>Rang the bells
>still have no idea what the plot or backstory to any of the game is
Is there at any point in time someone who just sits my character down and says "okay this is what is happening. This is the backstory to those bosses you killed. This is how we fix the world". Or do I have to piece everything together? I just want the basics. Demon's told me everything I needed to know in about 10 minutes.
No one ever sits you down and explains the story.
All you've got to go on are the intro video, item descriptions, and what you can piece together from what various NPCs tell you.
it's best to just enjoy the game and not worry too much about the lore
The guy in Firelink Shrine at the very beginning gave you a vague description of why you had to ring the bells. Keep playing, pay attention, and if you still need help after you beat it just look it up
No they won't tell you at all. But it does have an amazing story behind it when you read item, weapon, and armor description. Then piece it together.
I like it more that way makes you think more
You've got the backstory in the cinematic intro. The rest can be learned from item descriptions and NPC dialogues.
The plot of the game itself is rather simple. You ring the bells, kill gods and go to the first kiln to decide the fate of the world. The end.
Dark souls is one of my favorite game and i play tbs and 4x games most of my time. It's because it reminds me of old games, where story didn't matter to enjoy the game. And if you do want a story if you dig enough you'll find wonders
Basically the world goes through phases of light and dark, and the age of light is coming to a close and man is losing its power. They are all turning into undead rather than dying so the king created the undead asylum and sent people who turned undead to go "turn hollow" there in peace. There is a prophecy that an undead will leave the Undead Asylum and decide the fate of the world.
That is the premise to the story in a nutshell
>that FUCKING BRIGHTNESS
But the intro tells you everything
World was dark, fire came, but now the fire is dying and people start having this curse that turns them into zombies
The reason as to why you want to ring the bells is extremely vague. All there is is "ring the bells and the fate of the chosen undead will be known".
After you ring them you meet Frampt, who is the most important NPC story wise, he's the one who tells you everything.
>You've got the backstory in the cinematic intro.
Bunch of heroes killed a bunch of dragons. What does that have to do with the current world? Why is Lordran filled with zombies and monsters? Is the rest of the world like this? Who is reviving me when I die, is it Lord Gwyn?
>Why is Lordran filled with zombies and monsters?
They told you this as well, were you even listening? At the end of the Age of Fire humans got struck by the Undead Curse. Although, by itself it doesn't really do any harm, on the contrary, it basically makes you immortal. Some people simply go hollow after time, turning into mindless zombies.
>Is the rest of the world like this?
Most likely, yes. You meet NPCs who came to Lordran from distant lands, and they are undead as well.
>Who is reviving me when I die
You revive on your own. This is your innate human superpower as an Undead.
They killed Dragons, seem like bros to me.
Why am I fighting them anyways? How does that save the world?
Why am I robbing Artorias's grave and fighting his Wolf?
Do I have a beef with them or something?
Did you skip all the NPCs and item descriptions? Cause I'm getting that feeling from you.
>Why am I fighting them anyways? How does that save the world?
You need their lord souls to open the kiln of the first flame
>Why am I robbing Artorias's grave and fighting his Wolf?
You need the ring Artorias was given that allowed him to traverse the Abyss and Sif is protecting his master's grave. There is more to Artorias and why Sif is protecting his grave but I don't want to spoil it
That's nothing, OP!
At least in DaS1, the storyline isn't a bait and switch!
For the entirety of DaS2, I wanted to have my character sit down and explain to every NPC in the game
>I DON'T GIVE A FUCK ABOUT YOUR MISSING KING
>I DON'T GIVE A FUCK ABOUT THIS STUPID KINGDOM
>I DON'T GIVE A FUCK ABOUT THE SHRINE OF WINTER, NOR DO I CARE ABOUT THESE 4 ASSHOLES WITH THE LORD SOULS
>I AM HERE TO BREAK THE CURSE
>AND I AM SICK OF GETTING THE RUNAROUND FROM YOU PEOPLE
>EITHER TELL ME WHERE I CAN START LOOKING FOR A CURE, OR FUCK OFF GODDAMN
The game has great lore but it's super vague about why you should have the motivation to do any of this. I mean the guy at the beginning tells you about a prophecy in his family or some shit, and for all you as a player could know it doesn't really mean all too much.
>he doesn't talk to NPCs
Literally learn to use your eyes and ears. the game's OP, Oscar, and the Crestfallen Warrior have literally no other function but to dump exposition on you. Once you hit the Burg, the Undead Merchant says his piece too.
This isn't hard, OP
Well, of course you could potentially just sit together with Crestfallen Warrior at Firelink until you go both go hollow, but that wouldn't make for an exciting game, would it?
You're just a jolly undead who likes to get shit done. For better or worse, as long as the world doesn't stagnate.
OP, just to let you know, I'm going to assume from this point on that you're baiting me, and not clinically retarded, since that VERY SAME CINEMATIC explains all your questions
So how many here did actually piece together the lore and not just watch lore videos on youtube?
I spoiled a good bit of DaS1 myself with Youtube.
I vowed to never make the same mistake and had shitloads of fun piecing together the story of Bloodborne myself, and then talking about it with /v/ and /bbg/
I tried to do the same with DaS2, but unfortunately the lore and backstory of that game are kind of a mess, so it doesn't work as well
>tfw no PS3 so no DeS
Because you need their fucking souls.
Also, depending on your political preference, you might see those guys as evil tyrants, so they deserve to be killed just for that, their lord souls aside.
Holy hell you are retarded. The first flame is locked behind a door that can only be open with the lordvessel which need the lord souls to activate. Maybe instead of asking stupid questions you play the game, talk to NPCs, read item descriptions and maybe pay attention. This is not hard.
Well, Gwyn is dead and you get a piece of his soul from Seath, who went crazy.
You get the witch's soul from bed of chaos, the demon entity she became when she fucked up her magics.
As for Nito you can indeed wonder, he doesn't seem very different, but he was already an enigma. Maybe he just likes to kill stuff. Maybe he's just not a morning person.
