I went back to play on a real genesis for the first time in like 20 years.
Damn the sound is terrible. I mean I never owned one but I played on my buddies at the time. Hours with zombies ate my neighbors.
A good revision too.
Was actually the first time I remembered something from childhood not being that terrible only to play now and it just being so inferior to the SNES.
Have any games from your childhood turned out to not be that great now that you’re an adult?
Basically everything sounds worse on the Genesis because the sound chip is inferior in every way. Yuzo Koshiro and the Sonic Team got the most out of it and whatever they worked on sounds great. I heard the two Ecco games have a good soundtrack too but I never played them.
The SNES though... I don't think I've ever played a single game on that system with shitty sound like your average Genesis title. It doesn't help that there's 93042809 revisions of the video encoder and sound amps in the Genesis and they kept getting more worse over time.
Never liked the original Sonics that much. Prefer the 3d ones on DC and GC. I love Green Hill zone. I still prefer remixes and covers of it then original hardware.
The Streets of Rage games are fun though.
Terrible at shooters so no Thunder Force for me.
As for Bloodlines it wasn't terrible but I wasn't wanting to listen to the soundtrack later either.
I wouldn't call it inferior, it's just that inexperienced sound devs didn't know how to make good instruments. Konami stuff sounds excellent, as does stuff by Hitoshi Sakimoto and many more.
There are some models of the Genesis that have worse soundchips than others in terms of build quality, though these should only bother the most anal of audio-freaks.
SNES had plenty of shitty sounding games. I would know because as a kid I didn't just play the DKCs and Marios, but all the shitty rental Blockbuster filler made by amateurs and no-name devs... like your Beavis and Buttheads, Ren and Stimpys, Flintstones... so much crap.
I don't really care about the system I play on from my childhood because they're all dank. I love that genesis controller pussy cuz of how comfortable it is.
I actually really love the Genesis' sound. It has that purely digital soundchip and has such a distinct quality to it that I really like.
There is absolute subjectivity there, but the shiny high-end that the Genesis produces is just great to me. Sounds so amazing. A guy I know has a synthesizer that has the same sound chip as the Genesis and I just love it.
Which Model Genesis were you playing on? There's about 6 hardware revisions, some have relatively bad sound.
Ideally you want a Model 1 Genesis that still has "High Definition Graphics" written on the top. The next revision dropped the high end a bit but some people think its sounds are muffled. Then there's another after that which is agreed upon in the community to have bad sound.
Then the audio chip on first run Model 2 I think is okay then another one with bad sound and the Model 3 has bad sound too as I understand it. The Nomad however, makes surprisingly decent sound.
Basically do some research to figure out whether you have a Genesis has good audio hardware or not and give it another try. You might be surprised at how good the sounds that old FM Synth can be.
>Then the audio chip on first run Model 2
The problem with the Model 2 isn't the audio chip itself, but the sound mix wiring. Not sure how Sega were able to stuff that up on their own console.
There are mods out there to correct the sound mix wiring and make Model 2 sounds as good if not better than anything else.
No, you've got that backwards. The Model 1 only outputs mono unless you use the headphone jack, while the Model 2, CDX, and Nomad all output stereo through the A/V out. However, the Model 3 only outputs mono.
>this one time, the sound engineer on the SNES fucked up
We actually have an answer, sort of.
>Fresh quote form Jonesy "SNES was sample based, not a synth. So the synth sounds were better on the Genesis. But all the samples were identical which were most of the sounds. Biggest synth sound I remember was when Jim jumps on the rocket at the end of a level"
>I don't think I've ever played a single game on that system with shitty sound like your average Genesis title
it's by no means one of the best sounding soundtracks on SNES, and some tracks were redone MUCH better on Fatal Fury Special, but FF2 on SNES sounds a lot closer to the arcade than the Genesis port (which still has nice arrangements though, but overall it sounds too chiptuny)
>Never liked the original Sonics that much. Prefer the 3d ones on DC and GC
I've been trying to come up with a response to this because I never thought I have seriously never seen someone claim this before. I've seen people love only the classic Sonic games, seen people loving all Sonic games, even seen people hate all Sonic games. Never ever have I seen someone who only liked the 3D ones. I'm sorry if this sounds like a shitpost or antagonizing because that's not what I'm going for, I'm just in amazement that I've actually seen someone have an opinion I've literally never heard of before.
