Define artificial difficulty & real difficulty.
Your definition may not consist entirely of examples.
Oh boy Dank Dungeon thread.
I stopped playing it awhile ago because I'm waiting on the full release but I'm considering booting it back up again and running almost exclusively highwaymen. They're awesome.
FTL doesn't spend the entire game making you think it's more complex in every aspect than it actually is, and has relatively engaging well thought out mechanics
Neither of them are artificial when it comes to difficulty get good
There's nothing artificial about a random number's generator.
if you can't evaluate the risk, your decision matters shit all. You can pretend that you are "getting good" by being cautious and not picking a choice when its more dangerous, but in the end you can never affect it.
the problem isn't even in the randomness itself, but in the fact how one dice roll can shit all over your game immediately forever.
Its the same with new Xcom versus old Xcom, instead of managing your shots and movement in a detailed way, you're hit in the face with walk or walk further and 56-72% of hitting 2-6 damage.
>start new playthrough
>do first dungeon after tutorial
>first 3 fights i get critted literally 20 times
>everyone freaks out
>3 guys dead
>can only recruit 2 new guys
Luck is a skill, the mighty forge their own destiny.
>if you can't evaluate the risk, your decision matters shit all.
but they do, the way you adapt when shits hits the fan is where this game it's at. adapt and overcome.
seriously, no amount of RNG can fuck you up if you know what you're doing.
>old Xcom was not RNG
what he said >>284942973
ooops, looks like your posted the wrong pic
I'm comfortable with the RNG in this game compared to most. I want to love most roguelikes out there but the RNG is just too retarded most of the time.
Oh hey you prepared as best you could with equipment for every possible situation and resist and as many escape items and other shit as possible? Well too bad, RNG just created a huge faglord monster that has an elemental attack for the one resist you couldn't find enough of and destroys you in one hit lulz git gud.
>All video games are made of artificial difficulty.
>/v pisses and moans about artificial difficulty.
>/v hates artificial difficulty.
>/v hates the stuff that video games are made of.
>/v hates video Games.
Top fucking kek. I managed to defeat her at my first try. Balanced team makes a difference mang.
early signs points to the devs being bros and actually caring about the game. lots of updates and balances fixes in the first days after release.
I am 90% sure this game will see full release, the problem is that it's going to take six months.
price's about right for the amount of content and polish it has.
Well my first guy to consistently go into heroic mode every time he got stressed was my Crusader so my entire main party evolved around him. And the Leper just felt inferior to him. Grave Robber never really matched up against my Highwayman Plague Doctor Combo either. I always go Vestale in back. I suppose I must be a scrub then.
I use Graverobber, Highwayman, Jester and Demonologist. With the right skills selected, it's broken as sin. Oh you just had your lineup moved around? 3 of my characters have abilities that allow them to attack and move at the same time.
So if i get a lot of accuracy on leper it will fix the reason he's useless, which is the fact he can only attack the 2 front spots and only from the two front spots?
I didn't know that, i always though that accuracy only increased accuracy and didn't modify abilities like that, that's great!
Since you know, a unit that can only attack the front row is useless since all the dangerous enemies are backrow enemies, especially if that unit has absolutely no attacks from the 3rd and 4th positions when it gets shuffled there by a surprise or enemy abilities.
But now that i know that accuracy fixes that leper is looking great!
Does accuracy change what positions an ability can target on other classes too or is that just for leper?
You're forgetting the rest of the shit he has, which is massive base damage, self-buffs and being the tankiest merc in the game.
If you have a bard and a leper in your party, you'll come out with full hp and less stress than you came in with.
>15 different monsters
>3 bosses in 3 different variations
>like 6 different adventuring scenarios
Hope they add at least once as much content before release. As it is, the game is 3 - 4 hours long unless you're a grindhound.
this game is extremely easy.
got to 28 weeks with just 3 deaths, and 2 of them were level 0 characters yoloing without torches to end a quest for free money.
the ones that struggle either don't understand the really easy bases of the game or had a start so bad that they end up spending all the money every week, keeping their characters always under upgraded.
if you get ahead on gold and you upgrade your squad you snowball easy and you end up not needing stress reduction in 90% of weeks.
>The Sweeper and The Jack-of-all-trades is useless
I come out with full HP and less stress than i entered with using Vest/Occu BH HWM Helion and i don't have to waste 2 slots on party member that won't be attacking the backrow.
And Leper is not even close to the tankiest merc, he has beyond shit dodge and it's the only defensive stat that matters since it's the only one that prevents crits which are the only attacks that matter.
aside from bosses, 60% of encounters you have one guy with 60 hp sitting in front row and 2 dangerous enemies in the backline with 20 hp that need to be eliminated.
i'd rather get a frontliner who has options to choose target than leper, because 15 bonus hp, 2 extra damage and -10 accuracy won't make the fight as good as actually killing the courier first turn.
the game gets boring pretty fast.
it's quite content-dependent.
needs more enemies/zone ( just a few more will create many possible enemy's party setup).
also it does encourage you to try different party setups with 5 bosses and 5 zones...but you need more reasons. i would love a couple missions where " a zone has been infested by X enemy" forcing you to make a weird party setup to get through it.
