Now that the dust has settled which one is the better game?
I just played through both of them 100% and I gotta give the edge to SMW. Both are 10/10, no doubt, but SMW is more polished and more fun to play. And yes I found it harder. I died probably 40 times trying to get *96, while maybe 20 times total beating SMB3.
His post is way better than yours, at least he's even talking about retro games. Why not show yourself out instead?
>I just played through both of them 100%
Good for you (really.)
A- games in my book.
>SMW is more polished
It should be. Isn't that to be expected?
Now, would you say that because of the polish? What about it being on better hardware than 3, too? Or did you just enjoy the game play/design more?
They were both pretty easy.
>Now, would you say that because of the polish? What about it being on better hardware than 3, too? Or did you just enjoy the game play/design more?
Yes the polish does play a big role, along with the hardware. The sound and graphics are still amazing, and SMW has a lot of cool tricks in it like the mode 7 and digitized fade in and out. Control in SMW is also perfect. Makes it a lot less frustrating.
Mostly its the level design. There is a lot more variety in levels and the objects you can interact with. I can go on for hours on this, honestly. The levels are just much larger and there is a lot of secrets and its fun finding them, even though I got most of that out of my system when they came out.
SMB3 is amazing in that regard too. Lots of secrets and variety especially coming after SMB1 and Lost Levels, but SMW with the hidden exits, yoshi coins and the overall much larger levels make it more fun for me.
My personal opinion leans more towards SMW.
What I personally have in favor of SMW over SMB3 are the following:
- More Precise Control. I feel as though that most of my control over Mario in this game (while it is a minuscule difference) It makes me feel more in control of all my actions and I feel responsible for what I do. The controls in SMB3 felt slippery in my Opinion.
- The Level Design. I enjoyed the level design of SMW more than I did of SMB3. While SMB3 offered a greater challenge with some of it's rare occurrences of cryptic level design (the one turtle shell bit with the raccoon leaf for instance.) I feel like the levels complimented you for your actions in the game in SMW more.
- While disappointing how small the OST is for SMW I found myself enjoying the music and it getting stuck in my head a lot more than SMB3 and while that is either a mix of nostalgia or personal bias, it still effects my decision.
SMB3 is still a fantastic game, but I find myself playing SMW more for leisurely fun and to have a good time.
Sorry. I'm new here.
Yeah what I find funny is that it took me exactly 4 hours to complete both games 100%. I haven't played through them in over a decade.
Last time I did I tried to beat them fast after some practice, and this was when I played mario games more often. I beat both of them 100% back then in 2 hours and 50 minutes. Both times just a few minutes difference in time. Pretty funny.
>SMB3 is amazing in that regard too. Lots of secrets and variety especially coming after SMB1 and Lost Levels, but SMW with the hidden exits, yoshi coins and the overall much larger levels make it more fun for me.
There's a certain aspect about 1 and LL that I enjoy in its own right and which I feel is lost in other games, which is not necessarily a bad thing - I'd agree the series was refined over time; still, there was something kind of simple and succinct about 1 and LL's level layouts and general size. I like the way Mario handles in those games too. It may feel a bit "stiff" compared to later games, yet I find it suits the first 2 games nicely. The same way later games' looser control schemes synergized more with their more open-ended level design.
SMB3, because it doesn't have the broken cape.
But SMB1 is better than all of them, because it is perfectly balanced and doesn't throw ridiculous amounts of 1UPs and powerups at you.
>There's a certain aspect about 1 and LL that I enjoy in its own right and which I feel is lost in other games, which is not necessarily a bad thing - I'd agree the series was refined over time; still, there was something kind of simple and succinct about 1 and LL's level layouts and general size. I like the way Mario handles in those games too. It may feel a bit "stiff" compared to later games, yet I find it suits the first 2 games nicely. The same way later games' looser control schemes synergized more with their more open-ended level design.
I agree completely. The control while different when coming from later mario games is quick to get used to. Mario definitely has a lot of momentum in him and those games are meant to be played fast and running a lot through the levels.
>SMB3, because it doesn't have the broken cape.
Didn't think it was that broken. It's a lot fun. I like how a lot the enemies were immune to it, and how they still kept quite a few fire flowers in levels and there were many places that they were superior.
What's your problem with the cape? It's not like you have to abuse it, or pick up every 1-UP you see. If you think a game's optional powerups make it too easy, then don't use them. I really can't see how you can judge the game overall so harshly based on something like that.
Im stuck on 93, what Im missing
I can access both doors of Bowser's
I have all entrances to the star world
I've finished special zone
I've already entered the 2 levels on the canyon of the last world (ice level and the other one)
The forest of illusion layout looks like a toucan
I already have the 2 bridges before Ludwig
I have the super secret area
I have all the switches
If there's something in a game you have to deliberately ignore, that is bad design. It's bad enough having warp zones in SMB1 and SMB3, having a common powerup that trivializes a large proportion of the game is unforgivable. You will always be aware that you are not using it.
you got all the way through the special zone, right? and you got soda lake? did you find the exit in the chocolate mountain area that creates a circle that goes nowhere?
other than that, every red dot has 2 exits, yellow dots have 1.