>tfw no PS3 so no DeS
Not worth it to buy an entire console for the game, but anyway. Demon's is my favourite out of all of them. But the problem with Demon's is that the lore is even more obscure than Dark Souls if you really want to get into it, so there's a lot of speculation. I mean, you can run through the game knowing full-well what to do and the reason behind it, but there are so many questions that are left unfulfilled.
I really don't care.
Do you regularly watch him? What do you think of him? Have you heard the stuff about him being a plagiarist?
No, I wouldn't put much stock into Vaati's videos. His content oscillates between 2 extremes: painfully obvious stuff that you could easily find just by playing the game and not being a retard like >>315607330, and the other extreme is super-concentrated bullshit headcanon
Well, what word is there to use? He doesn't take off official work except for that one big fan theory book on Bloodborne. But he doesn't credit anyone in the community either. So yeah, it's not technically plagiarism but it's the best word for it. He is taking theories and not bothering to credit anyone for it. The community should make a bigger deal out of this than they do. At least it makes me happy I'm not a big part of the community, because it'd be infuriating to watch.
One day he's sure to find an answer ...
>noone is ever straightforward with you
>like as if you're getting keked
Maybe it wouldn't hold up in court but as far as reputation? Yeah that'd be proof someone was a thieving cunt.
It's not hard to say "I read on (wherever you read it) someone said they think...." blah blah blah.
>Go back to guy who told you to ring bells
>He refers you to another guy and dissappears
>This guy tells you to go through the pathway you just opened (you didn't miss it, did you?) and find someone past that
>That someone tells you to kill a bunch of dudes and go see the second guy again
>Do so, kill boss, win game
Everything you really need to know is said plain as day, everything else is supplementary.
Sadly, people have proven his plagiarism. One guy with a really long video too but it didn't do too much ... but what can you expect when Vaati's deep in everyone's pants in the community.
I find it funny that his channel took a HUGE hit to it's popularity because /v/ was too busy shitposting about BB's exclusivity to bother coming up with lore theories for him to steal. By the time /bbg/ got to work, ENB's playthrough had stolen all of his hype
I'm sure he's lurking on /vg/ or here right now, maybe our brethren over at le frontpage of le internet too, unless he's sleeping.
Why did you list two sets for BB? Crowfeather isn't even its signature armor set.
The DS3 "knight" set looks super sexy.
Because the Crowfeather set was used in BB's gameplay ads just as often as the Hunter Set -- they wanted to hype people up with the plague doctor outfit.
I should have thrown the Alva Set in for DaS2 as well, since I also count it as the game's originally-intended mascot armor. Just look at the emote figures. I would place it between the Fluted Set and Faraam Set on my list
Not everyone has the undead curse. Only some. Those who do are seen as subhuman and exiled for the most part. Some people, like Solaire, become undead on purpose then go to places like Lordran for whatever their purposes are.
It's called a video game you dick-loving faggot. You're supposed to PLAY video games. Why do you want so badly to have a story explained to you? So you feel special? Will it make you feel engaged if you have some idiot spewing a bunch of melodramatic nonsense at you for 40 hours? HOW ABOUT YOU JUST PLAY THE FUCKING GAME! Like how video games used to be. The game was fun and challenging, and you can immerse yourself in this world by just controlling a character. I swear, all these faggots nowadays want backstories with everything so they can feel self-important.
I started playing Duelyst recently and some of the first forum posts I saw were, "What's the lore in this game?" WHO GIVES A FUCK!? WHAT THE FUCK IT'S A CARD GAME! YOU PUT CARDS DOWN AND TRY AND BEAT SOMEONE ELSE! WHY THE FUCK DO YOU NEED TO KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE STORY!?
Christ, it's people like you and all these other story-driven faggots that are ruining video games. They're becoming less and less about gameplay and more about how a game makes you feel. Does it relate to you? Does it make you feel like a badass? Stop clinging to this stupid idea that a story will somehow make the game your playing more important or relevant. You're still doing the same thing. You're trying to overcome an obstacle. That's what VIDEO GAMES are.
It's implied the curse spreads like a plague (figuratively), thus the asylums. And by the time DS1 takes place probably the overwhelming majority of human population is affected. Lordran, the biggest settlement is completely deserted and hollowed.
Also I'm pretty sure one cannot possibly become undead on purpose. It just happens.
Did you skip the intro? It clearly tells you sent people are like that, what is happening in the game, and why you're in the asylum and why you device. Then Oscar fees you and tells you to ring the bells. Then when you do Frampt tells you to get the Lord Vessel and the princess tells you to collect the 4 lord Souls. Then when you do you are told what happened to Gwyn and given a choice at the end.
That's the basis anyway, the story is clearly there and in your face. If you want to dig deeper that's there too.
Actually it's more autistic to be interested in a simple 'save the world' or "fulfill your destiny' story than it is to just play a game and realize that, not only does that not matter, but it's also not what the medium was mainly created for. Do you go to movies because you want to listen to a good score? No, of course not. It can help a movie and also hurt it. But if you want to listen to music, listen to music. If you want to watch a movie, watch one. If you want an interesting story, there are so many books that can delve deeper into developing psychological profiles for characters, and relating information to the reader that truly matters, that a game can never accomplish. It's not the right medium. PLAY VIDEO GAMES FOR PLAYING A GAME YOU FUCKWIT
Solaire's line seems to imply you can. He says he became undead to continue his search.
Though it seems like most people don't know how. Laurentius and Logan are both very happy to become undead as they could finally search for ways to advance as a pyromancer/sorcerer
Video games are interactive media unlike movies, music, and books (except choose your own adventure books, which are the jam).
As interactive media, it would be foolish to ignore the storytelling possibilities. Video games for me, can invoke more emotional reactions than any movie could because while I'm immersed and playing a game part of me IS the main character.
>video game has story (no matter how badly you don't want them to have story)
>some people like to know the story of whatever they are playing (not you)
>get incredibly angry at other people for that reason
Whats wrong with you?
