>>285473523 For the record they pocket 5% of gross revenue (as opposed to profit) every quarter.
>>285473767 It's not really, except for the producing the art assets. Modern engines take care of most of the hard stuff for you.
>>285474034 Just using C++ does not make someone a skilled programmer. That are plenty of C++ projects on github and sourceforge with shit code. And you don't need to be a skilled programmer to use UE4 anyway since it is designed to be relatively easy to develop with.
>>285472696 >You have no fucking reason not to make a game. My reason is I'd rather spend my time right now just practicing a certain set of skills so I can find employment in the field, and in turn obtain business experience which I can then use to establish my own team, which I need for the kinds of game ideas I have.
>>285477428 believe in yourself anon, you don't have to make games for a living, but these days you can easily download books, and start studying, acquire some high culture, and it's proven that people who study become more intelligent
>>285477389 >not making a bullshit difficult game full of RNG, shitty hitboxes, and all around unfair mechanics designed to be as frustrating as possible and marketing as the most hardcore experience ever it's like you hate money
>>285477385 You don't need to be creative, just steal other people's ideas. Make a version of five nights at freddy's in a full 3d engine and make it suck less then the real one, bam, instant millions.
Licensing: >UE4 >5% of gross revenue per quarter after first $3000 >Unity >$1500 or $75 per month for pro version >You aren't allowed to use free version if you make $100,000 or more
Anybody know how Source 2 compares? Is Gaben based enough to be less of a jew?
>>285477734 Renpy has a good 2D GUI system so it is actually a decent engine for 2D games, especially menu driven ones. You don't have to use it exclusively for visual novels. I used it to make a porn organizer.
I'd need to find someone to do the programming for me. And then someone else for anything that doesn't include writing and drawing, which are the only skills I claim to have that are in any way useful in making a video game.
>>285479453 >man with the idea of what the final product is supposed to look like >doesn't deserve credit >should not steer the project towards that final product he envisions with his own hands
I'd understand if you said you dislike people who just throw ideas at the programmers, but saying the creator of a world and everything in it deserves no credit when it comes to life just makes you a complete idiot.
>>285473338 Unreal takes a royalty after a low price point Unity you need to buy for $1,500 after making $100,000+ Source you need to buy a license (not sure how much), and I think you also need to buy Havok's license of $25,000 (Source: https://partner.steamgames.com/documentation/source_games)
>>285480524 And any factory around the world would be nothing without workers. Doesn't mean they get paid more than the CEO whose only job is "to manage" i.e. sit around and delegate tasks that may or may not have been meant for him.
Life isn't fair. The programmers in one of Sony or whoever else's studios are probably not paid as much as region administrators, etc.
>>285480794 Photoshop did well with it's $10/month pricing, but 3DSMax's price still being $Thousands really makes it difficult for newcomers to game development, especially since so many things are set up exclusively for it. Blender is fine and all but when every game engine has "Use this plugin for Maya/3DS" for so much stuff it gets a bit frustrating.
>>285481660 Yeah, that's true, but it just boils down to how much of a lazy sack of shit you are. And also there used to be a paywall for UE, and Source requires a lot of work to make something interesting enough.
I'm a concept artist and I want to make a game but even shit like gamemaker is incredibly hard and tedious for me. Where do I find autists that are good at coding and have loads of spare time to team up with? All the programmers I know work on accounting software and don't want to code in their free time because they hate it.
>>285481439 A team of 2 doesn't need management. Don't even think a "marketing manager" (which was the guy's wife) is even worth 25%. Actually, looking at the paperwork the guy only offered 15%. 15% for making his entire web based business. Still not as bad as the guy that wanted me to make his mobile app for 25 dollars, lol.
>Unity Watered-down version is free. It's fucking nothing. Not open-source. >UE4 Open-source, but 5% of profits go to Id. Not free. The best of the three non-free options, but still not free. >Source 2 Free for content makers only. Probably not open source. Nobody gives a shit about Source 2, anyway.
>>285482085 Here's my warmup sketch for today. >>285482109 >>285482158 ok, will check it out. >>285482160 I'm working on a freelance job right now, but when it's done I really want to do some gamedesign. Even gamemaker is fine.