WTF? Genesis has far superior bass to SNES. Check this out (real hardware recording), and be sure you have huge speakers or good headphones, because small speakers can't even play these frequencies:
What do you mean by "bass"?
SNES could do way better bass due to sampling
unless you mean synth bass as in electronic music and not the actual instrument, then yeah maybe.
That's really not impressive. SNES has so little sample memory to work with, trying to sound like real instruments is a non-starter. Even SNES is at its best doing synth sounds, and it takes a Follin brothers level genius to get it sounding close to Genesis quality:
You think Konami's Kukeiha Club work is not impressive? That's an unpopular opinion if there is one.
Anyway my point is that you won't find that kind of real bass sound in Genesis because the Genesis can't sample real instruments.
I'd rather have great synth sounds than shitty "realistic" sounds. And FM synth bass is a classic synthpop sound, so it practically counts as a real instrument anyway.
(not as extreme low frequencies as the Batman and Robin example, but you still need reasonably good speakers for this)
It's subjective. I like a lot of Genesis soundtracks too, it really depended on who was working on it, rather than the soundchip itself, we've been through this many times here on /vr/.
I really want to believe you aren't calling Goemon's music shitty.
I'm not. Composition-wise it's fine. But like so many SNES games it tries to do things the hardware can't handle.
Here's another great SNES track:
Note how the music in Kirby games has a staccato style that's very easy on the sample memory. This is playing to the strengths of the hardware.
Both the Genesis and the SNES are capable of some great music and there's no reason not ot own and love both.
I think the Goemon track I posted accomplish what it tries to do very well.
The bass sounds credible, the flutes and the shamisen, and especially the shamisen, are godly.
Yes, you can notice they're not real, but they're still appealing, like video game music, you know? Sounds like many arcade games of the time which also used sampled instruments that you could tell weren't real, but still sounded good and close to the real thing.
The tracks you've posted are also great, But I think Konami's stuff is on the same league, they were some of the best at handling the SNES sound.
Is there even a single SNES game with deep bass like this? It takes some balls producing videogame music that won't play on the average television. Hard to imagine anybody composing for a Nintendo console like this. Maybe there was an official policy against it.
Yes, yamauchi, the evil yakuza emperor (who was actually a vessel that contained 7 oni spirits within) made an official tyranic policy that said that devs couldn't drop SICK BASS on their games because Yamauchi hated skrillex.
What an asshole.
>like many arcade games of the time which also used sampled instruments
Arcade games typically used a mix of samples and FM synthesis, and they had a lot more sample memory than the SNES.
Genesis can sound close to this, SNES doesn't stand a chance.
I think both Genesis and SNES can sound close to arcade, Genesis has the FM and SNES has the sample, then it requires some good skill on the part of the sound technician to make actually good things, the chip alone in both consoles is very limited.
Anyway you are very closed in your preference for Genesis so I know I won't convince you. I just say that I enjoy both for different reasons.
Fuck you, this is personal!
Dean Evans made some really great stuff.
Or how about Evans together with Barry Leitch.
Uh, yeah I think the bass in the Goemon track sounds more real than the one in ToeJam and Earl... the TJE bass sounds FUNKY as shit, but it doesn't sound as real as the kind of samples SNES could use.
Anyway I already figured the guy was talking about bass as in electronic synth bass and not real bass guitar sound.
I don't see how SNES bass is more "real", they sound kinda hollow and fuzzy often.
I still don't think TJE's bass sounds more real than Goemon's bass.
I'm not saying Genesis suckssszzz or anything silly like that but I thought at this point it was common knowledge that Genesis is better at synthesized electronic sounds while SNES is better at sampling real instruments, neither were the absolute best and at the time there were obviously professional synthesizers and computers that could sound a lot better than the SNES or the Genesis did, but again, depending on who was working with the consoles, they could come up with really impressive stuff, in my opinion Goemon's OST is more impressive than ToeJam and Earl's, but that's just my opinion, stuff in Genesis like Thunder Force IV or SOR2 blew my mind away and it still does.