He just says "now that I am undead". It only means that he's undead now and wasn't before, nothing more.
And Laurentius and Logan sounds like becoming undead was a lucky chance for them to go on adventures, not something they just achieved at will.
No he doesn't.
>Solaire of Astora is a Knight of Sunlight who will help the player in many different areas. He is a cheerful and powerful knight who does not let the crumbling world affect his mood. He speaks of willingly becoming an Undead so that he could search for his own sun.
But at no point are you ever given a reason as to why you should be doing any of that. Those are just the objectives the game gives you. The outcome of completing them and the reason behind doing them in the first place is never made clear, and the few hints they do give are so abstract that they're basically meaningless, especially for someone who's playing for the first time.
Compare it to Demon's Souls, where you immediately knew what was happening, what was at stake, and what you needed to do in order to stop it. The game is still hiding all of its lore and history in the world for you to find, there's still ambiguity in almost every area, but you're given a very clear and easily understood purpose for going out into the world in the first place.
>Video games for me, can invoke more emotional reactions than any movie could because while I'm immersed and playing a game part of me IS the main character.
That's fine. But don't force every game to live by that criteria. If a game is obviously trying to focus on doing one thing, then take for what it's trying to do. In Dark Souls, the focus of the game is obviously gameplay. So focus on the gameplay. Stop making up something that's lacking from a game that it's not intended to do. Especially concerning this. If anything, I think Dark Souls should have less story. It's pretty much put there to meet a status quo. If they just threw you in a game and it starts, without any explanation, it catch flack for not being engaging enough. Actually, that would be more engaging to me. As soon as a game starts long-winded exposition, is immediately when I stop caring about it. Story fags like you are winning and that's the problem. You can have games that focus on story. That's fine. But I want games that have absolutely no story. Just gameplay. Just start the fucking game and let me have fun playing it. It's not a hard concept to grasp.
>Compare it to Demon's Souls, where you immediately knew what was happening, what was at stake, and what you needed to do in order to stop it. The game is still hiding all of its lore and history in the world for you to find, there's still ambiguity in almost every area, but you're given a very clear and easily understood purpose for going out into the world in the first place.
That was my problem to.
>Ring some bells? Who cares? What does that have to do with anything.
don't know if I should make a new thread.
Want to restart Dark Souls. But the thing is, I'm always drawn to the boring but practical longsword. It's relatively light, has nice range, good damage and best of all has great animations. It's hard attack is a lunging attack, so it acts like a spear and can hit far away without getting too close. The double-handed attack has high and low vertical so it is nice for hitting enemies who are in the air or on the ground. Those mosquitos in Blight town for instance.
It just works so damn well. But should I switch to another main weapon?
They are challenges, if someone is capable of ringing them than they may be able to succeed gwyn and are could be considered to be a chosen undead. Oscar tells you about that prophecy at the start of the game, crestfallen expands on it a bit, and kaath/frampt both offer explanations in a way that paints the side they support as the better of the two
Oscar tells you to ring the bells. He doesn't tell you why you should care or what ringing the bells will even do. All he says is "When thou ringeth the Bell of Awakening, the fate of the Undead thou shalt know". So basically, you're ringing the bell so that you can find out why you rang the bell.
I wouldn't play a video game with no story at all. I see no point in it. Without context, why am I doing what I do in whatever game I'm playing?
If you can turn your brain off and have fun without any other stimulation that's nice, but don't expect that to ever be something most companies care about. Just mash buttons during the cut scenes and play with the audio off.
The world is decaying, and you're a cursed undead with no way to cure yourself. You want answers? They're that way, go get them.
Then you find your answers, and learn how to fix everything. Not seeing the problem here
>implying that polearms can't get meaty as fuck
Say that to my Lucerne's face, not online fucker, and see what happens.
I'm joking, because I already know what will happen.
>anon will take a big, lumbering retard swing with his 50+ overcompensating stick
>easily dodge because 40 dex
>cave his armor in because 28 STR 2handed from Lucerne
Playing it for the first time and I get the story I'd say. After the lordvessal souls right now. I just don't really get the age of fire/dark thing. And apparently the snake npc in the starting area is lying or something. I do get that I'm basically delaying the inevitable however.
oh my jesus go jerk off to 8bit retro games some more you hipster shitter.
>It's bad to have story in a ROLE PLAYING GAME
what the absolute fuck am I reading???
The story in DaS is ALREADY 100% skippable, you are literally complaining about nothing.
>I can't press start to skip cutscenes
that 50 STR means literally nothing, since I get the exact same scaling as your weapon with an effective 42 STR when 2handed, AND I have 40 DEX on top of it.
Stay mad that you chose to be a slow fucking fatty instead of having an appropriate balance of physical prowess
ironically almost every 8 bit game has a story in the manual and sometimes at the start and end of the game and one of the first games to use in game cutscenes was Ninja Gaiden.
I don't think there was ever a point in time where vidya didn't have stories, except maybe pong.
Bear in mind the only person saying you're being lied to is another serpent, one who wants the abyss to be spread even more, claiming it's for humanity's own good. You'll see in the oolacile section why that's not really a good thing for humanity either
And go play the shitty Dragon Age games with your transqueer acceptable story, you faggot. So tired of you bullshit story crybabies making video games about some niggerqueer seeking redemption for muh actions. I have to save this woman because she'll fake fall in love with me.
>snake NPC in firelink is lying to you
love this meme.
Frampt NEVER EVER lies to the player -- all the information that he gives you is correlated by Kaathe.
The only time he misleads you is when he fails to mention what Linking the Flame will do to you
Don't believe Frampt's lies, anon. He's a Gwyn's loyal servant, and the gods fear humans and try to hinder their rise to power in any way they can.
Oolacile angered Manus after a "toothy serpent's" advice, but which one is the question? Who would be interested in a home of powerful human sorcerers coming to ruin?
A god's lapdog or an honest and wise primordial being interested in restoring the flow of history to its natural course? Use your head, anon.
