintendo has offered to cover the localization and distribution. Further removing any costs.
>>284256794 Hey, I'm not disagreeing with you. But in the end, XIII still got 2 sequels that both pushed some good units, even if LR didn't sell very well at all. Re-use the assets, throw in a lame plot, and you got a new FF game. They more than broke even.
The FF gravy train is gonna keep running. I'm calling it right the fuck now, unless XV BOMBS, like less than 500K units somehow (it's not going to happen), it's gonna get sequels. Bomb, all money made plus millions, onto FFXVI.
>>284257269 If you eventually decide to pick them up, play Cross than Triggers. It heavily removes the expectation that the games are similar at all, and the original feeling of wanting a sequel of Trigger.
Cross isn't a perfect game, but it's painted as horrid simply because it's in Trigger's shadow.
If nothing else, download the OST of Cross if you never play those games ever.
>>284252576 Probably true. So far FF6 is my favorite of those I've played. I never played any until I was older though and I played SMRPG probably when I was 8 or 9 with my best friend. Lots of nostalgia there. Saw it came up on a list of games that have aged poorly and didnt agree with it. The chief complaint was the battle system never changes or advances in the entire game. Never really realized it until it was brought to my attention. Still dont have a problem though probably because of the nostalgia.
While Square denies it, many people think FFXIII got two sequels to make up the amount of money they expected FFXIII to get alone. Wada nd other shareholders are on record for claiming it would surpass the sales for FFVII (over 9 million). Obviously FFXIII itself sold 6.5 million. But with both sequels, it reached that goal of over 9 million.
FFXV will probaby get the same treatment. Release lower than expected, then endless sequels to pad out the sales. But remember, FFXV was originally suppose to be a spin off of FFXIII in the first place so...
Last acceptable Mana game was Legend of Mana, back for the PS1. Still wasn't as good as Secret. Square's problem is that they let the series go to shit, and the fact that they never produced very many SoM games for the west, to begin with. Back in 2008, Secret of Mana still cost 60 bucks on ebay, cartridge only.
>>284257272 >It was promised to be on the PS3 before the PS3 even launched. This fucking company. What is it with them cryptically announcing shit like that mobile port of TWEWY? At least they admitted they announced this too early.
Game is fucking magical and holds a dear place for everyone who really got into it. Fantastic atmosphere, emphasis on teamplay, amazing music, great job system, fair difficulty, also holds the title of being squares most profitable game to date.
>>284247680 If it actually does sell better than VII, then that means we'll finally get our VII remake after XV, since the reason we don't already have our VII remake is because they're waiting for a Final Fantasy game to sell better than VII.
>>284258696 I'm not positive, as I didn't really follow the news all that closely. Its certainly possible, but I thought it was one guys "love letter" to FF, because he hated the direction that New FF was going. So I had thought that there were two teams working at the same time, though I could be mistaken.
>>284259508 >I thought it was one guys "love letter" to FF, because he hated the direction that New FF was going. IIRC it was just supposed to be a counterpart to FFXIII, although that may have been the case.
>To bad mana series are dead and dying. Which is the fault of Square making about 6 low budget Mana games over the course of 2 gens. And not even bringing them all to the west.
They should have just funneled that money into porting SD3 to the west and making one high budget Mana game. SD3 ported to DS would have done more to improve Mana than all of the games on DS and PS2 combined.
>>284259725 I don't recall. Last time I bothered checking anything on it was like 2010, where it still wasn't in "full production," even though it was 2 full years after the game was supposed to be released.
>>284245113 If you ask me, Squeenix kind of set themselves up to die back during this golden era. They were developing or publishing an ABSOLUTELY INSANE amount of products at the time. FFVII, FFVIII, and FFIX were released within 4 years of each other, let that sink in... and that's only their FF titles, when they were producing at least a dozen more within that time period. That kind of path just wasn't sustainable, and they paid the price.
>>284258923 No. Wada and Square Executives had more control over the merger then Enix executives do. Square Executive are the ones in charge of Square Enix because they had bigger growth plans then Enix did. Enix was bigger then Squaresoft, Square never wanted to merge with Enix because Enix would have gotten control if Wada wasn't a smooth talker.