>Crusader gets critically splashed with wine
>half of my party goes insane and refuses to do anything
i think that the stress mechanic is a good idea and really adds to the atmosphere but sometimes it just makes my party look really squeamish
i think the ideas behind the game are good, but its just too fucking easy and the combat is SO SLOW PACED. turnbased is fine, i like that, but in fights with tons of resists/miss etc having no option to skip animations is horrible.
dude that's not just wine
that's also blood
other men's blood
that's been sitting around in an underground cavern for who knows how long
plus it could also be magic, it is a "tempting" goblet
maybe it means they're tempted to take a drink of the putrid juices, and they just can't stop thinking about it, but they know it's wrong, but they just can't stop wanting to drink it
game should not stop for dialog boxes for sure.
animations are not that slow honestly, but your turn/enemy turn should start as soon as animation end, there is currently half a second delay.
It really is random to the point that is isn't even fun. If there was something to where you could at least strategize your moves better, that would be good. Such as seeing who moves next for the next 5 turns or so.
>All the literal garbage players complaining about the RNG on the forums.
>Times when the RNG fuck you over are actually super rare.
I really wish garbage players that actively complained could be culled. You're allowed to be shit at a game, you're just not allowed to give your opinion, especially in regards to balance.
Real difficulty is when something is challenging but is entirely possible to overcome.
Artificial difficulty is when something is designed specifically to harm or defeat you and there's nothing you can do to alter that course.
Many claim a lot of the traps in the Souls series were artificial difficulty, but there were subtle hints to let you know what was ahead.
people have been wondering for a while what actually determines turn order, and it's not so much an indicator people are looking for, more just an outright explanation for how turn order works
but really they game's files are wide open so if there were enough people that cared you could find out pretty easily
Except there will always be a minimum of four heroes available, whether they're in the cart or in your roster.
I tested this personally by throwing Reynauld and Dismas to the wolves in the tutorial. The coach had four heroes in it rather than the usual two and dismissing was disabled.
>decide to do a champion level dungeon for the first time
>read a book
>instantly get over 50% stress level
yea, fuck that
it would make more sense if stress was tied to damage
>kill 3 of these fucking pig demons, only one of the small ones left, party is doing fine
>he vomits on my graverobber for 2 damage
>WE ARE ALL GOING TO DIE
it's simple really, ever played D&D?
character speed score + dice roll. highest result goes first. it's rerolled every round.
The devs recently added a turn indicator that, while not giving you the turn order, it shows with a counter who has taken its turn during the round.
>there are people in this thread that don't know you can use a shovel to smash a locked cabinet if you don't have a key
I actually love it.
Pirated a build off a torrent, and started playing it now and than. Succeeding against RNG chances in games feels great. Its gambling with your character's lives. I wish more games work off the RNG factor so victory is not always certain. Every time my two front assaults miss on their turn and my support in the fucking back keeps getting picked off nickle and dime his health. There is so much pressure to fucking end the fight so you can break camp.
It takes a few dungeons to get the flow of the game. The most important part is making sure you can upgrades your combat abilities, manage your stress levels, and have a healthy roster to rotate.
Bounty Hunter is my bro. Fuck those traps, and fuck them back of the line faggots picking off my Vestal. Face full of axe nigger!
I never leave battle after being caught off guard because I always thought that would increase my parties stress levels like leaving the dungeon to early before completing the mission.
Thanks for the tip in that vid.
>there are people in this thread that don't know you can use a torch on the scrolls to burn of a negative quirk
>enter bookstore, flip trough random books
>have a mental breakdown, start cutting yourself right there
>go on tumblr and complain about the bookstore not having a warning for people triggered by paper
>people actually defending this game
imagine FTL, then suddenly a critical hit on your ship opens a hole and you start to lose oxygen, your party is dying and you try to start the oxygen generator but it rolls and FAILS to start, so you move your party to the medbay that rolls a 1 in healing while you take 10 dmg per second and everyone dies
that what FTL would be like if it played like darkest dungeon
Good thing its NOT and its a different fucking game.
Go back to bejeweled grandpa. Men are playing here.
>Jump to system
>Mantis raiders with teleporter in front of a sun
>Everything is on fire, Mantis boarding crew destroys your life support systems and slaughter your crew
FTLs RNG fucks you over pretty often
>Interacting with anything on a difficult dungeon without diffusing-items
There is an upgrade that lets you know where suns and other hazards are, you can be prepared, there are constants in FTL
If it was like darkest the sensors would roll, fail to detect the sun and then fuck you over, you can never be prepared in DD because everything is random, might as well go gambling
There are upgrades in the game that help you prepare for the unknown. Like your abilities, and gear. They are two fucking different games nigger. Comparing the two as the same is fucking nigger tier faggotry.
Its like comparing two completely different gaming systems like DnD 4th Ed to Rogue Trader.
3.5/Pathfinder is the better of the two.
Real difficulty: The more you play the game, the better you are at that game.
Artificial difficulty: There is no way of knowing what the correct course of action is, or how to beat an enemy, except for trial and error.
>Real difficulty: The more you play the game, the better you are at that game.
>Artificial difficulty: There is no way of knowing what the correct course of action is, or how to beat an enemy, except for trial and error.
>both are mutually the same
A-a-are you actually stupid?
And you have to get passed the fact that the only means of making encounters "difficult" was adding a shit ton of enemies to ambush you.
>literally the only hard bosses are the ones with multiple enemies
>none are genuinely challenging or interesting
>most just encourage you to hold up a greatshield for a dumb amount of time and wait for all the enemies to incidentally swing at the same time giving you a chance to attack one of them once without trading
Real difficulty: Good play is rewarded, bad play is punished
Artificial difficulty: No matter how you play, you are at the mercy of the RNG
You could play with the shittiest party composition ever, luck can always make you win.