Kaathe is trying to get you to destroy civilization so that he and his serpent bros can hang out in the Abyss without having to worry about pesky sunlight. You can come too, I suppose.
Frampt is trying to trick you into burning yourself alive in the First Flame so that civilization may endure
Alright I think I got it. Big tits McGee is pretty much agreeing with Frampt, I think. So I was a bit confused when I heard snake bro is lying. Tits like that wouldn't lie to me, But it's actually snake bro #2 that's trying to pull some shit.
don't listen to
>>315613692, he's wrong
>implying that humans are powerful in the Age of Dark
do those bloatheads and humanity sprites look like they're enjoying themselves, anon?
The Age of Dark is the Dark Lord (aka the player) chilling with Serpents in the Abyss, while everything else is either dead or a shuffling hollow. And YOU, the Dark Lord, will hollow as well one day, all undead do, leaving just the Serpents to laugh at your gullibility
>this is what Darkwraiths actually believe
Can't wait to finish this game. I just completely forgot where the hell the other barrier was that opened. Doing some side shit trying to find it (last time i played I got to Wolf SIf)
I've beaten Dark Souls, watched the lore videos, and had my friend explain the intricacies of the story, and I'm STILL confused as hell as to whether Frampt or Kaathe is right.
There are 3 locations that the barriers open:
>one is down beneath the catacombs, which lie beyond the graveyard with the spooky scary skeletons, next to Firelink Shrine
>one is beyond Spiderlady's boss arena
>one is off to the left of the Anor Londo bonfire, the one that's attended by the lady in Brass Armor
>Not seeing the problem here
You can't see it because you're an idiot. The problem is that the game gives you objectives with neither context nor purpose as to why you should complete them. You're doing shit because you were told to, not because doing so actually benefits anything in anyway, at least not in anyway you could possibly understand at the start. You're told about the flames fading, but you're not told what that actually entails, what consequences that will bring to the world, or what ringing the bells has to to with any of the shit you saw in the opening video. You're given objectives and introduced to some important concepts early on, but have absolutely no incentive to care about any of it.
Your character in DaS is putting themselves through hell because if you ring the bells, and I'm fucking quoting here, "something happens."
Frampt is tricking you -- he's trying to get you to link the fire, but he doesn't see fit to tell you that doing so results in you burning alive and going hollow.
Kaathe is very up-front about being an asshole and wanting to ruin everything for everyone.
Who's goal you think is better is directly proportional to how hard of a nihilist you are
I should stop taking breaks playing this game. Other than the story it's such a great pick up and play game. Definitely going to give it a second run once I'm done.
>putting themselves through hell
they're already in hell by virtue of being undead. The point is that the goal itself doesn't matter, because sitting aimlessly on your ass is what makes you go hollow. You go and ring the bells simply because you don't have anything better to do, and just chilling at firelink is an unacceptable alternative. Did you ever even bother talking to the Crestfallen Warrior after his opening monologue?
AS YOU ONCE DID FOR THE VACUOUS ROM
GRANT US EYES
GRANT US EYES
PLANT EYES ON OUR BRAINS, TO CLEANSE US OF OUR BEASTLY IDIOCY
NOW I'M WAKING UP! I'LL FORGET EVERYTHING!
they are both right and both wrong.
in the end, either your and/or the worlds destruction is inevitable.
Personally, I like to be a dark lord and invade fucks, and not finish my first playthrough on my pvp character.
cant be a meme if its true.
>that light roll
>that heavy armor.
it really DOES sweep the floor against low poise scrubs.
>hear Drangleic is the place to go to break the curse
>hey can you you help me, I nee-
>ARE YOU THE NEXT MONARCH? OR MERELY A PAWN OF FATE
>SEEK THE KING
I DONT WANNA SEEK THE KING
JUST TELL ME WHERE I CAN GET A CURE REEEEEEEEEE
>Read up on celestial childs
I really have to play this game soon
My fighting spirit burns brighter with EVERY dumb fuck I backstab!
Burns bright with black swathes of humanity!
99 fucking humanity... I should really stop this shit. Its unhealthy
and then, even after you're committed to this pointless "seek the king" sidetrack, the game STILL fucks with you
>SEEK THE KING
>GO KILL THESE FOUR PRIMORDIAL BEINGS LOL
>spend 25 hours on first playthrough doing this
>K NOW HEAD TO DRANGLEIC CASTLE
>is the king home
>LOL NO HE'S NOT
>DO YOU SEEK THE KING???
>WE'LL HE'S THAT WAY FUCCBOI HAVE FUN
>NO I DON'T KNOW SPECIFICALLY WHERE
>get to Nashandra
>HELLO DO YOU SEEK THE KING
>WELL HE'S OVER THERE A BIT
>pass through the shrine of good times
>HELLO MY NAME IS AGDYNE
>DO YOU SEEK THE KING???????????????
>WELL HE'S OVER THERE
>herald: haha lol that's gonna be you one day
the plot of DaSII was so boring. it didn't help that it was presented the way it was.
I think it did story the best out of all the games.
I didn't get how all the different characters or factions fit in exactly but I got a good idea of what was happening.
I thought that the church was experimenting with evil alien shit and turning people into beasts in the process; and trying to summon one into the world.
It helps that there were levels like Old Yarnahm to add to the atmosphere and story building.
Each of the 3 main factions you hear about in the game (the Choir, the School of Mensis/ the Mensis, the Byrgenwyrth Scholars) are trying to ascend to become Great Ones, but each have their own plans for doing it:
>Scholars: hoard insight until you spontaneously ascend, as nature intended
>Church: use the transformative properties of the Old Blood and SCIENCE to turn people into Great Ones, as opposed to them becoming beasts
>Mensis: try to mimic the Hunters' ability to respawn, and portal back into the real world from the Nightmare in the form of a Great One via the Blood
Was the church trying to become great ones? I thought they were just trying to use the blood to become superhuman, hence the Church giants and white skinned clergy men.