This doesn't means one is better than the other, they're just different.
Pic related. I thought that game was amazing when I was little. I dusted off the old Sega about ten years ago and eagerly popped this in, only to be incredibly disappointed. I put in Kid Chameleon and had a fucking ball though. KC is the shit.
And my opinion remains the same, I admit that the SNES clearly does some instruments better than the Genesis, but bass isn't one of them, it just lacks presence.
It depends on the kind of "bass" sound you're referring to. If it's synth, electronic bass sounds, then yeah, the Genesis' FM can do some pretty good ones.
But when it comes to bass guitar as in the physical instrument, I think SNES does a more credible job even with the low quality samples.
This one sounds like a videogame-y contrabass. I don't think I've heard anything like it on Genesis.
I don't know what you mean by "presence"; I can hear the bass in both Genesis and SNES, they just go for a different kind of bass sound.
Holy FUCK. I'd say that exceeds Genesis for sure. I had no clue the SNES could do this.
this is a fine example of genisis game music. I must say but 5 goodies and 300 badds isn't good.
The mortal kombat port I played at my cousins house was absolutely fugly and immediately sielenced any thought of getting a genesis. ever.
PS. after listening to the whole song the intro is seriously badass but it gets repetitive... Beginning half 8/10 rest 5/10
I'm the guy who was arguing with him, but man, MKII on Genesis has the best character select screen music
short loop but it never fails to get me pumped, this is also exclusive to the Genesis version.
I'm not sure tinny was the word I was looking for.
To me, the SNES sounds warm, full and soft, but the Genesis sounds cold, metallic and hollow.
When the SNES tried to ape the sound of electric guitars it didn't always sound great, but when the Genesis did it, it felt like, I don't know how to describe it, corrugated metal, tin cans, steel wires, it's the kind of imagery that the sound of the system conjures up in my mind, I can't name it.
some more side pocket because the OST is so damn underrated, and because we need more female composers
Data East port always were like this, most of them weren't great ports but the music was top fucking notch.
We should take tracks that are on both systems and compare them, like Cool Spots' Rave Dance Tune.
Or Madou Monogatari's Battle Theme
I compared the whole Cool Spot soundtrack and I think the SNES just wins for most (not all) tracks. SNES notably fails for Wall Tune/Off Da Wall with some horrible sounding brass (?) type instrument. The looped sample is so short I'm not sure what it's supposed to be.
Yeah, yeah, the more I listen to it, the more I love the tune and beat (the scratchy metallic noise of the 'instruments' themselves still grate though), like a more aggressive At Doom's Gate, gets me pumped, I assume this game has a widely regarded soundtrack? It really sounds like something as such, has there been other rendritions of it on other systems or soundfonts?
I've been looking at emulating the Genesis for a while, because I love 16-bit and it's a system I never really explored, is that a title I ought to check out?
Yes, it's a very popular soundtrack, you can find lots of cover versions on Youtube, especially of that track ("Evil Destroyer"). It's probably the best example of Genesis harsh distorted guitar sound.
>SNES MK soundtracks
Check this shit out:
>dem punchy beats
>dat sicknasty WHHHHOOOOAAEEEWWWMM at 2:01
It's deliciously dark, and it just oozes evil. Not sure why Furniss decided to remix The Tower theme for use on The Kombat Tomb, but whatever, it fits perfectly.
Here's the arcade original for comparison:
And here's the SNES version:
..I'm not even sure where to fucking begin with this one. It's just so flaccid, muffled and anemic-sounding. Not only is it drowning in reverb, but it's like whoever slapped this garbage together couldn't even bother to pick appropriate samples.
All of the SNES MKs sound like this. I don't know how anybody aside from die-hard nostalgiafaggots could like it.
I agree, SNES MK soundtracks are weak. The genesis OST were good, the only problem was that they were quite unfaithful to the arcade. Pretty weak sound effects too.
Anyway, Furniss is a beast.