You could play with the best party combination ever, bad luck can always make you lose.
The whole point of this game is that it's artificially difficult.
>actually trying to make an argument about a buzzword created and used by /v/ alone
>RNG = artificial difficulty = bad video game
Way to completely miss the theme of the game, being that the odds are stacked against you. There are factors that will affect you in a negative way, no matter how hard you try to minmax your way out of them. Calling the game artificially difficult is actively validating their effort, because you've proven that you can't handle it.
Go back to playing tower defense games with OP.
On a related note, can someone take >>284958161 and replace "Triggered" with "Arificial Difficulty"?
>You could play with the shittiest party composition ever, luck can always make you win.
>You could play with the best party combination ever, bad luck can always make you lose.
You would have redundant skills and lineup otherwise. Meaning that you have to have a select team with a select set of skills in order to actually win, because anything else would be rendered difficult. Almost, dare I say, in an artificial manner.
How would you make the game difficult then?.
FUCK YOU AND YOUR PIECE OF SHIT GOBLET, STICK IT UP YOUR BONY ASS, I FUCKING HATE YOU, HOPE YOUR PARTY WAS FUCKING SHIT
man, fuck these guys
That would be the case if the game didn't offer you ways of getting better. Increasing your chances for a more favorable RNG with leveling, gear, and upgrades is not artificial no matter how meager they are.
Artificial difficulty for example is damage sponge enemies while reducing the amount of damage you deal to them. No real difficulty is added to enemy A.I, reduction in item pick-ups or in game ability adjustments.
You are complaining about the system used in the game, and what the game is about. Calling it an artificially difficult game because you're too stupid to retreat from battle, and don't know how to manage the situation is just being a whining baby used to hand holding.
But you CAN rig the RNG to be in your favor.
How should I provision for the Weald? First time in there
>550 gold in the bank
you're gonna get SO fucked if this goes wrong
if you are this much strapped for cash consider sending a bunch of expendables on a no-torch run
Jesus Christ man, talk about over preparing. You're going to dump half of that shit for the loot you wont be able to fight in there. You wont even break even with how much you spent. If you are not given fucking firewood, don't get more than 12 food, and 8 torches. I full stack each is often the best without camp outs.
Gambling is the definition of RNG, games of probabilities are only difficult because you can't affect the outcome. Yes it's artificial difficulty.
Did you even read my post?
>"The whole point of this game is that it's artificially difficult."
I obviously know it's the point. There's no point in whining that the game is artificially difficult, but there's no point in denying it either.
You make the game difficult by the use of player skill(Action games), Strategy and planning(Grand strategies), micro and macromanagement(RTS), etc...
Risk management is gambling, I can see how it's fun but it's in as fun as playing the lottery for me.
Pig tables are in warrens.
That's everything you use herbs on. Moonshine stills only give you a damage buff so they're not even required.
the fact that this game heavily relies on RNG is apparent and doesn't bother me at all. What bothers me is that you keep insiting on using a retarded buzzword that only shitposters and people that are actually mentally challenged use, which leads me to believe that you belong to either category
Even though you plebs insist it's purely RNG, I bet I could run through five dungeons with appropriately levelled heroes and still make it out just fine.
RNG is an excuse for shit players.
Dose coming through
Also the game becomes piss easy after you have a lvl 3 party. One of the main complaints about the game is that it gets easier as you go along instead of more difficult.
Nice Ad Hominem, my whole point is that the game heavily relies on RNG and denying that is lying to yourself. Artificial difficulty defines that well and I don't see why I can't use that word because it triggers you.
>There's no point in whining that the game is artificially difficult, but there's no point in denying it either.
Its not though, you confusing RANDOM NUMBER GENERATING outcomes to artificial difficulty. Its a gaming system, not artificial difficulty which is lazy implemented game difficulty. No one uses that fucking term with GAME OF CHANCE rolls for dice based games which rides on CHANCE being the main part of the game.
Don't be fucking stupid with comparing GAMBLING to "artificial difficulty".
Artificial difficulty is when a game increases difficulty by scaling numerical values, such as enemy health and damage. Yes, it is more difficult, but not nearly as enjoyable to play with than more inventive ways, such as enemy placement and different movesets to throw you off.
Destiny is a good example of a game that uses a lot of artificial difficulty.
I have a level three Highwayman that refuses to go into any Level 1 dungeon. Its beneath him. I don't even know how he got that high that fast. No one else is even close to him. I only lost 3 characters in this campaign, and they were still under level 2. Everyone else in my roster is still Level 0-1. I wonder if he got those bonus levels randomly for heroic outcomes test of faith, disarming traps, and opening bags.
The most obvious sign for lazy or incompetent development is RNG. And it is what ruined the game for me.
Ran out of ideas or time? Don't know how to create meaningful content? No problem simply put RNG in it advertise it as a "rogue like" and call it a day!
For me, real difficulty relies on "own fault"
"Own fault" means that the fact that you lost can always be traced back to a bad decision you made.
In games of chance, even if you always make the right decision you can still lose you are really unlucky, i'll give you that it does not happen that often, but it does happen.
>game heavily relies on RNG and denying that is lying to yourself
nobody's fucking denying that.