I always thought Mensis guys were just obsessed with summoning a being into the world, to the point of caging kids' heads in cage helmets. Where did you get the confusing idea that they were trying to portal back and become a great one?
the church is led by the Choir, the Choir's goals are the Church's goals, regardless of whether or not the low-level clergy are privy to that (classified) knowledge. All the fucked-up church people that you see are a result of different experiments that the Choir was doing on people in pursuit of this goal (or they may just be different forms of beasts).
I will address the Mensis in future posts
then nashandra has the last piece of the fucking crown, and you ascend to your throne free of your curse.
>something an anonymous user pulled out his ass on 4chan is objectively better than the story B team slapped together.
honestly. B team fucking cant write fer shit
So we know that the Mensis were originally a part of the Choir, and that the Choir was formed when scholars from Byrgenwerth grew dissatisfied with Master Willem's methods, since they weren't producing results. They advocated for a more aggressive approach to ascending, using the Blood, but Willem obviously disapproved, so they fucked off and made their own chuch with blackjack and hookers.
Furthermore, Micolash explicitly states that the Mensis are trying to get Kos/Kosm to "grant them eyes" -- and in the context of BB, "planting eyes on our brains" is a prayer to be granted ascendance. Their plans obviously go far beyond a mere summoning. The summoning is just a means to an end. But that leaves the question: what EXACTLY is it they're trying to do? How does the One Reborn fit into all this, and how are they planning to ascend?
it's not really their fault. Namco forced them to start over from scratch, between 1/2 and 3/4 through DaS2's development time, and didn't push back the release date to compensate. So if the story seems cobbled together at the last second, that's because it was, and not by choice, either
I love this gif because I like to imagine Ornstein keeps thinking about it everytime this guy went back to fight him
THINGS WE KNOW FOR CERTAIN:
>the Mensis is trying to summon the Moon Presence (MP)
>they are doing so with Mergo, the baby in the Nightmare, since the Great Ones have SUCH A LUST FOR SURROGATE CHILDREN
>this property holds for ALL great ones
>the Mensis has rogue Pthumerians working for them as summoners
>the respawning mobs in Yahargul spawn in through puddles of Blood on the floor, and explode into Blood when they die
THINGS THAT IT'S SAFE TO ASSUME
>Oedon, the formless Great One whose essence is blood, seems to have an especially intimate connection to the Old Blood, which is why it, out of all possible blood, uniquely has magic powers
>Mergo is Yharnam's child
>Yharnam didn't give them her child willingly -- observe that her hands are bound, she's weeping in front of Mergo's Wet Nurse's boss arena, the Shadows of Yharnam that guard her are hostile to the Nightmare mobs, and the Pthumerians that work for the Mensis are supposedly insane
Here is my pet theory. Note that it's basically all conjecture, because the game tells you almost literally nothing about the Mensis' plot. I hope that it makes sense nonetheless
>we know from the description of Ritual Blood that "when all is melted in Blood, all is Reborn"
>we know that the Mensis was kidnapping and sacrificing people
>we know that when the Moon drops, the Great Ones go into heat, and the scourge of Beasts explodes in severity at the same time
>we know that the Mensis is trying to summon the Moon
>we know that the hunters were around when the Choir came into existence
This all adds up to the following idea: the Mensis observed that Hunters can respawn, and decided to split off from the Choir to pursue this line of research. They kidnap people and sacrifice to get raw people materials. They portal their minds into the Nightmare using vats of the Old Blood like the one THAT FUNCTIONS AS A TELEPORTER IN YARHARGUL. continued
So the rogue Pthumerians that are still in Yharnam start practicing the blood summon rituals, and it seems like they can actually summon people back from the Nightmare successfully, but the Blood ISN'T powerful enough to summon them back as great ones.
How to make the Blood more powerful? We know that every time Oedon goes into heat, the Blood whips up into a frenzy, and huge parts of the town fall to beasthood because of it. So, the Mensis plans on baiting the Moon to drop by taking charge of Mergo, so that the Blood gets powerful enough to transform them when they summon back in.
>b-but that would mean that the town falls to beasthood in the process!
like they give a fuck. THIS is why there's such an overwhelming scourge after you kill Rom -- you've eliminated the last barrier to their success, by getting rid of the entity that was disguising their rituals from the world. Note that the Moon drops IMMEDIATELY after you kill it, as soon as it hears Mergo's crying.
Obviously, their ritual fails, and the One Reborn doesn't come out as intended, but it's the thought that counts, I suppose.
>taking ds2 as canon
But here it goes
>Once there were only gray dragons and all that other gray shit
>for guys found the great souls
>witch of chaos fire/life
>manus dark soul
>the Gwynn and the witch along with Seath rule over
>nito and manus do their own things
>as the fire fades people start turning undead and hollow
>the witch tries to recreate the first flame
>doesn't end well and demons are born
>Gwynn sets himself on fire and rekindles the flame
>for a time the curse gone
>the first flame is dying out again
>frampt is searching for more people to set on fire
>the other one makes the people of oolacile dig up manus
>he is pissed and spreads the abyss
>he is stopped by you but arterial gets the credit
>the serpant now gives life drain to the people of new londo
>now abyss is spreading there
>it gets flooded
>shit is fucked
>Oscar rescues you
>the game stars here
This is basically it for the backstory without going in all the side shit like the four knights, church of white, ...
Some snake and daughter of sunlight is manipulating unfortunate undead travellers into killing the Lord of Sunlight in order to extend the age of fire.
You happened to be most successfull of these undeads and they gave you Lordvessel in order to collect souls from former comrades of the sunlight.
That's pretty much it. Darkness is related to human soul
being a dragon
Ruling over our endless landscape of grey water, and grey trees!
We've even got this skull! The hell is I know where it came from!
This really is the high life!
except for Seath!
I choose to believe that the theme of DS2 is forgetting. You go through so much shit just to sit down and ask yourself why the fuck you need the throne or to be monarch. It pairs nicely with all the NPCs whose questlines end with them forgetting their own goals, and the overarching theme of all the forgotten kingdoms they keep mentioning.