Coding is daunting as fuck, modeling takes artistic talent which I don't have, and I probably wouldn't know how to design a game anyways. On top of that I have no drive to even make a game, the closest I've tried is with a cheap text adventure maker for retards like me.
It's just that in large industry, this logic of "more work, more money" doesn't apply. Even as an "ideas man" as you've put me, I'd know, seeing as it's very common for people to offer me ridiculous payment for what they consider simple tasks, like making a fully colored cover with a very strict theme for the next goddamn week.
>>285482940 Because you know every single person on /v/ right? You individually met and talked to every single person and know each and everyone's goals and interests and personal thoughts? Are you God?
>>285481824 The $1,500 Unity licence is per user and kicks in when your company has a total gross revenue over 100K (not just from Unity projects). UE4 is 5% of the gross product revenue, unlimited users, independent of company revenue.
If you have 10 people working on a game, and it hits 100K in sales, Unity want 15K (1.5 x 10) and UE4 wants 5K (100 x 0.05). If you hit a 100K kickstarter, Unity wants you to pay for pro immediately, UE4 wants you to pay 5% of the backing donations that result in getting a UE4 product (and only the portion that give access to the proudct - IE: "10 for the game" and someone kickstarts $20, you only pay royalties on the $10 that got them the game).
Different schemes, so make sure you understand them before making any decisions.
>>285483140 Oh, no, I just know that /v/ is a bunch of nobodies who will all either die from being too much of a fatass or are either depressed and will kill themselves in five years. There is nothing redeemable here.
>>285472696 Fuck off. The skd is free, in the same way that source 1 is free. But try to sell the game and you gonna pay valve part of your revenue. So sell agem on steam, make on their engine and 50% of money goes to valves. Such a fucking great deal eh ?
>>285482910 >How did you learn to utilize values so well? Pure experimentation? Lots of studying and learning, I draw all day erry day and I try to break down shapes of things I see until I understand them. I'm still not nearly as good as I want to be yet.
I went to fine arts university for a year and in that fucking year all we did was learn to glue macaroni pictures and splash color on canvas (not kidding or overexaggerating here), so that was a waste of time. Now I'm freelance. But I really want to do something on my own, that isn't following the vision of someone else.
>>285483503 >not becoming a based dev that ignores this crowd
Keep in mind that being ignored is their greatest weakness. If you just make your games and block them from your twitter for talking shit, you've got nothing to worry about and, in fact, will gain sympathy from a lot of other people for it.
>>285482960 >do you do any enviornment art? Yeah. I'm not nearly as good at it as I want to be. I'm studying some german romanticism like Caspar David Friedrich at the moment, because I wanted to make a sidescroller with that kind of look to it. But like I said, even gamemaker is confusing me already.
>>285483282 Is that math right? If you take the percentage of the cost of the engine from $100,000 in profits that's 0.015% where as 5% $100,000 of profits that correspond directly from game revenues would equaling around $5,000 and that's not taking into account that the amount is perpetually increasing because it will be 5% of lifetime sales PER game whereas Unity Pro is a team license and applies to the seat rather the product.
>>285481992 Hey, if you're still here I'm an autist coder/musician working on a game for the past couple months. I've got a playable alpha and everything if you want to check it out, should I post it in the thread? It's a platformer that's basically a mix between original Spelunky and Cave Story. Art is my worst skill by far (most of the graphics ingame are in the public domain) and I can always use more, even if it's conceptual.
So I take it you are into procedural rouglikes? Because I tried to read up on a few tutorials on how to do that with gamemaker and it was too much information for me to just learn it in my spare time. (Which I use mostly for improving my art skills)
>>285477385 Alright, judging from your avatar I guess you play 2hou.
So how about a fanmade danmaku figthing game, one that plays just like the regular 2hou game with characters each having a pretty big choice when it comes to spell cards, you've got to dodge his attacks then counter with yours.
Of course normal shots are still possible and have to be dodged cause they can kill too.
Just reuse assets from all Touhou games, change the programming a bit and you're set.