If Enix had their way, the management of Square Enix would have been a lot of different. Spirt Within scared Enix away from merging with Square, Wada tried to convince Enix to merge with them again. If Wada didn't succeed in restructuring Square early 2000-mid 2000's, Enix would have back away from the deal.
Resonance of Fate was pretty fun overall, though it does have its own issues. Otherwise all I can really think of is the Etrian Odyssey games but I don't know if they are really what you are looking for....
I agree. As I said earlier in this thread. They were making far too many games on the PSX. While at the same time having some of the largest development budgets in gaming history for FFVII-IX. If even one of those FF games didn't sell as expected, they were going to lose money...which happened with FFIX. Add Spirits within to it and you have their need for a merger.
Other games like Chrono Cross, Xenogears, Legend of Mana and more actually did better than expected. But didn't sell 6+ million like Final Fantasy. So they slowly phased them out. Along with my interest in them as a company. The only thing the combined company makes that I want anymore is Dragon Quest. And that's being localization blocked by the Square side. Further making me hate them and ignore them.
>>284260232 It actually was totally sustainable, back when you had the fucking wizards working on the title that you had back in the day.
You also have to keep in mind that, at least with FF7 and 8, the games were released with lots of cut content, because the exclusivity contract with Sony included a time table. Seeing Aeris's ghost was supposed to start a quest to revive her, but that got cut due to time constraints. FF8 was actually supposed to explain time compression more fully, and have another disk where you and your party prepared to have time compressed, while actually being able to survive the compression.
It is what it is, but they put out a lot of high quality games with decent stories because they had the ability to. A few more months per title is really all they needed to give it the final shine that they wanted to.
>>284248274 X had some neat lore and story elements, but also NTR and a combat system that only got interesting once you hit the arena X-2 was fun as hell but the story is literally "dumb peppy shoujo sequel to sappy shoujo tragedy" XII is some funky fanservice if you played Tactics but it's basically just Star Wars in a magical desert XIII is a combat simulator that takes a day to install
>No. Wada and Square Executives had more control over the merger then Enix executives do. Square Executive are the ones in charge of Square Enix because they had bigger growth plans then Enix did. Enix was bigger then Squaresoft, Square never wanted to merge with Enix because Enix would have gotten control if Wada wasn't a smooth talker.
You have a total skewed view of the merger. It was Square who came to Enix and asked for the merger multiple times over a period of three years. Enix refused multiple times until they finally came to an agreement in 2000 still didn't fully merge until 3 years later in 2003.
Square combined with Enix because Enix had more capital and was able to buy out most of their bad stock. Enix combined with Square because they wanted access to the western market (which Square was successful at penetrating) as well as some of Square's non game related investments (anime productions, music deals and Sony connections).
And now Square is actively blocking most Enix games from being localized while living on the profits made from Dragon Quest to make even bigger FF games. All thanks to Square getting their head as the president of the combined company. As well as Wada owning the majority of stock for the combined company.
Square royally screwed Enix. Not the other way around.
>>284249369 FFVII's setting was pre-space-age. FFVIII's was fledgling space age. There's literally a moon base FFXIII's setting is pure fantasy. All of the technology is inherently related to the powers of magic within the game. Does having magic TV/recordable video mean it's modern? FFX is a modern fantasy game too then
>>284261757 >FFVII's setting was pre-space-age. >FFVIII's was fledgling space age. There's literally a moon base Both these settings have space programs. >FFXIII Never mentioned in that post Why do FF threads attract such cretinous dumbasses?
Seiken Densetsu 3 was the sequel. And improved on Secret of Mana in every way possible. Especially hit boxes, combos and magic. But the characters and story were also better. It also has some of the best textures and sprites for a 2D game ever.
It was never released in the west for no real good reason. Especially when Secret of Mana did so good. And Legend of Mana still came out.
Space travel is a very small part of both those games. Its better to say FFVII is a dystopian dark setting while FFVIII is the opposite (utopia look with problems undernearth).
FFX is another type of dystopian setting, despite it looking pretty and clean. FFXIII is futuristic dystopian similar to Logans Run on steroids. FFXV looks nothing like any of these and is more like a straight modern setting with fantasy buildings and empty grasslands.
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