>Artificial difficulty defines that well
no it fucking doesn't, RNG is just fine as a definition, artificial difficulty has no fucking definition and thus is a meaningless word.
Babies that grew up on games with purely determined static game figures has completely made a generation retarded on what games of chance are when used in video games.
I don't know if there are actually trolls in the thread or just a bunch of dumb high school niggers ignorant to dice games.
>the definition of artificial difficulty is something that some dumb nameless nigger on 4chan came up with 4 posts ago
wow stop posting anytime
Actually I can, did you ever play DnD in your whole fucking life? You have access to a literal arsenal of scrolls, wands, magic, prayers and magical items to deal with any situation you could think of.
Its a great way to weed out the parroting idiots. Artificial Difficulty IS a thing used by lazy or rushed dev teams in games. Just the same as GIT GUD is a true that you get better by playing more.
/v/ is a board as a whole is a cluster fuck of casual shits, lurkers, trolls, marketeers, social knight, various other cancers, and genuine hobbyists. As soon as you act as if its a hivemind. You are that fucking nigger faggot with an invalid opinion that is part of the cancer.
most of them are tied to dice checks. roll a 1 in a critcal situation and you are fucked, no matter how prepared you are.
now if I were a dumb person like you are I would be screaming "muh artificial difficulty" but guess what, I'm not, I accept the mechanics for what they are and enjoy them without spouting buzzwords
>As soon as you act as if its a hivemind.
God fucking damnit. I swear to god, as soon as anyone goes "/v/ says" or "/v/ acts like" there's always some fucking dipshit who just feels compelled to pipe in
>/v/ is one person
Like we don't fucking know /v/ is more than one person. It's speaking generally. It's talking about observed consensus.
You had fucking holy water, anti venom, herbs, and you STILL let him die. You just ARTIFICIALLY created DIFFICULTY to try an prove a point.
let's analize this case here. you were fucked by the RNG and lost a Crusader.
Is this Artificial Difficulty, according to this definition here?>>284962509
Is it true that "you couldn't have predicted that, this is trial and error gameplay?"
Let's see what you could have done to avoid this.
>You could have brought Antivenom
>You could have brought a Vestal
>You could have brought a Plague Doctor
>You could have brought retired from the battle and used food to heal
>You could have equipped death blow resist trinket
I rest my case.
>>destroys the gameplay
>not making a game boring, or needlessly longer with padding
That is not what it means, again you are parroting terms by using them wrong.
Goblet skellies have nothing on Swine Wretches. You think Tempting Goblet cries are bad? It's the same shit with Vomit, except it gives you The Runs, Syphilis and 9 different kind of AIDS.
That would make DnD a game that gets worse the longer you play it, which is the opposite of what it is.
Actually, your chances of success stay the same all the time since the situations you encounter get harder as well.
You merely acquire more possible solutions and have access to a bigger arsenal of skills and items.
>Tracking is hard because I have to do something other than BS
God you fucking babies are useless. Go back to DaS1 where everything is completely shut down by moving to the left or right.
>The only way you can get truly RNG screwed is if a character gets crit dog piled at the beginning of a fight, and that is absurdly rare
>Everything else can be managed easily enough if your party setup isn't utterly retarded
>Scrubs complaining about how RNG dependent this game is
Truly repulsive. Also a protip to the new players: don't fuck with the curios besides bags and boxes unless you have the proper item to neutralize it. It's almost never worth it otherwise and your characters will get fucking stacked with bad traits and stress.
STARCRAFT = REAL
RNGSTONE = ARTIFICIAL
In DnD you can literally do anything, how can you even compare that to a videogame with strict limits?
Need kill the leader of the bandits? You could wait for the night, sneaking in their camp and making use of the veil of the night to make the kill, or you could disguise yourself as a bandit, get in and wait for the right moment to strike with horses ready for your escape, you could put fire to the camp, and wait until he gets out to kill him, the possibilities are endless. And you can prepare all you want, put traps, ask the guards for help, buy mercenaries to help.
There is simply no way this game can be compared to the depth DnD provides. Yes DnD uses dices, but the the game is strategically and tactically deep enough to offset the RNG.
Darkest dungeon relies mostly on numbers, that means going from 70% chance to hit to 75%, but that does not make the game any more deep, all it does it make it easier the more you progress. The consumables are not bad but there is a clear lack of them, most are only used for healing/removing debuffs.
A character can only use a bandage/antivenom on themselves. Blight/Bleed damage happens at the beginning of the characters turn AKA the antivenom meant nothing.
but Pedro is a big shitter for not healing me.
ITS A GAME OF FUCKING CHANCE YOU FUCKING AUTIST! THEY ARE THE SAME AS IN THEY RELY ON FUCKING RANDOM NUMBERS FOR OUTCOMES BUT YOU GET BETTER OUTCOMES AS YOU PROGRESS IN THEM! THAT WAS THE FUCKING ARGUMENT!
WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO SAY?!
This game actually made me pretty sad but its probably just because I'm a pansy
Campfire scenes are sad because party is helping each other out even though they're all probably going to die shortly anyway
Hag was scary and stressful for me because being boiled/eaten alive is a serious fear of mine
The pleads from my party members to help them didn't make me feel any better
Artificial is a stupid word to use. The word you all are thinking of is "cheap". Like when you make a turn in a hallway and there is a guy that killed you with a shotgun before you have time to react. Obviously you can try to plan out your moves, you don't know what is around every corner, but the fact that something you can't predict with in all previous gameplay knowledge in check, is cheap not artificial.