>>285482376 >>285483172 This, it's a hell of a great deal. Even if you eventually make a shitload of money from it, 5% of the gains to the people who made the platform you are working on is like nothing. In fact I'll have to read every bit of the terms of service because it sounds too good to be real.
Can't program. Can 3D model very, very badly, but can't animate or texture worth shit. Can draw very, very badly. Passable writer, but nowhere near a professional level. Untested (probably nonexistent) game design skills.
Yes I can totally make a game all by myself. /s God I wish I could though.
>>285485642 >Find some weeb fetish that's popular on /v/ >Steal a bunch of assets from the unity store >Slap together some code you found on the internet and pretend like you're making progress >Start a patreon and sit back as people from /v/ and leddit start through their autismbux at you
Downloading Unreal Engine 4 right now actually. The only engine I really know is Source and it's sucks so bad to work with. Can't wait to get into Unreal. Never used it before so it should be fun learning again.
>>285485443 Well, it's not really a roguelike/lite. While I find games like those fun, I really value good level design and making a system to generate "good levels" is such a total bitch that I'd rather not even deal with it. In a game like mine with base mechanics like a Mega Man X game, good level design is of top priority and I don't want to fuck it up.
How the game is set up now is there's multiple characters with different movesets and they can take different paths through the levels. So there is a linear progression of four levels, boss, but the path you take between the first and the boss can vary depending on who you are playing as and which routes you take. That way I can make the game more varied and not have to worry about bad level design.
>>285485654 Probably one of their ebin trolls to say his math was wrong. Because acting retarded is just so funny right. Reminds me of that picture of the guy in the wheelchair and the other guy says fuck off retard then the last panel is "haha success! I was only pretending to be retarded!" I don't understand what it achieves and will never understand why people do this.
>>285486107 You're right it does sound too good to be true and that's because if you put it on Steam Valve takes %30 of the profits per game sold. And if you think you can do better then good luck releasing your game on PC without the support of Steam faggot!
>>285484761 Unity is $1500 per user (not seat, minor difference) when the total company revenue goes over 100K/YEAR (compared to quarterly royalties for UE4) So yes, for a single dev that's a 1.5% once-off for Unity compared to 5% for UE4, and UE4 royalties do continue at 5% until the product falls below 3k/quarter gross.
One minor thing to note is that I can't tell if the Unity Pro licence extends to future versions. IE: you may have to pay again for Unity 6.
Unity 5 free + Free or a flat fee + Much ower costs after you release a successful product
- Source code and access to beta versions aren't free - Free version isn't for schools or any commercial entity making $100k+ a year - Additional features cost you or force you to get a pro license - $900 a year x number of employees for pro version
Unreal 4 + One version with 2 license options (5% royality or custom) + No subcription charges or locked down features + Source Code Access + Access to beta/Github builds + 5% royality is only for games, contracting, arch vis, video production, etc are all royality free. + Possible grant fund
- 5% Royalities can cost way more than $75 a month.
So lets look at costs
- If you are doing a solo project, not a business entity, or haven't made $100,000 last year, Unity is pretty much free unless you need the extra features. Unity wins if you are happy with the pro and cons.
- If you are a small 2-5 team that did make a successful game last year that made over $100,000 or needs source code access and other pro features, and you are making a game expecting to sell exactly $100,000. For UE4: $100,000 -$12,000 (first $3000 each quarter doesn't count) $88,000 x.05 = $4400 goes to Epic. With Unity, you are just paying $900 a year x number of employees, so at 5 team members Unity is more expensive at $4500, any smaller teams will be cheaper with Unity. But in this senario, the less you make below $100k, the better the royalties go in UE4's favor. And the more the game games, the better in Unity's favor it goes.
So I see UE4 as the better option if you want all the features without spending money during dev. But if you are just looking at getting the biggest profit, Unity wins out there.
UE4 is a bit more artist friendly and I like what they are doing with their support and community management.
>>285486881 I'm working on an online portfolio, so I can do more stuff than just work on local projects. I guess I'll just link to it in that amateur dev thread over at /vg/ when I'm ready to enter the world of game development. I don't feel comfortable sharing my skype on 4chan just yet.