Humans are hollowing not because the Age of Dark is coming, but because it DIDN'T come when it was due. Because of Gwyn's tampering with the First Flame.
Gods were so afraid of humans Gwyn sacrificed himself in order to place a curse on the whole humanity.
To rekindle the flame the Chosen Undead needs to collect the Lord Souls. Gwyn did it without them. How do you ask? By feeding the Dark Soul to the Flame.
Humanity which is still inside the undead humans is being used to unnaturally prolong the Age of Fire. Just like the player uses humanity to kindle bonfires, but on a global scale.
Humans live not thanks to the Age of Fire but in spite of it.
Did anybody else not pick up SHIT from the story even after multiple playthroughs? I dunno, I guess I don't retain information well. I had the basics but I could never put 2 and 2 together.
I guess it's just my playstyle, I'm too immersed in the game and trying to not die and build up my character to remember the story without it being spoonfed to me. Not saying this is a bad thing.
>humans are hollowing because the Age of Dark never came
except they were hollowing before Gwyn linked the flame in the first place, he gave his Soul Shards to the 4kings, rulers of an UNDEAD CITY, before departing to go light himself on fire
>gwyn placed a curse on humanity, not even as an implication
never anywhere does it state this
>gwyn fed the Dark Soul to the Flame
except Gwyn's soul description states that he fed himself to the flame. Gwyn has no humanity to feed the fire, and even if he did, you can't feed "the Dark Soul" to anything, since it's fragmented into a million different pieces. Nobody, not even the player during the Dark Lord ending, has all of it.
Step it up senpai
You sound exactly like those SJW types that not only think equal gender representation in video games should be expected, but should be mandatory.
Almost everything in the world is subjective. Not every, but almost everything.
>undead doesn't mean hollow
every single undead hollows eventually, it's only a question of time
Furthermore, hollow is the natural state of ALL life. Observe in the Opening Cinematic that the creatures that would once become the Lords are clearly beefjerky hollows, before they find souls within the flame.
With Fire comes the distinction between death and life. When the fire fades, this distinction erodes, and it begins with the creatures that are naturally closest to the dark. Human beings becoming undead and hollowing out is an inherent property of the fire fading, Gwyn has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with it
>every single undead hollows eventually, it's only a question of time
Says who? Frampt?
Hollowing is a natural state of unlife, lack of soul. And the Dark Soul doesn't just simply fade away, especially not when the Age of Dark is coming.
The Dark is as far from the primordial eternal twilight as the Light is. The coming of Dark is a natural process, just like the Age of Fire was. Gwyn denied the Dark its turn at the world, because he was too greedy to let it go. And that's exactly when humans, beings with unique Dark Souls started having troubles. It only happened after the Flame was rekindled and the natural course of history got disrupted.
It seems that the townspeople have accepted the fact that a side effect of using the Blood is the fact that beats show up occasionally. They just don't care, because apparently the Blood is addicting as fuck
>Says who? Frampt?
It's a point that is constantly stressed over both DaS1 AND DaS2, the only point of contention between the games is what exactly procs the onset of hollowing -- in DaS1, it's a lack of motivation, in DaS2, it supposedly happens when you hit 0 souls on your counter.
>hollowing means that the Dark Soul is fading
Wrong. It means that the Dark Souls is dramatically growing in strength. Death is an artifact of the Age of Fire -- Nito, Gwyn's associate, must consciously expend his own power to keep it running properly.
>the Dark is far from the eternal twilight as the light is
Agreed. It is the Abyss.
>Human beings only had problems when Gwyn linked the flame
>implying that humans only started becoming undead and hollowing after he linked the flame
I have already told you why this isn't true -- just look at New Londo
Humans going undead and hollowing is the Dark Soul operating as intended, it's natural as fuck
>I BET SEATH COULD EFFORTLESSLY 1V1 EVERY LAST ONE OF YOU SMUG LOSERS
but he didn't
this "moonlight greatsword" is real fancy btw
>Some of you dragons are alright. Don't go to the Kiln tomorrow
I believe they call it a plague, as a figure of speech. People do that all the time -- "a plague of shitposters," "a Plague of Shadows," "a plague of /pol/acks," etc.
actually that's part of the magic if you manage to play the game without looking stuff up online. you will play through the first time, and no question you will just be confused as fuck. in your second time through you will probably not only have more time to focus on more subtle things, it's also not unlikely you will meet some NPCs you haven't before or advance some questlines you haven't before, which may give you additional insight into the world.
it's not until you read all of the item descriptions however that you will really figure out whats going on.
maybe only if you're severely autistic
nigger you cant use math to explain what conscoiusness is. many matters are not simply black and white, thus you cant use black and white logic to quantify or explain them.
Doesn't stop people from trying. A hot idea in Philosophy is trying to expand on Turing's work and define consciousness as though you were attempting to program it into a computer
exactly op, all of that is the exact reason dark souls is such a unique experience. for all the shit dark souls gets, i think i speak for everyone when i say you'll have very few video game experiences like that first dark souls run. i honestly envy someone who hasnt played through it and knows very little about the story. something about being this confused little pygmy in this giant and overwhelming world, and your instincts as a lover of video games and challenges is the main thing pushing you through this world you first think to have very little story but eventually learn its all very expansive and interconnected its just so well done
The black knights were not some elite force, but silver knights who were burned black when Gwyn linked the fire. This is said in the item description.
How much else of this wall of text is fan fiction?
>Frampt is tricking you -- he's trying to get you to link the fire, but he doesn't see fit to tell you that doing so results in you burning alive and going hollow.
But his motivations are good. One person's sacrifice is worth it for humanity.
Yeah, but it's still a trick
He and Gwyndolin also trick Ornstein with an illusory Gwynevere, making him think that she was in danger, when in reality was set up to be murdered as part of a test
>The game has great lore but it's super vague about why you should have the motivation to do any of this.
It isn't, they tell you and show you in many instances that the undead who have no purpose inevitably go hollow. You are on a pilgrimage, sent by Oscar at the beginning, then lead by either of the primordial snakes at the end of it.