Yes, Yes and Yes
Yeah, I just noticed that in this playthrough, missed it for 20 years
Im playing All-Stars+SMW btw
>It's bad enough having warp zones in SMB1 and SMB3
Seriously? The warp zones literally aren't something you "have to deliberately ignore" because you a choice whether you will utilize them or not. I would argue their inclusion is decidedly good game design, if for no other reason than the simple fact it puts more options at the player's disposal. Fast travel, as it were, in these games harms no one while benefiting everyone.
>having a common powerup that trivializes a large proportion of the game is unforgivable
Well, too bad. If you're so good, you shouldn't need it anyway so again, what's the problem? You can't fault a game because the company that made it was at the time marketing primarily to children and hence wisely opted to include such "safety nets" as powerups to make the difficulty more forgiving. Besides, even though SMW is relatively easy for an SNES game it is still harder than your typical modern release cape or no cape.
>You will always be aware that you are not using it.
Do a no-powerups run in both games. There are levels where you will need Super Mario, Raccoon Mario, Balloon Mario, or Starman Mario, but other than that you stay as normal small Mario. And no, no Yoshi.
Super Mario World will be challenging, while Super Mario Bros 3 will be significantly more difficult. SMB3 is particularly easy in normal play since the western version lets you safely take two hits instead of just one. You could shrug things off much more frequently, but when you do a no power-ups run, you'll find yourself having to be much more careful.
That being said, I prefer SMW, but the no power-ups challenge is much more interesting in SMB3. It's not too hard in SMW, so it can be a nice but not-to-stressful way to replay the game.
Try every 2 days.
And it's because it's one of the easiest ways to get a Mario thread going, although I agree it's pretty uncreative and boring.
At least both games are on Nintendo systems so no brand-war shitposting involved.
Super Mario Bros 3 is a varied and reasonably challenging platformer. It adds a ton of new features and aesthetic flair while also having the common decency to not hand out the more overpowered suits like candy. It builds upon the foundation of its predecessors really well.
Super Mairo World is a game about carrying keys across largely hazard-free stages. It de-emphasizes platforming in favor of exploration that was done better in the 3D games that followed it. It gives you a ton of new abilities but never asks you to master any of them. And if you do it breaks the already easy game.
I'd put SMB3 in the top half of mainline Mario games. SMW is at least bottom 3.
It's tough to draw direct comparison between the two in an objective sense because they are doing two distinct takes on platforming. SMB3 is an out and out action platformer with a good layer of exploration add on top for extra flavor. SMW is almost the reverse, the secret exits and dragon coins, place using platfroming skills for exploration as the spotlight with the action either toned down or placed in hidden levels that you get for exploring.
The enhanced flight and the spin jump's ability to open all new routes through the levels play into this. Not to say that SMB3 didn't have distinct routes you could move through by being skilled enough, but they were clearly looking to try and push this element even further in World, along with the interactivity of the levels. Being able to juggle shells with your cape, throwing things upwards and the like.
>Super Mairo World is a game about carrying keys across largely hazard-free stages. It de-emphasizes platforming in favor of exploration that was done better in the 3D games that followed it. It gives you a ton of new abilities but never asks you to master any of them. And if you do it breaks the already easy game.
I agree to a degree. Some levels are like that, but there is enough levels that are like SMB3 in platforming, and they are better and longer.
I think my choice is SMW. 3 is excellent in an obstacle-course way, but World just had an element of exploration to it too that makes it feel more complete.
I also don't like that SMB3 courses are so small, a veteran player can skip right over most of the challenges.
It's kind of interesting in SMW if your good with the cape you can fly over most courses
(this was however never a guarantee unlike how people tend to frame the "cape is over powered" argument, I know lots of people who could never quite get the timing right for it to go for the whole level and there's a Retronauts podcast on SMW where one of them mentions someone they know who never used the cape because they just couldn't get it's timing at all.)
in SMB3 the tiny courses and MArio's super long jump means you "fly" over the courses if your good even without a power up.
It really puts the "straight ahead arcade" of SMB3 vs the more "what's up in the sky? Fly through looking about" exploratory SMW in firm contrast.
Hell just look at each respective game’s flight ability. Mario 3 makes flight simple: Merely run and begin pumping the jump button to lift off and gain altitude. World puts more finesse on it, making air time less a matter of finger speed and more a matter of understanding and controlling its dynamics; unlike Mario 3’s raccoon tail, World’s cape is a passive tool. Yet in capable hands, it can take Mario anywhere.