>want to make a tough-as-nails combat 3D platformer with bright colored graphics inspired by Wind Waker and current first party Nintendo titles >can't model >can't rig >can't program >too stupid for anything that isn't just drawing and pixelling
And on top of that I can't animate which is unfortunate. I really need to practice everything more. I just wanna make a cool game that's a little Monster Hunter/Demon Souls-y for kids, y'know?
>>285487185 Not a problem, I've never been in the /vg/ gamedev threads but I'll keep an eye out for you. Thanks dude. >>285487247 Hey dude, love your art! I really like the color choice in particular. If you're interested in doing some spriting stuff for a game I have a project that might interest you. >>285484863 >>285486338
>>285474034 >>285473523 >C++ is a horrible language. It's made more horrible by the fact that a lot of substandard programmers use it, to the point where it's much much easier to generate total and utter crap with it. Quite frankly, even if the choice of C were to do *nothing* but keep the C++ programmers out, that in itself would be a huge reason to use C. >In other words: the choice of C is the only sane choice. I know Miles Bader jokingly said "to piss you off", but it's actually true. I've come to the conclusion that any programmer that would prefer the project to be in C++ over C is likely a programmer that I really *would* prefer to piss off, so that he doesn't come and screw up any project I'm involved with. >C++ leads to really really bad design choices. You invariably start using the "nice" library features of the language like STL and Boost and other total and utter crap, that may "help" you program, but causes: >- infinite amounts of pain when they don't work (and anybody who tells me that STL and especially Boost are stable and portable is just so full of BS that it's not even funny) >- inefficient abstracted programming models where two years down the road you notice that some abstraction wasn't very efficient, but now all your code depends on all the nice object models around it, and you cannot fix it without rewriting your app. >In other words, the only way to do good, efficient, and system-level and portable C++ ends up to limit yourself to all the things that are basically available in C. And limiting your project to C means that people don't screw that up, and also means that you get a lot of programmers that do actually understand low-level issues and don't screw things up with any idiotic "object model" crap.
>>285487620 The people on polycount use UE4 for portfolios they import everything as static meshes so they don't have to deal with all the inane bullshit that UE4 requires for file types,characters, physics objects, animations, etc. Unity you just drop it in and just werks, but it was limited by the free version having shit shadows and no good effects.
However, seeing that Unity5 is now free and unlocked for everyone and has global illumination and physically based rendering out of the box that may change things.
>>285482376 >Watered-down version is free. Not anymore. Unity 5 personal has all engine features of Unity 4 pro. All you get with Unity 5 pro is cloud tools, analytics, and the license to sell your game if you make more than $100,000 a year.
>>285483816 Thanks for the reply anon. I think one of the best ways to tell the quality level of a visual artist is to assess their grasp of value, and as anyone can see you've got that stuff figured out really fucking well already.
I've another question if you're still there. Assuming you're using photoshop, do you often rely on the liquify tool to even out small misshapes, mistakes in proportion, etc? I'm curious as to how many artists actually use that great tool. Also, just as a point of intrigue; how old are you anyway?
>>285487506 >What are you planning to use as an engine? No you misunderstand, I can't program for shit. Just drawing/pixels a little. Your game sounds cool, Gargoyle's quest is real fuckin' baller. If you're looking for an artist I'd be up to collaborate if you don't mind slow progress since I'm working on something else at the moment.
>>285487719 Your project sounds really cool (Good choice on using the OPP assets, they're fantastic as placeholders), if you're looking for something minimal I might be up for collaboration in the future if you don't have an artist by then!
>>285488540 Haha, you've got a good eye. I did use the OPP stuff, although personally I'm finding the palette a bit restrictive so I think I'm going to rehaul a bunch of my art soon. I'd love to try working with you in the future, do you have somewhere I can contact you? I could post my soundcloud if you aren't comfortable posting it here.
All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective parties. Images uploaded are the responsibility of the Poster. Comments are owned by the Poster.
This is a 4chan archive - all of the content originated from them. If you need IP information for a Poster - you need to contact them. This website shows only archived content.
If a post contains personal/copyrighted/illegal content you can contact me at firstname.lastname@example.org with that post and thread number and it will be removed as soon as possible.