My point is that good games that relies on RNG also give have enough strategic depth for you to be able to offset the RNG, like DnD.
Darkest Dungeon does not possess that kind of depth, but still relies on RNG for everything.
I don't know how I can put this any simpler for you.
Hag was scary and stressful for me because being boiled/eaten alive is a serious fear of mine
Same here, I have no idea why its so awful but just thinking about it is the worst shit imaginable.
You cannot predict the difficulties ahead. (Heavy RNG, trial and error gameplay on your first run)
You can see what's gonna happen and prepare for it/ avoid it.
Artificial difficulty can still be fun, and there's nothing inherently wrong with it. I like rougelikes, and those things are RNG to the max sometimes. Still, you can improve your strategy and get better at them.
Official Tier list
>REAL MEN KILL WILBUR FIRST TIER
>LITTERALLY SATAN TIER
>Party getting fucked up
>One dies, three at deaths door
>They all survive and kill the Swine King
>Wilbur delivers a deathblow to all three with a 1 damage party-wide debuff
>My point is that good games that relies on RNG also give have enough strategic depth for you to be able to offset the RNG
please refer to >>284964819
and possibly shut the fuck afterwards
>You could have brought Antivenom
Refer to >>284965432
>You could have brought a Vestal
>You could have brought a Plague Doctor
You don't choose your party, you take what's given to you.
>You could have equipped death blow resist trinket
You don't choose what trinkets you have
>You could have brought retired from the battle and used food to heal
Valid, he could have done that, that mean he played bad and deserved to die. It's only artificial difficulty if he did all the right things and still died.
It doesn't necessarily make me sad but goddamn if it isn't a great dark fantasy setting.
>the change in music when your torch goes out ramping up the tenseness 100%
>the music change in the warrens especially with the fucking pig squeals
>blights does damage at the start of the turn
he had a vial and definitely could have used it before. he also allowed his crusader to go at low health so much
>You don't choose your party, you take what's given to you.
you fucking what?
>You don't choose what trinkets you have
Start over, and learn from you previous mistakes. Once your to poor to afford bare minimum provisions for a medium length dungeon. You're better off starting over. Basic provisions for a dungeon without a camp out is a least 12 food, 8 torches, and bring a shovel. I cannot count he number of times I should had bought ONE fucking shovel.
>implying I'll need anything else but Vestal Jester Hellion Hellion
V/J are swapable and entire lineup is capable of attacking at least something from any position.
Alternatively I've done double holy spear crusaders in the front. But If It Bleeds is just to retarded to give up as it murders literally every boss
That was one of my most favorite parts of the game
You open to that and then it just leads straight into the opening screen.
The music and just nothing but text set that tone right away
> flash game with JRPG combat and SICKDARK art style
> GOTY, let alone good
I don't know what's more pathetic, this game or the people who defend it.
Posts in DD threads are usually something like "Look how I got fucked over by RNG haha isn't this game soo hardcore". It's like that because beyond those events, there's nothing much to the game. It revolves around random chance: crits, how characters get quirks.
What is there beyond that? When RNG doesn't destroy you, the game really is a complete breeze. The system is simple and easy to understand and master, as far as the elements you have control over.
This is why I'll never understand the "git gud" crowd. The game doesn't present an engaging challenge. I'm quite sure everyone who stopped playing didn't do it because they weren't capable of continuing, but because they simply noticed all the game's shortcomings. Why continue to play a shallow, unrewarding game?
It's possible that I'm being too harsh on a game that's not even complete, but in order to change my opinion it would require more than just more content, but a whole reworking of the mechanics.
tl;dr Game is shallow, tries to compensate for it with RNG.
wagon for new heroes, blacksmith (armor), guild, blacksmith (weapons)
in that order
also look at the quirks that your heroes have and upgrade the parts of Taver/Abbey that would give you better stress relief
>you have to buy games to play them
If it grabs one of your only party members that can fucking do anything to the Hag and it's one of your valued party members that you don't want to lose then yeah people might go after the pot.
What pissed me off a lot was how she just grabbed whoever the fuck she wanted and I lost my bounty hunter because of that, haven't really played since as a result since I also started to see the stark lack of content at that point.
Early game upgrades will be to worry about your roster pool, from the wagon. I would also look into upgrading your abbey, and tavern to stress release. It will get costly when the stress mounts up too high.
You'll eventually figure out the rest from there.
Looking back at the raw video;
>Occultist/HWM moved to front.
>Occultist spends two turns at the front due to me miscalcing where everyone would be after swap/holylance/pointblank.
>Pally got hit with three groping swipe 7's, marked and gassed with escape cloud (over two turns, a lot of focus fire).
>Move him forward so the occultist can go back (and be able to heal again).
>Pally was still marked from earlier.
>The one heal Pedro makes during the fight and he heals for nothing.
So yeah, it was all completely avoidable if I got Pedro to the back lines sooner. He ended up killing my other friend with a clutch 0HP heal a few dungeons later.
I was also apparently unironically listening to Phil Collins.
>play darkness only
>sometiems think "Oh fukn rng gaem"
>get tons of crits myself at 20~35% crit rate per person (and can get higher with jester)
>get rekt fukn scrub gaem
I was having fun with Vestal/Occultist/Bounty Hunter/Crusader for a bit, marking with the occultist and collecting bounty for 2x damage is pretty awesome.