Basically you're just keeping yourself active so you don't go hollow and lose your mind.
meters and seconds are manmade UNITS, but the concepts of distance and time are decidedly not -- they would continue to govern the behavior of nature regardless of whether or not mankind was on this planet
>Dark Souls isn't actually that big. I have a full 3d map of the game imprinted in my brain and it doesn't need much memory.
It's just one city and surrounding areas above and below. And you don't visit most of the residential areas.
You know what would have been cool? Check this idea, /v/:
If you complete the DLC before the 4kings, the Kaathe would appear before you, even if you're following Frampt's orders. He would try and tempt you with the Abyss, trying to sucker you in with it's power, since you already had a taste of it.
Kaathe and Frampt would both get new dialogues trying to sell their positions to you, and the player would get a 2nd chance to decide which serpent to follow
light literally moves that fast regardless of frame of references. The number 3 for Zork, Emperor of the Great Urklrar space empire is the same 3 for timmy who fell down a well.
What people like about Darksouls though is that all the areas are interconnected cleanly. If you try hard enough you can see Blighttown's swamp from Firelink for example.
Then you have Dark Souls 2
Explain to me how distance and time aren't things that objectively exist -- if you died, RIGHT FUCKING NOW, even though your perception of such ideas would end, your friends and family would still have existences that are governed by these concepts
>even though your perception of such ideas would end, your friends and family would still have existences that are governed by these concepts
There's no evidence than anything outside of my own sense of existence would continue beyond death.
Why would it even matter? You get to choose what to do at the very end, speaking to the snakes is irrelevant.
What would be cool as fuck is if you could teabag Lord Gwyn's corpse after killing him.
Brume Tower was originally supposed to be in the base game. You were intended to reach the roof of Earthen Peak via ladder, and one of those giant chains would lead you from the roof to the entrance of Brume Tower's roof -- quite the walk, but doable. You would descend the tower, and the rear end of Fume Knight's boss arena was supposed to be the ground floor exit of the Tower, on the opposite side you came in from. You would then cross the lava plains that were in the trailers before finally reaching the Old Iron Keep.
This was cut because the amount of geometry that would have to be simultaneously loaded apparently made the ps3 and xbox360 explode
Yeah, so we can stand around calling each other faggots all day long over who's existence actually exists, and get nowhere, or we can acknowledge the idea that there are things that objectively exist all day long
Regardless, wouldn't this problem have been much less jarring if the lift simply went downwards instead? It still wouldn't have been all that realistic, but better that than sky lava.
Or would there have been an issue with the level geometry? I remember seeing geometry pics but I dunno if the Keep would've overlapped with the Peak area or something.
If we don't question every aspect of life including what we are told or see as laws of nature we would be no better than dirt. My personal philosophy is that the meaning of life is to seek knowledge as knowledge is what all experiences grant you no matter their nature. And we can gain no knowledge but simply sitting back and accepting what other people tell us.
Yeah but the lift does start from the top of the windmill, going down wouldn't necessarily mean you'd go entirely underground, just behind the windmill.
As it is now there's no way to even handwave the lift.
Perhaps people are approaching this the wrong way, assuming the level designers were oblivious to the incoherent arrangement of the levels, when they could have done it specifically to unsettle the player.
This isn't about not questioning things, you goof
You are incapable of proving that my existence actually exists
I am incapable of proving that your existence actually exists
Yet from our respective perspectives, our own existences CLEARLY exist
Therefore we have a paradox. I am proposing a set of axioms, which differ from yours -- namely, that allow for thing to exist outside our own perception -- that removes the paradox
Until you get someone else who claims that they can corroborate the measurement, with a value that looks right from THEIR perspective
Hence, you run into this dilemma:
One can assume that as we cannot perceive things outside our own existence that all things within it are a product thereof. And so, any corroboration is meaningless.
>assuming the level designers were oblivious to the incoherent arrangement of the levels
There's no way they were oblivious to it, I just wonder whether they didn't care about it or
>they could have done it specifically to unsettle the player
more or less this.
Honestly the whole deal doesn't really bother me, but it is pretty funny to think about, and if their intention was to unsettle me they didn't do a very good job.
And you can look up from the Earthen Peak and there's no lava castle in the sky. Which is worse?
>Until you get someone else who claims that they can corroborate the measurement, with a value that looks right from THEIR perspective
Wouldn't they be using the same frame of reference, under very specific conditions?
that only holds if we assume that the perceive unconsciously has some sort of ability to steer their perceived existence in a manner that's convenient for them
>this corroboration is worthless because the corroborator is a product of my existence, therefore it's acting to agree with me
can you show me the method by which I use this technique to eliminate my student loans?
Having tons of humanity or Abyss pumped into you doesn't mean you had to be a human to begin with.
Then again, it doesn't really matter whether or not Oolacile residents were human, because excess humanity would've fucked up them regardless.
>the Soul is the source of all life, what distinguishes the humanity that we carry within ourselves -- humanity
>Perhaps human souls, because of their humanity, produce sorceries with a more tangible presence. -- dark orb
Having humanity in your soul implies humanity
you're picking it up from people they ate.
Things can pick up humanity sprites, just like you can pick up humanity sprites, but then it wouldn't be "your" humanity, like a person "has" humanity
No, he is a unique Lord to his own.
They just re-used the asset. Being human means you have a shard of the Dark Soul, not a piece of Nito's, other lord soul
no, because the phrasing
>an oolacile resident whose humanity went wild
implies possession, meaning that it was the humanity inherent to them. It didn't take the time to say
>the humanity that the resident happened to find on the ground one day
>the humanity that the resident stole off of some filthy undead human
Is this timeline roughly correct?
> Yharnam is a pretty normal place
> Willem and Bergonworth Bros find Old Blood in the Laberynth under Yharnam
> Study it and try to expand thier knowledge, decide lining your brain with eyes (and simultaneously removing your acttual eyes?) is the key to this.
> The adage "fear the Old Blood", they dont use the blood on themselves, just study it.