>because I love 16-bit and it's a system I never really explored
What the hell? You've really only got three options when it comes to 16-bit. Are you saying you explored the TG-16 before the Genesis?
>more colors = betterer graphex
You could maybe argue that in the case of MK3, which looks a bit grainier (probably because IIRC it was ported over by Williams instead of Probe), but on the whole, the Genesis MKs are the perfect illustration of how less is actually more.
What I mean by that is that the lesser graphical and audio capabilities of the system naturally drove the port to a darker and more grimy presentation, which gelled perfectly with the Mortal Kombat premise, and the music/SFX felt so much more meaty than the SNES version.
It feels like the definitive console experience, with its own unique style, rather than a shoddy attempt to better emulate the arcade original.
And if you're still stuck in the MOAR COLORS mindset, there's always the 32X version.
I completely disagree.
Without even getting into the embarrassing neutering MK1 received on the SNES, the Genesis 6-button controller is the one true way to play MK.
It's essentially a perfected replica of the original arcade control scheme. The forward-facing button layout lets you easily do things like holding one of them down for a charge attack without it really affecting your ability to keep fighting effectively. This lets you pull off sick shit like bicycle kick combo finishers, which is something I can't even imagine comfortably doing on a SNES controller because you have to keep your index fingers on the triggers at all times.
On top of that, the controls just feel looser and more responsive on the Genesis, and that goes for all 3 MKs. Every couple of years, I start feeling like I was too harsh on the SNES ports, so I decide to give them another shot, and every time, I walk away completely underwhelmed.
>Furniss is a beast
Fuck yeah he is, nigga!
>and the music/SFX felt so much more meaty than the SNES version.
I like the Genesis but you can't be serious anon, MK1 and MK2 had terrible SFX/voices and cut content on the Genesis port, worse graphics too. Not because the Genesis is bad hardware or any meme like that, but rather Probe was a mediocre company. The later MK3 and UMK3 were much better ports.
MK2 for SNES is one of the best ports of the time.
...however, to not look like a Nintendo fanboy, i have to say that MK2 Genesis with romhacks is the shit, it's MUCH closer to the arcade than the original port (more voices, proper endings etc) and includes all the stages from the first game.
The genesis sound is great when used right, but you're right. There's a ton more bad uses than good, while the SNES generally had better music.But whenever the Genesis had great music, I'd say it sounds better than most SNES titles.
An excellent example is the Bloodlines version of Theme of Simon, it's probably the most "Castelvania-y" spooky sounding theme of them all.
32x port is kinda lazy, it still has tons of dithering which is embarrassing, same music, still missing content/voices etc. Like i said, Probe wasn't a great company, Sculpture could have done an almost perfect port on the 32x.
I think it all comes back to the fact that the Genesis sound chip is, at its core, a synthesizer. You have to really know what the fuck you're doing, which most of the time involved writing your own custom sound drivers, like Furniss and the Technosoft crew did. If you're too lazy or untalented to make the YM2612 put out anything beyond the standard GEMS screeches, it's immediately obvious.
On the other hand, the SNES gives you a huge sample library to play around with. It's a lot easier to just slap something together and have it sound relatively unoffensive. So if you're a lazy hack, you have to really fuck up with the sample selection for it to become obvious.
I've already bitched about the SNES MK soundtracks, which had all the life sucked out them, but the most atrociously bad example I can think of is the Ninja Gaiden Trilogy, which actually looks, sounds and plays worse than the original 8-bit games:
>dat muted guitar
>dat xylophone percussion dominance
>dat completely out-of-place trumpets
Absolutely disgusting. It's not just the Basilisk Minefield, either; the entire soundtrack is like this.
Oh, and it's censored:
>more colors = better graphics
I'm not talking about colours, I'm talking about how entire elements of the foreground are completely absent on Genesis for MK2. Background animations missing. No proper character endings, tons of art assets gone there.
SNES version of MK2 is a high water mark for doing ports right, the Genesis treatment by comparison is frankly embarrassing considering how fans held the Genesis' superiority for the first game for all to see. 2 is still arguably a contender for best game in the series, and for /vr/ purposes this is an almost hard fact - if you were going to pick one game in the series to be absolutely everything it could be, it would be 2 on SNES. Tobias himself said it was the better version.