Also, anybody who picks Leper over Crusader is a retard, enjoy your misses for days.
>Get hit by mass Crit.
>Just push exit.
>When I reopen the game it's even my turn again.
>shitting on my husbando
he will fuck you up
just give him a couple rounds to buff himself and he will fuck you up I swear
I would have said that "artificial" difficulty is just number padding.
So most FPS/RPG difficulty settings rarely come from the AI being smarter, or getting new abilities/functions...but just more HP/damage and/or YOU have less hp (or rarely less damage).
It just pads out how long fights takes and usually forces specific styles of play. So if only mage/warrior are valid on hard mode, rogue is either retarded or the difficulty nullifies it out in some unfair way.
But having difficulty that requires more mastery of controls/skill or require more planning isn't necessarily a bad thing.
I use ME2 as an example what I like and hate about difficulty. Enemies gained armor or shields that they didn't have before (or barriers later on) and used skills more often, some even just having them when they didnt before.
BUT this was also tied into difficulty basically meaning "how long you can have Shepard out of cover before you have to go back into cover to wait for shields". Always felt lame
Stupid ass, attack stress-based monsters first, those are always first priority if you dont want a party filled with lunatics.
>wasting turns to reposition while you have holy lance
Phil Collins's alright though
RNG doesn't get me booty bothered, because that's pretty much their central mechanic. I enjoy pretend-gambling, and hell in Dank of Fate I've gotten to the point where I can actually keep my eyes on the success cards during shuffling.
Ive enjoyed it a lot. It and DD have really just made the new year for me
Definitely for the price I paid, I got more than enough dollars to hours out of it.
unless you are really desperate for a game, I would wait to see how the DLC turn out. I think they said its like ~2months after release. So that should be soonish at least
But I would say pick it up either way
It's a good RPG, and it's highly absorbing. The start is really easy but it ramps up in difficulty fairly soon. Only problem is that by the end the game doesn't really have a whole lot up its sleeve, events start becoming rather dull and rehashed, and monsters just become damage sponges so you gotta wail on them all day like you're mining for silver.
I got 45+ hours of enjoyment out of it so I don't know
Needs an extra joke in the second panel (original had loss.jpg) and the door in the third panel needs to be a touch brighter. Detailing/coloring the keyhole in the final panel might help too, but otherwise gj.
It's just like the RNG shit in Xcom threads.
If you're not playing impossible you can always win whatever RNG throws at you. You just need to git gud. And roll with the losses when you can't.
You'll generally find more food in the dungeon especially for Warrens and Weald.
Real difficulty: The game was designed that way, regardless of whether or not it was a good design choice.
Artificial difficulty: Difficulty that arises from things unintended by the developers, such as buggy netcode, audio/visual lag from when HDTVs were first becoming prominent, or when code concerning separate parts of the game interact in ways unexpected by the devs.
RNG is not Artificial Difficulty. Its chance, and games of chance are not artificially difficult. Its fucking gambling.
You are categorizing gambling, and games of chance into artificial difficultly because buzzwords.
You're just a stupid nigger mate.
>early game having a good party is down to luck
early game the stardard party composition (Vestal/PD/HWM/Crusader) is perfectly suitable for most dungeon. No wonder some people stick to it till the end. You get other classes later gradually, so it's not "down to luck".
You truly do not know what you're talking about, have probably put 3 hours into the game and yet expect to have an opinion that's worth listening to.
>the game is so simple that playing it even one hour is plenty to understand it
ah ah ah oh wow
get a load of this literal faggot
please excise yourself from your trivial existance
>alright, this enemy has 35 dodge
>I'LL HIT HIM WITH MY LEPER WITH RABIES
You can guarantee damage, and you can guarantee first turn kills. It isn't random, you just haven't learned it yet.
So by your logic the game should completely remix the combat system at some point in progression? Because lategame combat and earlygame combat have completely different play out.
>3/4 party paranoid or fearful
>everyone near death's door
>Masochist Bounty Hunter
>doesn't even let me pick attacks
>doesn't back down
>1 hit KOs everything
no other class can achieve this level of based.
In gambling, you're aware of the odds of every situation. The casinos always state the rules. With games heavily utilizing the RNG, unless you have an intimate knowledge of the game's mechanics, you have no idea of the odds and often times the choices you make have little or no impact on the outcome of the game.
If you can significantly affect the outcome, it isn't random. I had a highwayman with 135% hit chance, he could literally not miss even if the most evasive enemy rolled full dodge. If you think you are a slave to the RNG, you very clearly don't know how to play the game.
how do you exect him to have an answer?
he played 1 hour and "extrapolated" what the rest of the game is going to be like
and rather than saying the the sensible thing like "this game's not for me, I don't like it" and move on, he's bent on trying to validate his misinformed opinion with bad examples and meaningless buzzwords
of course he's the right person to ask how to redesign late game combat
>you can't learn the mechanics, therefore its RNG
Yes you can? You learn every enemy type in one or two encounters with them. You learn weaknesses, you learn what attacks are effective, you learn trinkets. Poker doesn't become completely random simply because you are new to it.
Nah not a damage nerf. Maybe a rank restriction. It can hit any enemy in any rank from any rank.
Just as i was thinking this game could use something to capitalize on it's lovecraftian undertones.
People really don't get it if they expect to win every dungeon and have their perfect party of heroes come out unscathed. It's not a typical dungeon crawler in that regard. It's not about keeping your guys alive. It's about keeping them useful. It's about risk management and resource management.