1) The ‘Mario Madness’, as was called, was not sustained with Super Mario World as it was with Super Mario Brothers 3. Mario was increasingly becoming ‘uncool’.
2) 20 years later, people still debate whether SMW or SMB3 is better. Since SMB3 is an 8-bit game, and there is a massive difference between 8-bit and 16-bit games, this tells me that SMW was a weak 16-bit title if it can even be remotely compared to an 8-bit predecessor.
3) After SMW, competitors broke through and stole Nintendo’s 2d platformer hold. During the 8-bit generation, there were many, many clones of Super Mario Brothers. None of them could hold a candle to Miyamoto’s work. After Super Mario World, that all changed. Suddenly, Sonic the Hedgehog was the cool platform game. Even Bonk had a following. So either the competitors got extremely talented very quickly or that the Mario series weakened to such an extent where competitors could break through.
And there is an excitement knowing you cannot go back. It's the feeling that you’ve not only landed on the enemy beach, you have torched your boat. In the SMB, you could scroll only one way which is not what I’m referring to. I am referring to SMW’s allowing players to move backwards in ‘worlds’ and replay stages that have already been beat. What happens is that players return to World 1 and farm up 1-ups or power-ups. The game loses all sense of cohesion. Once you beat a stage in SMB3, you could not replay it. You also couldn’t go BACKWARDS to prior worlds. You could only go forward. This is what makes SMB3 so special is that you have to replay the game in order to replay the stage. It is why Worlds 5, 6 and 7 are special because they are harder to get, and the rare power-ups such as the Tanooki Suit or Hammer Brothers Suit are so special. If Nintendo like modern 2d Marios, every player would farm Tanooki or Hammer Brother suits in SMB3 and those stages and power-ups would lose value. Then, the entire game would lose value.
>a weak 16-bit title if it can even be remotely compared to an 8-bit predecessor.
Platform games are not very demanding of hardware. Ninja Gaiden 1 is better than any SNES platformer IMO, and that's because of the pacing and careful attention paid to enemy placement.
>Sonic was the cool platforming
>Mario was uncool
Do I need to post these 80s screenshots of usenet when people were already calling Nintendo kiddy and doomed even back then?
Mario was popular as fuck ever since the NES. I don't know what "Mario Madness" USA marketing gimmick as I don't care about the american "Sonic is COOOOOL" marketing gimmick either.
Super Mario World is still my favorite platformer of all time and this is coming from someone that
1) played Super Mario Bros. 3 as his first ever Super Mario game, so strong nostalgia there
2) had also a Sega Genesis with Sonic
3) has played countless of good platorming series and games such as Adventure Island, Bonk, late Famicom-era platformers like Kaiketsu Yanchamaru 3, Little Samson, Gimmick, etc, and all the great Konami, Capcom and Sega licensed games during 8 and 16 bit.
Super Mario World’s content entered a decline from the height of Super Mario Brothers 3. Compare the BADASS World 8 of SMB 3 with its tanks, airplanes, and boats, including dead worlds where everything is all white, giant hands reaching out to get you, of a final castle where statues of Bowser shoot terrifying lasers to Super Mario World’s final area that has more in common with Vegas with shiny lights and Bowser being a buffoon on a clown car.
I dunno, I agree world 8 of SMB3 is badass, but that doesn't make me love SMW any less.
By the way, the castle in world 5 of World had statues of bowser firing at you. And the "vegas" Bowser castle is great, especially with that rocking music and seeing bowser flying around the castle on the map was also badass, as was the clown car.
Does that seem evil to you? He is in a clown car! It is more comedic. Super Mario World never felt evil. Even Bowser’s area felt like Mushroom World’s version of Vegas with neon lights and techno music.
But Super Mario Brothers and Super Mario Brothers 3 can be experienced as Dark Fantasy if the player allows it.
In Super Mario Brothers, the premise is not much different from a RPG. The big baddie, Bowser, has taken over the world and the countryside is rampaging with monsters. Horror was a definitive experience back in 1985. Remember when you first encountered the Hammer Brothers? Or as you got close to a Bowser, the fireballs that would come at you? In the manual, the story says that Bowser turned the citizens of Mushroom World (the Toads) into blocks. This is why sometimes a mushroom would appear from some of the blocks. But what happened when you broke a brick? Was it killing a Toad? We all thought so. The game could be quite grisly when you thought of it that way.
Super Mario Brothers 3 has quite a lot in common with the RPG. It has an overhead map that is conquered by enemies. The king is always transformed. Bowser comes across as evil. The airships come across as evil. It is not Carebear fluffy. The game doesn’t fall into a comedy zone.
At least Super Mario World was real, SMB3 was a stage play confirmed by shiggy.
I like both games pretty much the same, I only like World a little bit more because of the controls/physics and the amount of secrets