>I can't even imagine comfortably doing on a SNES controller because you have to keep your index fingers on the triggers at all times.
You hold down a button, you use the other buttons. What is the issue here? Those layouts are remappable, but don't need to be since you can block with L or R. At least I don't need to get a new controller to play it, but it's not particularly shocking that you prefer what is essentially a proprietary controller - am I allowed to mention SNES had fight sticks and renders this entire point moot?
>lesser audio capabilities
True, but no excuse as to why Genesis MK2 is missing a ton of voice effects that SNES has.
>the controls just feel looser and more responsive on the Genesis
They're certainly faster than the arcade version, I'm sure some people prefer that speed. I don't.
Sorry we couldn't be friends anon, but you're right that the music was better.
>Tobias himself said it was the better version.
Could I get a sauce on that?
>Those layouts are remappable, but don't need to be since you can block with L or R
>having to remap one of the attack buttons to the shoulder
>It's not particularly shocking that you prefer what is essentially a proprietary controller.
In slavland, pirate Megadrives came with the the 6-button controllers right out of the box. I didn't see a 3-button controller until I came over to the States. And by then, it was nothing to me but amusing.
>am I allowed to mention SNES had fight sticks and renders this entire point moot?
I'm pretty sure there were arcade stick peripherals for the Genesis also. I just never found sticks particularly comfortable.
I got one when MK9 came out, after decades of playing fightans on controllers, and I gave up on trying to get used to it once I realized I have to pretty much completely rewire my muscle memory.
>Sorry we couldn't be friends anon, but you're right that the music was better.
Eh, I'll take what I can get.
You stay frosty, anon.
>complaining about "garbage outdated shit"
Is it summer already?
Is this really the calibre of post we can expect on /vr/ now? What happened?
Oh great, another one of these shitty SNES vs. Mega Drive console war threads. You can tell by the way OP wrote it that he's not interested in facts, he just wants to shit on a console he doesn't like.
Face it, both the SNES and the Genny have their strenghts and weaknesses. They're both great at different things. I personally love the Mega Drive sound.
No, we need to keep fighting over who grew up with the right consoie, we must call the other side a bunch of faggots with shit taste and we need to use every cycle of processing power, sound samples and exclusive titles as a weapon to defend our console.
>Genesis music is poor
You need to get on the FM synthesis train.
OP here. Genesis sounds like shit to me. I said nothing about the games or gameplay of those games.
My favorite of the 16 bit generation
Then you have the other Nintendo games and rpgs like FF and Chrono Triggers with their amazing sound tracks.
Genesis can't compete with the amount of amazing osts on snes.
Only the SNES, really.
I'm young, one day my big brother shows me something he's downloaded "snez", or "Super Nintendo", and holy shit, this stuff looks really good, it's like our old Nintendo but oh so much more (we didn't have a SNES growing up), really cool games, now, we had an N64, but just a few games for it, so having a large library for the SNES, for free, that was really appealing, not only could we play computer games on our computer, but also Nintendo games!
We eventually also emulated the NES, mainly to get titles we never got a chance to play before, and then the same with Gameboy.
My brother did get a Genesis emulator, but only with a few games, Shining Force and Quack Shot, terrific games, but for whatever reason, we didn't look much further than that.
I've been looking to rectify that though, so lately I have collected roms for Master System, Genesis, and the ones that looked good for 32X
Okay, most composers working on the Genesis had no fucking idea what they were doing, and on top of that the second gen models had objectively shittier sound than the first gen ones.
I was pretty surprised to find out Furniss did The Lion King too.
Sounds bloody good though, especially since the film's soundtrack is full of instruments that are as far from electronic as possible.
Well, he better be. Don't want to be a weenie now do we?
I'm too in love with FM sound. It reminds me of my childhood.
I'm so busted up about it being phased out of the Etrian Odyssey series for no discernable reason. Like, Yuzo was what got me to want to play it to begin with, I'd never played a first-person dungeon crawler before. It's not the same with the orchestral/guitar stuff in EO4.