I think people's problem is they get overly attached to characters and tend to see characters as an extension of themself and any failure on the part of the character is reflected upon themself. In Darkest Dungeon you're literally yourself and given charge of a bunch of mooks willing to risk their lives for a slice of what you have.
Actually I did give up on the game because I didn't like it, and that's why I'm here instead of playing it. You sound mad trying to paint me as unreasonable, like your sense of self worth is tied up in what people thing of this game. I never cared how to "redesign" the game, you guys are trying to band together in support of your game being criticized by dismissing me, which is fine but comes across as pathetic especially if you are inventing things about me trying to demonize your made-up opponent.
+1 like, upvoted and subscribed
i agree that leper can be strong, and his accuracy problem can be easily offset with camping and the right trinkets.
but my true problem is: why are there so few +acc trinkets, and the few that exist don´t do enough or often have a negativ stat that is too important.
but well lategame who cares, you have the money, you have the items.
the real struggle is: leper can do nothing in the backrow, and doesn´t have anything to charge forward.
get surprised and he is at backspot 4 and you are getting fucked.
on a sidenote: anyone agrees that they should raise the debuff chance?
the -20 dodge from mark would be huge, but it rarely works - even with +debuff trinkets.
You gave up after an hour, patted yourself on the back, and are now attempting to rationalize it to people who like it by making up reasons.
Seriously, if you think the entire game is the same as the first hour, you are stupid.
But Anon, you can't loose with Helion-chan, you retarded fucking mongoloid.
The stupidly low debuff chance has fucked the Occultist completely, especially curse of weakness.
Leper is still better than Crusader because of a mix of his insane speed and damage. Use focus if you are against really evasive enemies.
>Actually I did give up on the game because I didn't like it, and that's why I'm here instead of playing it
/v/: the post
we're done here
>You gave up after an hour
You'd say the same thing if I played an extra 20 hours and still didn't like it.
The game doesn't change, its 4 guys with stats slapping the enemies' stats grinding for gold. That's fundamentally the same, no matter how much you pretend it's different.
>Buff debuff chance
Holy hell yes, I thought I was the only one. I can land marks all the time with occultist but I have yet to land a debuff AT ALL with with his spells.
>its 4 guys with stats slapping the enemies' stats grinding for gold. That's fundamentally the same, no matter how much you pretend it's different.
Literally every TBS RPG. Good observation, Jim.
It's the only fight in the entire game that shows the lengths that you, the player and the heir to the hamlet, are willing to push your hired help both physically and mentally in order to claim your birthright. It's definitely an interesting fight thematically.
ITT: people being new
>ACC base: 80
>CRIT mod: 10%
>Self: (Monster Type Eldritch) +15% DMG
Wouldn't you do this if your employer ensured free booze, whores, gambling, and faith based comfort? Also free medical and food. Getting boiled alive is nothing compaired to the endless pussy, cards and drink smorgasbord that awaits you in town
Quirks and trinkets that increase the amount of food you eat will also raise the food needed to feast while camping, so I imagine it's safe to say that the inverse is true as well.
This so much. Tactical games with perma death will never be widely popular or acknowledged exactly because most people get more enjoyment out of getting attached to their characters and their growth and antics through the game as opposed to enjoying the actual fucking progress they make in the game i.e. saving town and clearing dungeons with a bunch of random generated mooks.
In vidya industry as it is now people feel entitled to everything and anything they've spent even a second of their time on to be permanent or refundable.
It is. For awhile I had my whole team wearing bloodthirst rings and so long as you had a stack of food in the inventory, you couldn't starve and it would never deplete. For a feast at camp though, It was always 2 food no matter what.
>early game the stardard party composition (Vestal/PD/HWM/Crusader) is perfectly suitable for most dungeon.
PD sucks outside of the ruins. The Weald and The Warrens both being blight themed really shoots her in the foot.
Image if a reviewer said that he played any game for an hour only but it doesn't matter because he has it figured it out already.
That would be so dumb, right?
Thank god you're not THAT stupid, right?
My PD is unbelievably useful, even in the Wield where evrything is blighted.
Those ancestral trinkets man, I was building up blight on BLIGHTED GIANTS. Also pigs aren't particularly resistant to blight. Even the Wretch is only at 45%
PD is my waifu.
Well, that's still only 3 of the 5 dungeons planned and who the fuck knows what is gonna go down in the Darkest Dungeon so you can write PD off just yet. I just hope they give her some decent +% chance of blights without shitty drawbacks. That and make blight/bleed scale with damage.
not really, because she still shines as healer against those pesky blight enemies such as spiders and carrion eaters.
PD is perfectly viable.
I managed to have my hellion consistently bleed fucking skeletons. Nothing is impossible. With two heretical flasks, the PD can blight damn near anything fairly often. Seriously, the damage stacks gets crazy.
i just got tired of how grindy it was. takes too long to get to a point where you can get level 1 characters to reliably survive, be able to buy items for exploring dungeons, AND buy trinkets
Ironically, Med dungeons are better than short in earlygame. Otherwise, you spend too much money on stress relief.
Also, I reccomend just sending off guys who are way too stressed earlygame.