> They manage to turn at least one human into a Great One with Rom
> The horse-fucker Lawrence makes his own church, Blood use everywhere.
> Scrouge of the Beast appears, people turning into monsters from Blood mis-use
> The Hunt is established, various incarnations of Hunters working with the Church and being sourced from it.
> Church, lead by Choir, continues experiementing with Blood, making super human creatures
> School of Mensis has their own plan to become a Great One
>implies possession, meaning that it was the humanity inherent to them
Seems to me more like they just got an overdose of humanity and abyss, rather than that their singular humanity just "went wild", whatever the hell that means.
I'll try looking up the JP description anyway though
To me, it's more like whatever effect caused the humanity in Manus to "go wild" rebounded on any other humans in the vicinity
>what does go wild mean?
I suppose it means that for whatever reason, it suddenly exploded, in the sense that it grew overwhelmingly, absurdly powerful in a single instant
The choir was always around, it's formation marked the beginning of the Healing Church -- Laurence and his associates formed the healing church, therefore they were presumably the original Choir members who got the original audience with Abandoned Ebrietas
Yeah, I shoud have worded that better.
Exactly how long is the whole timeline though? Sometimes it sounds like the Hunt has been a tradition for hundreads of years, but Willem is still alive, so did everything happen in a few decades?
Timeline's as vaguely long as it's always been in Miyazaki's games. Most of the game implies decades, if not hundreds of years, but then you've got people like Alfred, who talks like he personally fought against the Vilebloods with Logarious, who is fucking old as shit
>I'll try looking up the JP description anyway though
Seems the English translation was pretty much as literal as it could be.
Alright, it could well be that contact with the Abyss will cause your humanity to mutate and become "wilder" (and larger?), but I can't say I like how that sounds. It would mean that just being in the Abyss makes the Dark Soul grow. Then again there are both small and big humanity sprites hanging around there so maybe that's just how it goes.
It doesn't seem to have an effect on the Chosen Undead but maybe he just wasn't there long enough or something.
>then you've got people like Alfred, who talks like he personally fought against the Vilebloods with Logarious
Nah, he just calls him his master. "In his time, Master Logarius led his executioners into Cainhurst Castle" doesn't sound like he joined the fight himself.
We do know that the Abyss is toxic, even to ordinary humans -- the Chosen Undead gets instakilled by it without Artorias' ring, and they're powerful enough of a human to claim the title Dark Lord.
My interpretation of things was that the people of Oolacile were suckered into the whole Darkness party by Kaathe, like New Londo was. They tried to revive Manus (who is either the Pygmy himself or one of his immediate descendants) in an attempt to provoke the Age of Dark into happening early. After all, if you need a Dark Lord, why not go for the original if he's right there, anyway?
They fucked up though, since the magic they needed to use in the revival involved supercharging the humanity in Manus' soul -- it created an Abyss, as intended, but also fucked with it. If we're going by what DaS2 has to say, the Abyss, and the Dark in general, is supposed to be gentle and soothing, but the one we got is corrosive and deadly as all balls.
In addition, the magic rebounded on the humans in Oolacile, and they transformed into monsters.
For a joke video, Plague's video gets enough of the essential lore components right that I would unironically recommend it to someone who hasn't played the series. How's it feeeeeeeeeeeeel Vaati~?
Also, the only thing I think that Plague gets wrong is that Artorias was stomping Darkwraiths in New Londo long before he came to Oolacile.
>In addition, the magic rebounded on the humans in Oolacile, and they transformed into monsters.
For this part, since the description on the bloated heads says "devoured by the dark of Manus" I would imagine it simply refers to the close corruptive presence of the Abyss rather than being hit by whatever magic they used specifically. Close enough the same deal though I guess.
No, stupid, "frame of reference" refers to the state of motion of the observer.
In addition, m/s is merely a unit of measurement. The speed of light is the same, whether it's being recorded as 3.0 x 10^8 m/s, 1.5 (retarded anons)/(post on /v/), or some other means. It's all just a different way of quantifying the same physical thing
Of course, this doesn't imply that Kaathe was right -- even if a "native" Abyss wouldn't instantly kill you, the Age of Dark would still be incapable of sustaining life or civilization as we know it -- there's not even a sun, it's not like you can grow food or survive by traditional means.
I imagine that everything that isn't a human would be instantly killed by the Abyss, and all humans would turn undead (since Death is a feature of the Age of Fire).
In an age that's hypothetically ruled by Humanity, I imagine that most people would degenerate fairly quickly into those giant Humanity sprites that we see in Oolacile, or into shuffling hollows. The remainder would be locked in a mad scramble for Humanity, until only the winner remains, the Dark Lord, with the finally-reassembled Dark Soul. And even they would eventually hollow out. After all, Humanity is greed, obsession, and self-destructive impulses.
You just wouldn't be getting eaten alive by the Abyss during the process, in fact, going by DaS2, I'd imagine that you'd be feeling pretty comfy, even euphoric, as it happened. They make it sound like the Dark is a drug -- self destruction, but man, what a ride down
>1. Who is th furtive pygmy?
Manus probably, if not then just some dude
>2. Why are all the most high tier gods hanging around Lordran? Why is this kingdom so special?
Because they just happened to be the ones who found the Lord Souls
>who is furtive pygmy
4th Lord, claimed the Dark Soul, split it and made a race of beings called Humans by placing a shard of the Dark Soul in them as the "core" of their souls
>why are the gods hanging around Lordran? What makes this kingdom so special?
>why are all the Greek Gods hanging around Olympus? What makes this city so special?
Yeah, and what exactly do you think Lordran is? The gods decided that they wanted to hang out together, so they built a city called Anor Londo on top of a mountain, and a kingdom named Lordran spawned around it
Youre cursed and trying to find a cure, everything else is muddled, speculative, and loose descriptions. Just remember it all revolves around trying to cure the darksign.
The PC of DS2 kinda found a cure, but its only for one person im guessing so we still have to find a way to wipe it out for good.