>Fight a bunch of skellies
>Pretend to get "irrational" by spouting random stuff at party members and being a lazy useless dick in general
>Get a fucking WEEK off in a fucking BROTHEL all paid for
>Skip the town with new acquaintances for another week without ever reporting the leave
>"Misplace" some wacky ancient relics along the way to keep the cash flowing
>Stay for another week because fuck the police
>Return back and pretend that nothing happened
>Works every fucking time without getting as much as a warning
No shit. That's some fucking first world working terms as opposed to literally every other game.
Occultist and 3 Hellions.
>super strong heals
>Hellions can purge the bleed it inflicts with their buff
>can hit from all three spots to all enemy spots, can inflict bleed, and deal high damage overall
FTL is the epitome of bullshit because it read's your ships equipment, and specifically tailors future encounters to fuck you over.
>Slowly building my way to a loadout thats pure oxygen depirvation+fire weapons
>Cant do shit to AI controller ships but whatever, only fought a few of them
>Put in my last piece of equipment
>Suddenly, the only things I encounter for 12 encounters straight is AI controlled ships
>Can't do a single thing to them but run away
Once you notice this shit the game becomes a whole lot less fun
>misplace an ancestral relic
That's "Sent solo against the swine god" material. That's "Never get healed again" territory.
Entire weeks off is pretty luxurious though. I mean seven days of boozing, whoring, gambling or getting whipped in a BDSM dungeon is great.
Don't worry about trinkets until you've gotten some ranks in armour. Upgrading armour not only makes them harder to kill, but it raises their dodge, making them harder to hit in the first place. Once you've upgraded the meat wagon to a comfortable level, go to the weald so that you can get the deeds the blacksmith needs faster. Upgrading stress is a nice luxury, but the economy is extremely tight in the first few weeks and it's likely more cost effective to run suicide squads into the dungeons and fire any rookies who break down.
Most good TBS RPGs have things like an Y axis to think about
This is your generic JRPG combat except RNG fucks you through stress instead of instant death (not that random instant death doesn't happen)
That slot the PD is taking could go to my main man the Bounty Hunter. Only thing better then a soldier critting for over 70 damage is two soldiers critting for over 70 damage.
Okay, so you make Finish Him only hit the front ranks.
So you just spend one extra round throwing out a GET OVER HERE and having your entire team beat the snot out of your target.
which class do you enjoy the most and which class do you rarely use?
is there anyone who plays bountyhunter without his mark buddy the occultist?
i really like the crusader against undead he is he best frontline char you could have.
hellion is great too.
leper needs the right team, if debuff would actually work a leper bh and occultist team would have absurd dps.
but since the -dodge never works i like to play him with a jester.
bounty hunter and plague doctor is also a good combo nevertheless the doctor is my least played character.
I have a bleed team task force for the Hag. PD's 2-3 damage Plague Bomb with a 4 damage DoT don't really compare to a 10-18 damage Bleed It Out with a 3 damage DoT - especially given that the Hellion has a higher crit rate and is easier to drag through the weald than the PD.
>double fucking damage attack all while other classes debuff themselves with half of their abilities
>a melee ability that hits from any fucking spot to any fucking spot with no damage penalty and actually has a damage increase on stunned targets
I only wonder why they bothered giving him that ranged hook throw. If BH isn't getting nerfed then i don't know what is.
That being said, i'll take PD over occultist in my back row any day of the week. Don't need your heal to give big numbers as long as it removes all bleeds and plagues. Also dots are fucking neat on big enemies.
PD is a support class. She has reliable backrow stunts, buffs and the best anti blight/bleed heal in the game. You don't play her for damage.
I adore the Leper. He has the best lines, the best trinket, a good self-buff camping skill, and he's incredibly resilient. Shame he has such a wide damage spread.
I hate the Graverobber. I don't trust dodge tanking, and her base damage is too low. Maybe once I get a pair of her ancestral trinkets she'll come into her own, but right now I can't rely on her to crit things often enough to kill things as quickly as her competition. 4 Graverobber teams are pretty fun, though.
>First they nerfed the Hellion
>Eventually the whining masses will get the BH nerfed
Not really, the BH need an occultbro to function, but once the big stuff is marked the occult is basically is a m'eh healer at best with debuff that never fuckign work jesus christ
Yeah, I meant if it bleeds. My bad. 5 damage per turn just can't compete with if it bleeds. I run the
jesterfor support in that bleed comp anyways, so I don't really need the utility she brings to the table so much as I need to DPS race the stupid hag down.
I was surprised to find out that PD is considered underpowered and is rarely used. I have a PD and vestal in most of my combinations. I've also been pondering the idea of making a party exclusively out of vestals. Otherwise i always have at least one BH/highwayman to buff surprise chance/scout. I never use leper or jester because they just don't sit right with me.
Any recommendations for Jester skill wise? Dragged one off the cart and I've been sending him into lvl 3 dungeons right off the bat. Anyone notice that Jester has the worst trinkets? His ancestral and rare trinkets have the same stats but are shit.
Jester desperately needs better trinkets. He's currently only really useful as a battle ballad bot. Maybe if Solo worked from more ranks or something.
Max out Battle Ballad ASAP. The extra crit and speed make sweeper teams extremely effective. He makes a great support for teams with lots of highwaymen and graverobbers, since they can help him get into position for his various skills, and he helps them shine with speed and crit boosts. Point Blank Shot crits are no joke.
The other bleed thing
The song that buffs your party
He's only really good at later levels
You could try to use the stress heal along with solo and dirk stab shenanigans but it's generally not as good. Just use the +20% bleed dice and go to town